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SecretWarrior
01-23-2008, 09:15 AM
A Letter to the First Church Ministers:
November 28, 2007

Fellow First Church ministers,

Greetings to each of you!

It has been some time since I've written to the ministers within and out of this church. You are some of the greatest treasures in God's Kingdom and your devotion to the Lord and to the lost inspire me. Thanks for continuing to preach this saving Gospel and for being the people you are.

I write to remind you of the great privilege each of us has to be used by God in the closing hours of time. The Lord of the Harvest and a great cloud of witnesses rely upon us to bring in the last day harvest. Failure is simply not an option. For such a time as this, we have been placed on this planet to serve our Lord.

Each generation faces its particular challenges. Our age, it seems, has more than its share: rootless families, dissolving marriages, eroding differences between the genders and so on. Added to this toxic cultural cocktail is the rampant increase in technology.

At the Johnson Space Center in Houston hangs a painting entitled, In One Mans Lifetime. The scene shows a family in a horse-drawn wagon. Above them in the sky are the advances in aviation, from the simple plane flown by the Wright Brothers to the current space shuttle. During the span of our own lifetimes, similar and perhaps greater advances will be made.

Technology is largely amoral. Yet, the practical effects of technology can have spiritual consequences. The many screens before uscell phone, computer, pda, iPod, television, etc.can blind us to what is truly important. To worship before the temporal altar of technology is to be blinded to what really matters in life: God, relationships, the next generation, global outreach and the divine purpose for which each of us was born.

As a holiness-loving people, our elders chose wisely to build fences against the encroachment of Hollywoods values into our homes. A prohibition was fashioned to keep our homes free of television sets. While a simple solution, it may have been less than elegant in that it inadvertently limited or silenced good teaching on spiritual values, virtues, inward purity, discipline and maturity. The prohibition, while serving a previous generation well, has grown increasingly tenuous in the face of the advancement of technology.

The UPCI has also restricted its ministers from advertising on television. In the past, permitting ministers to advertise on a prohibited medium was understandable. Yet, with the fusion of internet, cable, satellite, phone, and television taking place all around us, it becomes increasingly difficult to determine which technology is which. This was changed at the recent General Conference in Tampa, Florida. Ministers and churches are now permitted to advertise on television, but are still forbidden to have televisions in our homes.

Where does this put us? Two thoughts. First, we continue to wrestle with how to live holily in a world that has lost its moorings. Gods Word has not changed. We cannot set wicked things before our eyes regardless of their source. While we may have a few more months or years to preach against the instrument of television, we recognize this window is rapidly closing. We must teach people to live heart-first rather than head-first. Clean hearts and right spirits will be needed to control the mouse and the remote Second, it appears we are entering a time similar to the early Church. Separation, radical prayer-lives, true fellowship and love for one another, a passion for the Word, and a zeal to reach the lost will keep us during this time. A 1st Century revival awaits the 21st Century church if we can see it, claim it, and make it our own.

We cannot afford to be distracted. Satan, we know, is the lord of all distractions. He masquerades as many things and tempts us in many ways. One of his wiliest tricks is to foster spiritual pridethat we are somehow better, wiser, stronger, or holier than others.

Spiritual pride divides more believers than any other sin. In Corintha city that grows increasingly similar to our worldthe church segmented into four groups: the prayers (those who prayed the prayer of faith), the theologians (those who understood all mysteries and knowledge), the worshippers (those who spoke with tongues of men and angels), and the workers (those who gave their bodies to be burnedthink peanut brittle). The emphasis of each group was admirable, but like the Appalachian snake-handlers, each became proud and exclusive. Contending for their particular viewpoint, they became contentious. The apostle Paul would have been at home in any of the four groups: he prayed and fasted often, he wrote 13 or 14 books of the New Testament, he spoke with tongues more than anyone, and his episodes in sacrifice would leave everyone else breathless. But, Paul showed the more excellent waythe way of love. Love never fails.

Loving the brotherhood is the test of our spirituality. Can we love people with whom we have honest disagreements? Can we allow people to love us when we ourselves have been wrong in our actions, attitudes and approaches?

Im hearing of a meeting in Tulsa to form a new organizationeither a shadow organization within the UPCI or an entirely separate organization. While I am sympathetic to the goals of remaining true to our apostolic heritage and I respect each ministers right to obey the dictates of his own conscience, I choose not to participate. I simply love the men and women of the United Pentecostal Church too much. While Im certain there are exceptions, as a rule the UPCI is comprised of people who seek Christs character and His passion for lost souls. And should I ever stumble, Im confident that within this fellowship there are people who will help me to my feet. We care about one another.

Ministers, I ask you to stay true to the Lord and to each other. We will make it through this time as long as we stay together. God wants to give us a great harvest in these days.

May God bless each of you!
Ken Gurley

Steve Epley
01-23-2008, 09:23 AM
Again all these letters for so few who are suppose to leave??? I think they protest to much. Sounds like they are running scared.:jogging:

DividedThigh
01-23-2008, 09:26 AM
it makes me wonder if they feel they just cant afford to lose any, that would make sense since normal attrition is about 1 to 2 percent a year, hmmm, dt:running:

StMark
01-23-2008, 09:27 AM
Probably going to be anywhere from 200-400.
some have figured as high as 1000 or more leaving.
Not all going with Tulsa.some just going independant

StMark
01-23-2008, 09:28 AM
it makes me wonder if they feel they just cant afford to lose any, that would make sense since normal attrition is about 1 to 2 percent a year, hmmm, dt:running:

UPC may gain some PAW now that they are splitting
and perhaps some from ALJC ?

Steve Epley
01-23-2008, 09:36 AM
Probably going to be anywhere from 200-400.
some have figured as high as 1000 or more leaving.
Not all going with Tulsa.some just going independant

The majority I have spoken with who are leaving are not joining anything.

DividedThigh
01-23-2008, 09:38 AM
The majority I have spoken with who are leaving are not joining anything.

bro epley do you think some are just going to withdraw and wait to see what happens before committing, dt:running:

StMark
01-23-2008, 09:38 AM
The majority I have spoken with who are leaving are not joining anything.


name some names

George
01-23-2008, 09:55 AM
Again all these letters for so few who are suppose to leave??? I think they protest to much. Sounds like they are running scared.:jogging:

Running scared? Naw. The majority of letter writers are older men and love the ones who are leaving. They truly believe they are making a mistake and feel guilty not to let them know. Those old letter writers should be respected for signing their names. The younger generation mouths off (not in print) and then denies they said it if asked by the opposite side.

Felicity
01-23-2008, 09:58 AM
Another letter! Haha! :)

Well ...... I thought this was was very good.......... :thumbsup

"Loving the brotherhood is the test of our spirituality. Can we love people with whom we have honest disagreements? Can we allow people to love us when we ourselves have been wrong in our actions, attitudes and approaches?

I'm hearing of a meeting in Tulsa to form a new organization either a shadow organization within the UPCI or an entirely separate organization. While I am sympathetic to the goals of remaining true to our apostolic heritage and I respect each minister's right to obey the dictates of his own conscience, I choose not to participate. I simply love the men and women of the United Pentecostal Church too much.

While I'm certain there are exceptions, as a rule the UPCI is comprised of people who seek Christ's character and His passion for lost souls. And should I ever stumble, I'm confident that within this fellowship there are people who will help me to my feet. We care about one another.

Ministers, I ask you to stay true to the Lord and to each other. We will make it through this time as long as we stay together. God wants to give us a great harvest in these days."

Felicity
01-23-2008, 10:00 AM
Again all these letters for so few who are suppose to leave??? I think they protest to much. Sounds like they are running scared.:jogging:Bro. Epley and others who have made a similar point........

People take the time to write these letters primarily because they CARE! That's the bottom line in the majority of cases. The motive is good, honest and sincere.

That's what I think. Don't you?




P.S. Of course, that doesn't mean I agree with every point or statement made in every 'anti-Tulsa' letter because I do not! ;) :)

TrmptPraise
01-23-2008, 10:15 AM
Bro. Epley and others who have made a similar point........

People take the time to write these letters primarily because they CARE! That's the bottom line in the majority of cases. The motive is good, honest and sincere.

That's what I think. Don't you?




P.S. Of course, that doesn't mean I agree with every point or statement made in every letter because I do not! ;) :)

Couldn't agree more. Don't agree with everything said, but I think many have construed the intent and motives to create more division than there already is.

rgcraig
01-23-2008, 10:41 AM
Running scared? Naw. The majority of letter writers are older men and love the ones who are leaving. They truly believe they are making a mistake and feel guilty not to let them know. Those old letter writers should be respected for signing their names. The younger generation mouths off (not in print) and then denies they said it if asked by the opposite side.

I agree! It grieves them after all the years they've invested.

TrmptPraise
01-23-2008, 10:44 AM
Running scared? Naw. The majority of letter writers are older men and love the ones who are leaving. They truly believe they are making a mistake and feel guilty not to let them know. Those old letter writers should be respected for signing their names. The younger generation mouths off (not in print) and then denies they said it if asked by the opposite side.


I missed this one. This post speaks volumes.

Felicity
01-23-2008, 10:47 AM
Running scared? Naw. The majority of letter writers are older men and love the ones who are leaving. They truly believe they are making a mistake and feel guilty not to let them know. Those old letter writers should be respected for signing their names. The younger generation mouths off (not in print) and then denies they said it if asked by the opposite side.

I missed this one. This post speaks volumes.I missed that one too. :thumbsup

rgcraig
01-23-2008, 10:48 AM
Bro. Epley and others who have made a similar point........

People take the time to write these letters primarily because they CARE! That's the bottom line in the majority of cases. The motive is good, honest and sincere.

That's what I think. Don't you?




P.S. Of course, that doesn't mean I agree with every point or statement made in every 'anti-Tulsa' letter because I do not! ;) :)

Absolutely, as I agreed with George saying it before your post.

It has to hurt the older ones to see something they been in all their lives go through this.

Whole Hearted
01-23-2008, 12:48 PM
Just what we needed another letter. LOL

CC1
01-23-2008, 05:23 PM
Again all these letters for so few who are suppose to leave??? I think they protest to much. Sounds like they are running scared.:jogging:

C'mon now. This is a huge issue within these men's org. that they have spent their lives in. To expect them not to puth forth what their take is on things is a little unrealistic.

I don't think anybody is "running scared" but acknowledging that some disgruntled men are making an all out run at the ministerial membership of the UPC.

There appears to be a lot of prosletyzing going on which really disappoints me. It is one thing to leave over conscience and I have defended these men's right to do that many times on here since this all happened but they must leave with integrity and without trying to do harm to the UPC or their foundation will be flawed.

Hoovie
01-23-2008, 07:47 PM
C'mon now. This is a huge issue within these men's org. that they have spent their lives in. To expect them not to puth forth what their take is on things is a little unrealistic.

I don't think anybody is "running scared" but acknowledging that some disgruntled men are making an all out run at the ministerial membership of the UPC.

There appears to be a lot of prosletyzing going on which really disappoints me. It is one thing to leave over conscience and I have defended these men's right to do that many times on here since this all happened but they must leave with integrity and without trying to do harm to the UPC or their foundation will be flawed.

This is true CC1.

It's a "no win" deal for the leaders. If folks would not respond it would be said... "they did not even care enough to write a letter adressing our concerns".

TrmptPraise
01-23-2008, 09:49 PM
This is true CC1.

It's a "no win" deal for the leaders. If folks would not respond it would be said... "they did not even care enough to write a letter adressing our concerns".

I have made the same point, Stephen, in another thread. The same people who are dissecting and critiquing the intent and motivations of these letters, would be the same people that would declare the UPCI in a state of denial had there been silence.

Pressing-On
01-23-2008, 10:02 PM
Again all these letters for so few who are suppose to leave??? I think they protest to much. Sounds like they are running scared.:jogging:
Brother Epley,
When I was attending the Baptist Church and even as a Catholic many people didn't know the congregation in the next town, much less the country. I didn't realize that until I came into Pentecost.

In Pentecost it's like this huge family and if a few leave, we just know it and know the members involved. That's why it's a big deal for the few or many. JMHO.

Mrs. LPW
01-23-2008, 10:03 PM
I agree! It grieves them after all the years they've invested.

Agreed

Ron Turner
01-24-2008, 09:05 AM
Again all these letters for so few who are suppose to leave??? I think they protest to much. Sounds like they are running scared.:jogging:

I disagree.

These are leaders within this organization. If they didn't make a statement of some kind, folks would try to figure out why they are being silent.

I appreciate their voice and I thought the email was great.

RandyWayne
01-24-2008, 01:57 PM
Just what we needed another letter. LOL

If "I" wrote a letter, would someone start a thread on it? :)

(Granted, it would be to Best Buy for screwing up a rebate..... But still!)

TrmptPraise
01-24-2008, 02:20 PM
If "I" wrote a letter, would someone start a thread on it? :)

(Granted, it would be to Best Buy for screwing up a rebate..... But still!)

And I would stand by you 100%! :)