AMC Report Wednesday Night April 11

[CC1]

I just arrived home from Wednesday night at the AMC Conference at the Gaylord Hotel Complex in Nashville after a run through the drive in windows of McDonalds for one of the worst hamburgers I have ever eaten. Once again I am reminded why I do not eat at McDonalds except for Breakfast or the new Chicken Wrap.

First of all events at work conspired to almost make me miss tonight. Determined to go I rushed hom and changed clothes, stole the wifes Lincoln, and headed to Nashville.

My first impression was that Wholehearted really would have felt at home.

Bishop1 had kindly given me a description of what he hand his wife would be wearing and told me they would save me a seat.

I arrived about 7:35 pm. After some esteemed preacher I don't know addressed the crowd with some short remarks a preachers wife who I don't know sang two songs. She had a very good voice and the music was good.

Then the preacher for the night was introduced. He is Danny Perdew from Greeley CO. he played the guitar and sang two or three songs before preaching. He has a beautiful voice and I really enjoyed the songs he sang. I don't know if he has a music CD out but if he does and it is anywhere as good as he was live I would buy it in a flash.

The first 35-40 minutes of his sermon could have been preached at any Pentecostal church or even Christ Church Nashville (minus the screaming).

Some very good principles for preachers taken mostly from some of Paul's epistles and also from Matthew Chapter 10 where Jesus is talking to his disciples.

Then about 40 minutes into it the ultra con application of the principles set forth in the first part of the sermon burst forth starting with the typical denunciation of makeup, powder, dyed hair, wigs, jewelry, eye shadow, etc.

Sometime after this I noticed Bishop1 writing something on the back of a business card. He nudged me and showed me he had written 1:22 and then 1:45. He leaned over and whispered that so far the preacher had been preaching for an hour and twenty two minutes and had to get to one hour forty five to at least match the night before! Boy was I glad for padded chairs.

The gist of the sermon was that preachers have a high calling unto God and not man. That they should strive to please God and not man. All good ideas.

The application was that you don't compromise to make people happy, keep money people in your church, keep your wife happy, etc, etc.

Toward the end (which was pushing right at almost 2 hours preaching) he got into the specifics as he saw them and handles them in his church.

* No one in his church 18 or younger can have cell phones
* No one in his church has the internet except for one guy who has to do his
work on it as a systems manager.

He came down very hard on the internet. Talked about how it has been universally accepted in the Apostolic movement with no ban like TV.

He said do what you want but at the very least if you are going to let your people be on the internet you should give them a lot of instructions about using it.

There is a lot more but I just found out I have to get back in the car and drive five miles to take the car to my daughter to pick up my son at the airport at 12:30 am this morning.

More tomorrow!

Meeting Bishop1 and his wife was a treat. He was a true gentleman and a lot of fun to sit with.

Oh, the preacher made inuendo's about certain people with clever sayings.

Here is one "People say oh you are a bull in a china closet, well I would rather be a bull in a china closet that a velvet tongued steer in ballet slippers"

[rrford]

In other words, there were no real surprises for you. :tiphat

(Wait until they realize you sneaked that video camera in and are going to post the preaching on YouTube. :slaphappy :happydance :slaphappy )

[CC1]

In other words, there were no real surprises for you. :tiphat

(Wait until they realize you sneaked that video camera in and are going to post the preaching on YouTube. :slaphappy :happydance :slaphappy )

rrford,

You pretty much summed it up. No video though as Bishop1 made me assume the position and patted me down for contraband.*


*Contraband at an ultra con meeting includes video cameras and any translations of the bible other than the KJV

[CC1]

At the end of service the speaker asked for young preachers / pastors who were battling things in their towns, ministries, etc to come down to be prayed for by the committee of elders.

While this was going on I left since it was about 10:20 pm and the walk to the parking lot there is a journey all in itself.

Because I left before service was completely over I did not get to seek out Elders Epely or Groce and say hello nor did I get to have Sister Alvear pointed out to me to get to meet her as I had wished.

[Steadfast]

What!?!?!? No spitting?

I bet a few of them feel so let down with poor Bro. Perdew.

For what it's worth, I'm proud of him for restraining himself from the whole spitting thing.

:happydance

[AGAPE]

CC1.

Is not AMC a PREACHERS ONLY meeting??????????????

If so, HOW DID YOU GET IN??????

[COOPER]

* No one in his church 18 or younger can have cell phones
* No one in his church has the internet except for one guy who has to do his
work on it as a systems manager.

!?

[rrford]

!?

Coop,

And can you imagine....
as preposterous as it sounds....
as hard as it is to believe...
As difficult as it is to comprehend...
And as strange as it is to receive
as unimagineable as unimagineable can be....
and lastly as incredible as it is.......













This guy isn't even UPC!!!!!! :slaphappy

[RevDWW]

Coop,

And can you imagine....
as preposterous as it sounds....
as hard as it is to believe...
As difficult as it is to comprehend...
And as strange as it is to receive
as unimagineable as unimagineable can be....
and lastly as incredible as it is.......












This guy isn't even UPC!!!!!! :slaphappy

Now that there is funny!!! :slaphappy :slaphappy :slaphappy

[OGIA]

CC1,

Sounds like you should have just bought a ticket to the theatre and given us your critique of that "show". You would have had to pay more to get in, but you would have gotten home a lot earlier. :bored

[originalsecretplace]

CC1,

Sounds like you should have just bought a ticket to the theatre and given us your critique of that "show". You would have had to pay more to get in, but you would have gotten home a lot earlier. :bored

WOW!!! And they preach that TV is a time waster.... Just because they say it's a "preachers conference" doesn't make it worth the time. :winkgrin

[OGIA]

Ya' lost me.

[revrandy]

What's the deal about "keeping" Money People???

[IAintMovin]

What's the deal about "keeping" Money People???
I was not there Randy, but I took that to mean dont give in on the things that you stand for just to keep someone who puts a lot of money into the church.... I could be wrong, but that is how I took it.

[freeatlast]

I was not there Randy, but I took that to mean dont give in on the things that you stand for just to keep someone who puts a lot of money into the church.... I could be wrong, but that is how I took it.

MMMMMmmmmm I think you got it right,

[CC1]

I thought of a few more interesting quotes from last nights sermon by Danny Perdew. I may have a word or two off but I have tried to be as accurate as my memory allows.

In speaking about his perspective towards his saints and what it should be of preachers towards their saints;

"I don't trust my stinkin flesh so I sure aint going to trust yours!"

That was in the midst of a section of the sermon explaining why a preacher must preach so strict and keep a tight reign on things. Along that same time was these quotes;

"If you can't get that wedding ring off your wife's finger that is no excuse not to keep it out of the congregation!"

and

"If you can't keep your daughter from cutting her hair and being a hussy it doesn't mean you shouldn't keep cut hair out of the youth group"

Along this time there was also an explanation of his perspective that you kick certain people out of church (hussy was the word used again here) if they don't line up and people that say you should "love the lost" and reach out to them are fakers. If you really love the lost you don't change the church for them or weaken what you teach or require. Then the New Testament scriptures about some not receiving the gospel was delved into with his perspective being that you present the gospel (in his view this is the hardline standards laundry list) and those that accept it are meant to be saved and those that don't were not. You should not worry about those you run off as they were not meant to be saved anyway and you have done right by being so hard, you have answered to God and not man.

[CC1]

CC1.

Is not AMC a PREACHERS ONLY meeting??????????????

If so, HOW DID YOU GET IN??????

AGAPE,

You bring up a good point. I have not visited AMC any year for that reason. This year I received a PM from an Elder minister inviting me to come as his guest.

I think he knew I have been involved with ministry and that I would not come with a rebellious or disrespectful attitude or spirit about me.

I enjoyed great music and worship for the first part of the service and great Biblical principles the first 40 minutes of the sermon.

I disagree vehomently with the speakers take on the gospel message but I recognize his sincerity and that what he spoke is indeed his heart felt belief.

I knew full well what to expect at this type meeting and my expectations were met. Just as I am sure an ultra con visiting Christ Church would have certain expectations that I am sure we would meet!

[revrandy]

AGAPE,

You bring up a good point. I have not visited AMC any year for that reason. This year I received a PM from an Elder minister inviting me to come as his guest.

I think he knew I have been involved with ministry and that I would not come with a rebellious or disrespectful attitude or spirit about me.

I enjoyed great music and worship for the first part of the service and great Biblical principles the first 40 minutes of the sermon.

I disagree vehomently with the speakers take on the gospel message but I recognize his sincerity and that what he spoke is indeed his heart felt belief.

I knew full well what to expect at this type meeting and my expectations were met. Just as I am sure an ultra con visiting Christ Church would have certain expectations that I am sure we would meet!

CC1.... Was IAM... correct in his summation of "keepin" Money People??

[CC1]

I was not there Randy, but I took that to mean dont give in on the things that you stand for just to keep someone who puts a lot of money into the church.... I could be wrong, but that is how I took it.

RevRandy,

This explanation by IAintMovin is correct. He made that statement during the time he was stressing that Pastor's are answerable to God for what they preach and should not be influenced by family, church members, trying to keep the youth to stay in church, and of course to keep the saints who support the church with the most money.

His point was that if you preach it true (what he considers true) God will provide for you no matter how many people you run off or how small your church may be because of it (that is my elaboration of what he said)

[CC1]

Pastor Perdew's perspective of the relationship between pastor and saint, and his perpsective on a pastor's role in "keeping people right", etc along with the personal examples of rules / enforcement at his church made me wonder if he isn't one of those preachers who tells the saints what kind of car to buy, when to buy a house and which one, etc. He may not but he certainly seems to be of that mindset. If he is not there it would be a very small leap. Perhaps not even a leap but a step.

[revrandy]

Pastor Perdew's perspective of the relationship between pastor and saint, and his perpsective on a pastor's role in "keeping people right", etc along with the personal examples of rules / enforcement at his church made me wonder if he isn't one of those preachers who tells the saints what kind of car to buy, when to buy a house and which one, etc. He may not but he certainly seems to be of that mindset. If he is not there it would be a very small leap. Perhaps not even a leap but a step.


Was he well recieved by everybody during his message???

[rgcraig]

CC1 - was there a lot of agreeing from the ministers?

[CC1]

revrandy & rgcraig,

There were many almost universal standing ovations during the sermon. He was preaching to the choir!

This audience was the conservative of the conservatives. I am sure that one or two lost or lonely moderates probably were there but it was 99% hardcore ultra conservative old time Oneness Pentecost.

I saw no wedding rings on women though I was surprised to see the young woman sitting a couple of rows in front of me (probably early 20's) had on a very decorative watch that for all intents and purposes looked like a bracelet. I was surprised she was that brave.

[revrandy]

revrandy & rgcraig,

There were many almost universal standing ovations during the sermon. He was preaching to the choir!

This audience was the conservative of the conservatives. I am sure that one or two lost or lonely moderates probably were there but it was 99% hardcore ultra conservative old time Oneness Pentecost.

I saw no wedding rings on women though I was surprised to see the young woman sitting a couple of rows in front of me (probably early 20's) had on a very decorative watch that for all intents and purposes looked like a bracelet. I was surprised she was that brave.

How bout' Burka's???




:D

[CC1]

Someone reminded me in a PM this morning about another little zinger / personal innuendo that was delivered last night along with the first one I quoted in my initial post on this thread.

He spoke about "World Chasers" and something or other "fakers" (I didn't catch it all) in a reference to TT. That one I understood since he is outside the realm of Oneness Pentecost now. What is amazing to me is when these guys zing strong Oneness Acts 2:38 folks just because of the disagreement over the level of standards.

[CC1]

How bout' Burka's???




:D

Market potential!

[AGAPE]

AGAPE,

You bring up a good point. I have not visited AMC any year for that reason. This year I received a PM from an Elder minister inviting me to come as his guest.

I think he knew I have been involved with ministry and that I would not come with a rebellious or disrespectful attitude or spirit about me.

I enjoyed great music and worship for the first part of the service and great Biblical principles the first 40 minutes of the sermon.

I disagree vehomently with the speakers take on the gospel message but I recognize his sincerity and that what he spoke is indeed his heart felt belief.

I knew full well what to expect at this type meeting and my expectations were met. Just as I am sure an ultra con visiting Christ Church would have certain expectations that I am sure we would meet!


sorry CC1 I didnt know that you were in ministry.
my apology

[revrandy]

CC1... Was the Crowd Culturally diverse or not?

[AGAPE]

Thank God For Amc

[CC1]

sorry CC1 I didnt know that you were in ministry.
my apology

I headed up a Oneness Pentecostal's TV ministry for about ten years! I produced and directed hundreds of broadcasts includinig one year of a nationally televised program on the Inspirational Network in addition to local and regional telecasts.

I don't think that is exactly the ministry they had in mind but nevertheless.....:winkgrin

[Whole Hearted]

Man I hate I didn't get to make it this year. Maybe next year.

[CC1]

CC1... Was the Crowd Culturally diverse or not?

Like most Oneness Pentecostal churches it was pretty homogenized though I did see a handful of black ministers and their family's in the crowd.

Mostly a lot of people like myself. Very, very white and middleaged or approaching it! There was also a good number of younger preachers and wives there also though and of course a few seasoned grey heads.

There were a lot of people there. I woudl guess around 1,000.

[CC1]

Man I hate I didn't get to make it this year. Maybe next year.

When the preacher finally got on his tear about 40 minutes into the two hour sermon you were the first person I thought of !

[AGAPE]

I headed up a Oneness Pentecostal's TV ministry for about ten years! I produced and directed hundreds of broadcasts includinig one year of a nationally televised program on the Inspirational Network in addition to local and regional telecasts.

I don't think that is exactly the ministry they had in mind but nevertheless.....:winkgrin

oohhh

you were with KP right??????

I forgot about that....

seriously CC1, I have heard that Elder Perdew had a GOOD SPIRIT delivering the word of the Lord last night.
One problem with Pentecost is that we have so many cookie cutter preachers now a days. Elder Perdew is certainly NOT a cookie cutter preacher. HE probable would fit in well with Peter, Paul, James and John

[Whole Hearted]

When the preacher finally got on his tear about 40 minutes into the two hour sermon you were the first person I thought of !

Well believe me I would love to be there. I have a lot of good friend who are there now. But there was just too much going on here/ When I finish my coffee I will have to be leaving and won't be around until tomorrow night.

I love Brother Perdew and have enjoyed his preaching for many years. As you can see we are still around and there are some of us that aren't going to change for nobody.

[rgcraig]

Well believe me I would love to be there. I have a lot of good friend who are there now. But there was just too much going on here/ When I finish my coffee I will have to be leaving and won't be around until tomorrow night.

I love Brother Perdew and have enjoyed his preaching for many years. As you can see we are still around and there are some of us that aren't going to change for nobody.
And as long as that's what you feel God wants from you, that is good.

[Nahum]

Well believe me I would love to be there. I have a lot of good friend who are there now. But there was just too much going on here/ When I finish my coffee I will have to be leaving and won't be around until tomorrow night.

I love Brother Perdew and have enjoyed his preaching for many years. As you can see we are still around and there are some of us that aren't going to change for nobody.

Where do you get the idea someone wants you to change? I don't think anyone has ever made that demand. The problem is, you will not abide anyone else changing. It is you who makes unreasonable demands.

You assume that all things will remain as they are forever.

BTW, you would be a liberal there Whole Hearted. Did you hear what the brother said about internet?

[rgcraig]

Where do you get the idea someone wants you to change? I don't think anyone has ever made that demand. The problem is, you will not abide anyone else changing. It is you who makes unreasonable demands.

You assume that all things will remain as they are forever.

BTW, you would be a liberal there Whole Hearted. Did you hear what the brother said about internet?

Liberal or sinner......? :toofunny

[Whole Hearted]

Where do you get the idea someone wants you to change? I don't think anyone has ever made that demand. The problem is, you will not abide anyone else changing. It is you who makes unreasonable demands.

You assume that all things will remain as they are forever.

BTW, you would be a liberal there Whole Hearted. Did you hear what the brother said about internet?

I know many of the men there and I am even friends with a couple of the preacher thee. Not everyone feels as Brother Perdew.

There are those who want us to change, there are those in the org would like for us to change.

My whole deal is I don't want some TV watching, ring wearing, sports fan in the pulpit preaching to my people. I want a good clean man like those at the AMC to minister to us. I don't want to support those who don't live right with this church's hard earned money.

[Nahum]

I know many of the men there and I am even friends with a couple of the preacher thee. Not everyone feels as Brother Perdew.

There are those who want us to change, there are those in the org would like for us to change.

My whole deal is I don't want some TV watching, ring wearing, sports fan in the pulpit preaching to my people. I want a good clean man like those at the AMC to minister to us. I don't want to support those who don't live right with this church's hard earned money.


Maybe he doesn't want some internet addict in his pulpit either. Maybe you are not a good clean man to him. In his eyes, you are just like the rest of us libs at AFF.

You know WH, you are known by the company you keep. I realy think you are a closet liberal. That's why you love hanging around us so much.

Welcome to the dark side Bubba!

[OGIA]

Maybe he doesn't want some internet addict in his pulpit either. Maybe you are not a good clean man to him. In his eyes, you are just like the rest of us libs at AFF.

You know WH, you are known by the company you keep. I realy think you are a closet liberal. That's why you love hanging around us so much.

Welcome to the dark side Bubba!You must have missed this part of CC1's original post, PP:

He said do what you want but at the very least if you are going to let your people be on the internet you should give them a lot of instructions about using it.

I'm sure WH does instruct his congregation on internet usage.

[Trouvere]

Pastor Poster bad bad bad.

[Carpenter]

CC1, DP, does indeed have a CD and I would say it is good to average. I am surprised his wife wasn't selling them out in the foyer. I think my mom has a copy, I'll see if I can burn it for you and send DP an offering :winkgrin .

Sigh...Denny Perdew...he used to be in the UPC when he first came to CO. He didn't last long.

A friend of mine approached me one day knowing I had been part of the
A-church and had some questions for me.

He said his brother was involved in a cult in Greeley that sounded similar to the church I attend(ed). He said his brother and wife were being told...not encouraged...not to be around his family that was not in the church. He also had several other anecdotes, but you get the point.

My friend decided to visit the church and in the middle, it got so bad, DP had his 30-.06 out hammering his wife, their standards, and again...you get the point.

My friend said he got up to leave and DP was on him until he got at the back of the door, my friend turned and said, "I am going to let God be the Judge, and if I were you, I'd Watch Out!" DP told them to never come to the church again.

My friend was honestly worried and a little scared and asked me how he could get his brother out.

I suppose this was consistent with his message last night...

Greeley, CO is a college (U of Northern Colorado) cowtown where the population that knows how to read actually drops by 80% during summer and spring breaks...

[Whole Hearted]

Maybe he doesn't want some internet addict in his pulpit either. Maybe you are not a good clean man to him. In his eyes, you are just like the rest of us libs at AFF.

You know WH, you are known by the company you keep. I realy think you are a closet liberal. That's why you love hanging around us so much.

Welcome to the dark side Bubba!

Well maybe so. But the difference in me and you is I don't care. I know I would probably never preach for Danny Perdew, but so what. I have never lack for a place to preach. It don't worry me. If he doesn't fellowship me or even call me brother I won't lose no sleep I can guarantee you.

[Nahum]

Well maybe so. But the difference in me and you is I don't care. I know I would probably never preach for Danny Perdew, but so what. I have never lack for a place to preach. It don't worry me. If he doesn't fellowship me or even call me brother I won't lose no sleep I can guarantee you.

Oh I think you care deeply. I wonder if he thinks folks like you and me will be lost because we are so liberal?

[Carpenter]

Well maybe so. But the difference in me and you is I don't care. I know I would probably never preach for Danny Perdew, but so what. I have never lack for a place to preach. It don't worry me. If he doesn't fellowship me or even call me brother I won't lose no sleep I can guarantee you.

If you ever came to preach for Denny Perdew, you better know how to ride a mule...

:D

[Whole Hearted]

Oh I think you care deeply. I wonder if he thinks folks like you and me will be lost because we are so liberal?

I really don't know and really I don't care. I made up in my mind what i believed a long time ago and I won't let anyone on either side change me.

I know that there are ultra con that would think I am lost, but unlike some here, I don't care.

[Whole Hearted]

If you ever came to preach for Denny Perdew, you better know how to ride a mule...

:D

I do thank you. We had one when I was growing up. I not only know how to ride one but plow with one.

[Steadfast]

oohhh

you were with KP right??????

I forgot about that....

seriously CC1, I have heard that Elder Perdew had a GOOD SPIRIT delivering the word of the Lord last night.
One problem with Pentecost is that we have so many cookie cutter preachers now a days. Elder Perdew is certainly NOT a cookie cutter preacher. HE probable would fit in well with Peter, Paul, James and John

I'd say he's kind of like Jesus too! Oh, wait... Jesus spit on the ground... not on a Pastor's daughter.

[CC1]

I'd say he's kind of like Jesus too! Oh, wait... Jesus spit on the ground... not on a Pastor's daughter.


You lost me on this one. Did someone spit on a pastor's daughter?

[Steadfast]

Where do you get the idea someone wants you to change? I don't think anyone has ever made that demand. The problem is, you will not abide anyone else changing. It is you who makes unreasonable demands.

You assume that all things will remain as they are forever.

BTW, you would be a liberal there Whole Hearted. Did you hear what the brother said about internet?

Wow... you make a VERY valid point there, Pastor Poster.

[Whole Hearted]

I'd say he's kind of like Jesus too! Oh, wait... Jesus spit on the ground... not on a Pastor's daughter.

:slaphappy :slaphappy :slaphappy

[BHILL]

You lost me on this one. Did someone spit on a pastor's daughter?

The story I heard,was that he spit on the video camera at Bro Haymans church.Maybe he spit on the camera and it dripped on the pastors daughter:slaphappy

[Steadfast]

Maybe he doesn't want some internet addict in his pulpit either. Maybe you are not a good clean man to him. In his eyes, you are just like the rest of us libs at AFF.

You know WH, you are known by the company you keep. I realy think you are a closet liberal. That's why you love hanging around us so much.

Welcome to the dark side Bubba!


Hey, wait a minute! There are a few libs here but not all of us are libs! I'll have you know that I'm a staunch conservative... and an internet junkie whose not quite as addicted as WholeHearted!

[Whole Hearted]

Hey, wait a minute! There are a few libs here but not all of us are libs! I'll have you know that I'm a staunch conservative... and an internet junkie whose not quite as addicted as WholeHearted!


Hey wait a minute I thought we were buds.

[Carpenter]

I do thank you. We had one when I was growing up. I not only know how to ride one but plow with one.

Well, good you know how to ride, in Greeley, the land has been overplowed, over planted, and overmanaged...they don't seem to reap much. :D

[CC1]

Last night when he took the pulpit Pastor Perdew paid tribute to three men. The pastor he got in church under, D.L. Welch, Murray Burr, and Westberg from Kansas.

He said that Westberg showed that you could build a large church strong on standards, that he ran 600.

I was not aware that Kansas had any large Oneness Pentecostal churches. Does Elder Westberg's church still run that now? Who pastors it now?

[AGAPE]

Last night when he took the pulpit Pastor Perdew paid tribute to three men. The pastor he got in church under, D.L. Welch, Murray Burr, and Westberg from Kansas.

He said that Westberg showed that you could build a large church strong on standards, that he ran 600.

I was not aware that Kansas had any large Oneness Pentecostal churches. Does Elder Westberg's church still run that now? Who pastors it now?

Bro Edwin Young pastors the church and as far as I know it is still over 500.
They are independent now

[AGAPE]

Also Bro Cornwell (or cornwall not sure on spelling) pastors a good sized church

[AGAPE]

I'd say he's kind of like Jesus too! Oh, wait... Jesus spit on the ground... not on a Pastor's daughter.

Bro Steadfast,
I respect YOU and YOUR MINISTRY, but did this have to be brought back up???

[Nahum]

Bro Steadfast,
I respect YOU and YOUR MINISTRY, but did this have to be brought back up???


What happened?

[CC1]

You boys settle down now or I am going to send you to your rooms!!!

I don't know what happened but if it was a public incident I would think there is no harm in relating it. Facts are facts.

[Steadfast]

You lost me on this one. Did someone spit on a pastor's daughter?

The story I heard,was that he spit on the video camera at Bro Haymans church.Maybe he spit on the camera and it dripped on the pastors daughter:slaphappy

He pulled the whole 1 hour 45 minute thing during his 50 minute slot at Elder Haymon's Mile High Conference. Great message for the first 40 minutes (sound familiar?) and then launched into the whole holiness package... much like it seems he must have done last night. Mind you, I had no problem with that. There was the common barbs such as screaming "If you're submit to a Presbyter or organization your a 'weinie' (to which Bro. Adams from Kentucky said aloud "God bless the weinies!").

My problem came when he then ran over to the video camera who the Pastor's own precious daughter was running and screamed "And I preach against that, too!" at which time he launched a missle of spittle... which completely missed the camera and hit the daughter directly in the face. She wept as she wiped her face but kept doing as she was asked. To her credit her spirit before - and after - was pure and humble... and holier than the injustice she endured.

He then ran up on the Elder's platform and shouted at the son (who is now Pastor) and said, "Dear God, man, someday that old man's (pointing at his father) gonna die and SOMEONE has to start preaching holiness around here!" The Elder is a precious man who has preached a strong message for years. Let's just say that I wouldn't have been as gracious as the Pastors Haymon were. They just smiled in the face of their insult and, again, maintained a spirit more holy than the injustice they received.

In defense of Bro. Perdew, they said he doesn't do that kind of thing very often. I hope they are right. TWO THINGS I'm sure of:
1. I'm not sure I would have been as gracious if it was my daughter.
2. If he had 'capped' on me like that in front of my congregation my biggest challenge would have been keeping my men from dragging him out of the Church.

The Haymon family may, indeed, be more holy than I in that aspect.

Enough said.

[Nahum]

You boys settle down now or I am going to send you to your rooms!!!

I don't know what happened but if it was a public incident I would think there is no harm in relating it. Facts are facts.

I agree.

We need to hear the whole matter to be able to evaluate it in its proper context. :winkgrin

[revrandy]

He..he... Now that is a sweet spirit...

Whether it was my Daughter or Son.. I would have knocked him out in Jesus Name..

[Steadfast]

Hey wait a minute I thought we were buds.

We're on the same side, Wholehearted, I just express it a little different than you do... :winkgrin

Seems like we both are living in the 'internet' infraction according to a few of our more conservative brethren.

[Nahum]

He pulled the whole 1 hour 45 minute thing during his 50 minute slot at Elder Haymon's Mile High Conference. Great message for the first 40 minutes (sound familiar?) and then launched into the whole holiness package... much like it seems he must have done last night. Mind you, I had no problem with that. There was the common barbs such as screaming "If you're submit to a Presbyter or organization your a 'weinie' (to which Bro. Adams from Kentucky said aloud "God bless the weinies!").

My problem came when he then ran over to the video camera who the Pastor's own precious daughter was running and screamed "And I preach against that, too!" at which time he launched a missle of spittle... which completely missed the camera and hit the daughter directly in the face. She wept as she wiped her face but kept doing as she was asked. To her credit her spirit before - and after - was pure and humble... and holier than the injustice she endured.

He then ran up on the Elder's platform and shouted at the son (who is now Pastor) and said, "Dear God, man, someday that old man's (pointing at his father) gonna die and SOMEONE has to start preaching holiness around here!" The Elder is a precious man who has preached a strong message for years. Let's just say that I wouldn't have been as gracious as the Pastors Haymon were. They just smiled in the face of their insult and, again, maintained a spirit more holy than the injustice they received.

In defense of Bro. Perdew, they said he doesn't do that kind of thing very often. I hope they are right. TWO THINGS I'm sure of:
1. I'm not sure I would have been as gracious if it was my daughter.
2. If he had 'capped' on me like that in front of my congregation my biggest challenge would have been keeping my men from dragging him out of the Church.

The Haymon family may, indeed, be more holy than I in that aspect.

Enough said.

OMG!!!!!!!!
It would have been hard for me not to deck the dude!

[Nahum]

Sounds like he was showboating.

[Coonskinner]

Oh well, at least DP is one of the originals, with a distinct personality. ;)

[Nahum]

Oh well, at least DP is one of the originals, with a distinct personality. ;)

He is the spittin' image of the group he hangs with.

[revrandy]

Gives a whole new meaning.. to Not only say it..but Spray it.... :D

[Nahum]

Sounds like his aim was off in all areas that night. Maybe he didn't account for the altitude.

[Steadfast]

Bro Steadfast,
I respect YOU and YOUR MINISTRY, but did this have to be brought back up???

Sorry if it's offensive to you, AGAPE... and I seriously mean that. Being there and seeing it first hand was offensive to me.

I guess my problem is - and has always been - that I can't stand unholy actions being 'justified' by one thinking they are 'holy' enough to do it.

Again, I do sincerely regret your discomfort. I just regret his actions more.

By the way, the day you see ME spit in someone's face under the guise of holiness I would expect you to lose faith in me.

[Nahum]

Sorry if it's offensive to you, AGAPE... and I seriously mean that. Being there and seeing it first hand was offensive to me.

I guess my problem is - and has always been - that I can't stand unholy actions being 'justified' by one thinking they are 'holy' enough to do it.

Again, I do sincerely regret your discomfort. I just regret his actions more.

By the way, the day you see ME spit in someone's face under the guise of holiness I would expect you to lose faith in me.

Everybody now!

Steadfast, Steadfast, He's our man
When he spits, he spits in a can,

[rgcraig]

Sorry if it's offensive to you, AGAPE... and I seriously mean that. Being there and seeing it first hand was offensive to me.

I guess my problem is - and has always been - that I can't stand unholy actions being 'justified' by one thinking they are 'holy' enough to do it.

Again, I do sincerely regret your discomfort. I just regret his actions more.

By the way, the day you see ME spit in someone's face under the guise of holiness I would expect you to lose faith in me.

Thank you - better taken from you than one of us heathen liberals (and like Carp, I HATE that terminology)

[Steadfast]

Oh well, at least DP is one of the originals, with a distinct personality. ;)

He is the spittin' image of the group he hangs with.

Gives a whole new meaning.. to Not only say it..but Spray it.... :D

Sounds like his aim was off in all areas that night. Maybe he didn't account for the altitude.

Everybody now!

Steadfast, Steadfast, He's our man
When he spits, he spits in a can,


Calamity strikes and comedians abound!

[revrandy]

Sorry if it's offensive to you, AGAPE... and I seriously mean that. Being there and seeing it first hand was offensive to me.

I guess my problem is - and has always been - that I can't stand unholy actions being 'justified' by one thinking they are 'holy' enough to do it.

Again, I do sincerely regret your discomfort. I just regret his actions more.

By the way, the day you see ME spit in someone's face under the guise of holiness I would expect you to lose faith in me.

Steadfast.. you are right on...

If you are going to do something as distasteful as that in public atmosphere you had better expect it to be known and discussed.....

It saddens me that AMC would choose someone of this "caliber" to represent them and their "sweet" spirits...

[OGIA]

It saddens me that AMC would choose someone of this "caliber" to represent them and their "sweet" spirits...If you'd never done anything stupid and have people forgive and forget and ask you back, I'd say you have room to talk. But, I can't imagine you've not......nor have I or many here.

[BHILL]

He pulled the whole 1 hour 45 minute thing during his 50 minute slot at Elder Haymon's Mile High Conference. Great message for the first 40 minutes (sound familiar?) and then launched into the whole holiness package... much like it seems he must have done last night. Mind you, I had no problem with that. There was the common barbs such as screaming "If you're submit to a Presbyter or organization your a 'weinie' (to which Bro. Adams from Kentucky said aloud "God bless the weinies!").

My problem came when he then ran over to the video camera who the Pastor's own precious daughter was running and screamed "And I preach against that, too!" at which time he launched a missle of spittle... which completely missed the camera and hit the daughter directly in the face. She wept as she wiped her face but kept doing as she was asked. To her credit her spirit before - and after - was pure and humble... and holier than the injustice she endured.

He then ran up on the Elder's platform and shouted at the son (who is now Pastor) and said, "Dear God, man, someday that old man's (pointing at his father) gonna die and SOMEONE has to start preaching holiness around here!" The Elder is a precious man who has preached a strong message for years. Let's just say that I wouldn't have been as gracious as the Pastors Haymon were. They just smiled in the face of their insult and, again, maintained a spirit more holy than the injustice they received.

In defense of Bro. Perdew, they said he doesn't do that kind of thing very often. I hope they are right. TWO THINGS I'm sure of:
1. I'm not sure I would have been as gracious if it was my daughter.
2. If he had 'capped' on me like that in front of my congregation my biggest challenge would have been keeping my men from dragging him out of the Church.

The Haymon family may, indeed, be more holy than I in that aspect.

Enough said.

I can"t believe anyone would have a person who would do this,preach their conference.It shows a complete lack of character and no respect for the Haymons.I would never be able to listen to anything Bro Perdue says because of this incident.I'm sure it has hurt his ministry.

[OGIA]

I can"t believe anyone would have a person who would do this,preach their conference.It shows a complete lack of character and no respect for the Haymons.I would never be able to listen to anything Bro Perdue says because of this incident.I'm sure it has hurt his ministry.See my previous post.

[revrandy]

If you'd never done anything stupid and have people forgive and forget and ask you back, I'd say you have room to talk. But, I can't imagine you've not......nor have I or many here.


So after this incident he was asked back to preach??

[OGIA]

So after this incident he was asked back to preach??Didn't he preach last night at AMC?

[BHILL]

See my previous post.

Maybe I've done some stupid stuff before ,but nothing like that,and the ministry is supposed to be held to a higher standard than us regular folks.

[revrandy]

Didn't he preach last night at AMC?


So he hasn't been asked back to the Mile High Conference?? That's what I thought you were saying...

[CC1]

He pulled the whole 1 hour 45 minute thing during his 50 minute slot at Elder Haymon's Mile High Conference. Great message for the first 40 minutes (sound familiar?) and then launched into the whole holiness package... much like it seems he must have done last night. Mind you, I had no problem with that. There was the common barbs such as screaming "If you're submit to a Presbyter or organization your a 'weinie' (to which Bro. Adams from Kentucky said aloud "God bless the weinies!").

My problem came when he then ran over to the video camera who the Pastor's own precious daughter was running and screamed "And I preach against that, too!" at which time he launched a missle of spittle... which completely missed the camera and hit the daughter directly in the face. She wept as she wiped her face but kept doing as she was asked. To her credit her spirit before - and after - was pure and humble... and holier than the injustice she endured.

He then ran up on the Elder's platform and shouted at the son (who is now Pastor) and said, "Dear God, man, someday that old man's (pointing at his father) gonna die and SOMEONE has to start preaching holiness around here!" The Elder is a precious man who has preached a strong message for years. Let's just say that I wouldn't have been as gracious as the Pastors Haymon were. They just smiled in the face of their insult and, again, maintained a spirit more holy than the injustice they received.

In defense of Bro. Perdew, they said he doesn't do that kind of thing very often. I hope they are right. TWO THINGS I'm sure of:
1. I'm not sure I would have been as gracious if it was my daughter.
2. If he had 'capped' on me like that in front of my congregation my biggest challenge would have been keeping my men from dragging him out of the Church.

The Haymon family may, indeed, be more holy than I in that aspect.

Enough said.

Sounds like you must be one of those evil people Pastor Perdew spoke about last night who would "muzzle the ox". He spoke about there being very few open pulpits. That even when they supposedly were there was an undercurrent of what not to say.

(I would imagine though that if spitting on people and insulting the pastor were your idea of an "open pulpit" then you might find very few "open" after a short time!)

[CC1]

Steadfast,

The incident you witnessed and related may be why he kept saying last night that he "didn't give a rip" what people think about his preaching. If he said it once he said it a half dozen times.

[AGAPE]

Sorry if it's offensive to you, AGAPE... and I seriously mean that. Being there and seeing it first hand was offensive to me.

I guess my problem is - and has always been - that I can't stand unholy actions being 'justified' by one thinking they are 'holy' enough to do it.

Again, I do sincerely regret your discomfort. I just regret his actions more.

By the way, the day you see ME spit in someone's face under the guise of holiness I would expect you to lose faith in me.

Thanks Elder.
I would too have sent him packing, but HE SPIT AT THE VIDEO (whats a conservative doing with video anyway) and NOT at the daughter.
Still He SHOULD NOT HAVE DONE SO

[CC1]

This spitting incident with the video camera and operator brings up a question I have.

How is the branch of ultra cons who have embraced the internet for video ministry through webcasting faring with their other ultra con brethern?

Aren't there some pretty well known ultra cons doing the AGBN (or ist it ABGN)?

[Steadfast]

It saddens me that AMC would choose someone of this "caliber" to represent them and their "sweet" spirits...

If you'd never done anything stupid and have people forgive and forget and ask you back, I'd say you have room to talk. But, I can't imagine you've not......nor have I or many here.

I can"t believe anyone would have a person who would do this,preach their conference.It shows a complete lack of character and no respect for the Haymons.I would never be able to listen to anything Bro Perdue says because of this incident.I'm sure it has hurt his ministry.

My Dear Brethren,

PLEASE do not get me wrong on this subject! I can tell you that some of the finest men that walk in shoe leather are at that AMC Conference right now. Some of my very best friends are there and we have great fellowship.

RevRandy,
These men do, for the most part, have good spirits. As in every gathering there are the few that 'act up' or give it a questionable reputation.

OGIA,
We've all made mistakes. But, over the years, I've striven to make sure that mine aren't the kind that bring question to the austerity or holiness of God. I'll be the first to tell you or anybody else that DP is a preaching machine and well worth hearing... until incidents such as was mentioned takes place.

BHILL,
I'm sure he's taken some hits for it. Surprisingly, I would hear him again tonight if it was convenient for me. He's a good preacher and does say some good things.

Brethren - including my friend AGAPE - don't get me wrong. AMC seems to be a good conference and I'm POSITIVE some of the greatest men (and conservative minds) in the world are there.

You'll NEVER hear a complaint from me about holiness preaching or holiness men... as long as their spirit stays aligned with their holiness message.

[AGAPE]

This spitting incident with the video camera and operator brings up a question I have.

How is the branch of ultra cons who have embraced the internet for video ministry through webcasting faring with their other ultra con brethern?

Aren't there some pretty well known ultra cons doing the AGBN (or ist it ABGN)?

They have become the moderates.

BTW WHO is the well known ultra cons???
I know a few moderate cons doing it???

[AGAPE]

FOR THE RECORD:

STEADFAST can preach for me ANYDAY!

[freeatlast]

I can"t believe anyone would have a person who would do this,preach their conference.It shows a complete lack of character and no respect for the Haymons.I would never be able to listen to anything Bro Perdue says because of this incident.I'm sure it has hurt his ministry.

Shoot, in his circles it may have helped his ministry...they are still having him Spireach.

[OGIA]

So he hasn't been asked back to the Mile High Conference?? That's what I thought you were saying...I don't have a clue about that conference. But, apparently, any hard feelings towards him over the incident are put behind them. Who are WE to say this man didn't get counsel from the elders he's accountable to over that situation?

[revrandy]

One of the men I have met online and read his post is Bro. Groce.. and just by what he's written I can tell you he is a Great Man of God.. I don't judge all by just a few.. but when you put someone in the lime light at your Annual conference it makes me wonder..

Some of the great Ultra-Conservative men I have met online who I would love to hear preach and have the oppurtunity to meet...

Bro. Groce...
Bro. Epley...
Bro. Perry...
Bro. Fred Davis..
Bro. Riggen...

and there are some others to come.. but these men have been great of Spirit and kindness..

[Steadfast]

FOR THE RECORD:

STEADFAST can preach for me ANYDAY!

Hey, friend, I'll be in Mississippi tomorrow night if you want to make the journey! :tiphat Also, I have the Pastor from Iuka, Missisippi with me at my place right now. He drew the plans for our new building and is here to see his 'handiwork' first hand as we're about ready to start on the inside of the building now.

Going to do something unique tomorrow: preaching a Pastoral Anniversary service and have been asked to preach a specific message 'by request'. I've only done that with one particular message about music... never with a regular sermon. Should be interesting!

Hoping it's going to go well as the Pastor is a good man.

[rgcraig]

Thanks Elder.
I would too have sent him packing, but HE SPIT AT THE VIDEO (whats a conservative doing with video anyway) and NOT at the daughter.
Still He SHOULD NOT HAVE DONE SO

No matter what he was aiming at with his spit, the words were directed to her and the pastor in FRONT of everyone.

If he had a problem with them videoing the service, then he should have talked to the pastor before service about that.

[OGIA]

OGIA,
We've all made mistakes.'Nuff said. :tiphat

[CC1]

They have become the moderates.

BTW WHO is the well known ultra cons???
I know a few moderate cons doing it???

Maybe these guys were ultra con lite or moderate cons!!

I can't think of the names but aren't some part of the CA ultra con bunch?

[OGIA]

If he had a problem with them videoing the service, then he should have talked to the pastor before service about that.Maybe he didn't know beforehand? :hmmm

[CC1]

FOR THE RECORD:

STEADFAST can preach for me ANYDAY!

Aha! I notice you did not say "any night"!!!!!!!:slaphappy :toofunny

[revrandy]

This spitting incident with the video camera and operator brings up a question I have.

How is the branch of ultra cons who have embraced the internet for video ministry through webcasting faring with their other ultra con brethern?

Aren't there some pretty well known ultra cons doing the AGBN (or ist it ABGN)?

I was under the impression they NO longer consider them ULTRA-CON for their compromise of Video...

[Steadfast]

Maybe he didn't know beforehand? :hmmm

Trust me, he knew. They had been friends for years.

[Steadfast]

...ultra con lite...

:toofunny

That needs to be nationally recognized as a new division of the whole 'con / lib' argument!

[Carpenter]

No matter what he was aiming at with his spit, the words were directed to her and the pastor in FRONT of everyone.

If he had a problem with them videoing the service, then he should have talked to the pastor before service about that.

It was 100% intended for the camera and nothing else, but just as repulsive...

[Carpenter]

One of the men I have met online and read his post is Bro. Groce.. and just by what he's written I can tell you he is a Great Man of God.. I don't judge all by just a few.. but when you put someone in the lime light at your Annual conference it makes me wonder..

Some of the great Ultra-Conservative men I have met online who I would love to hear preach and have the oppurtunity to meet...

Bro. Groce...
Bro. Epley...
Bro. Perry...
Bro. Fred Davis..
Bro. Riggen...

and there are some others to come.. but these men have been great of Spirit and kindness..


Brother WHO Riggen?...

Brother Groce can preach to me any month....I mean night. :D

[Steadfast]

It was 100% intended for the camera and nothing else, but just as repulsive...

Absolutely, I was sitting just feet away and was NEVER under the impression that he was aiming for the girl. Just incredibly bad judgment no matter what the intent was.

[revrandy]

Absolutely, I was sitting just feet away and was NEVER under the impression that he was aiming for the girl. Just incredibly bad judgment no matter what the intent was.

Maybe the Lord directed it.. to teach him a lesson... :slaphappy

[tbpew]

It was 100% intended for the camera and nothing else, but just as repulsive...

...but the extreme irony would be if




.........it was FOR THE CAMERA!

[rgcraig]

Trust me, he knew. They had been friends for years.

I HAD that feeling. That is just WRONG!

I would call that grandstanding!!!

[Steadfast]

"Tired of doing without internet?
Weary of dresses without red in them?
Are you vexed at the argument against overhead projectors?
Try NEW UltraCon Light!"

It does kind of have a ring to it, doesn't it?

[CC1]

The video camera incident is the extreme version of Keith Clark's antics one year at the JCM music conference before he was the President there but was just the invited speaker.

They had contracted with Tim Newstrand to videotape it with a multi camera setup for videos. When KC took the pulpit he made a big show about demanding that the video cameras be turned off before he would preach.

Tim was being paid to do that job so he had the camerpeople lock the cameras down on medium or wide shots and walk away but he kept on videotaping from those fixed positions.

In my mind if you refuse to be videotaped you should have that worked out before you accept an invitation to speak.

[Carpenter]

Absolutely, I was sitting just feet away and was NEVER under the impression that he was aiming for the girl. Just incredibly bad judgment no matter what the intent was.

Sometimes these guys can't tell the difference between divine inspiration and and a kneejerk reaction...

I am going to have to ask Brother Haymon what the official response was... :D

[rgcraig]

"Tired of doing without internet?
Weary of dresses without red in them?
Are you vexed at the argument against overhead projectors?
Try NEW UltraCon Light!"

It does kind of have a ring to it, doesn't it?

Oh dear lord.........:ignore

[CC1]

"Tired of doing without internet?
Weary of dresses without red in them?
Are you vexed at the argument against overhead projectors?
Try NEW UltraCon Light!"

It does kind of have a ring to it, doesn't it?

ROFLMBO!!!!!!!!!!!!!:toofunny

[rgcraig]

The video camera incident is the extreme version of Keith Clark's antics one year at the JCM music conference before he was the President there but was just the invited speaker.

They had contracted with Tim Newstrand to videotape it with a multi camera setup for videos. When KC took the pulpit he made a big show about demanding that the video cameras be turned off before he would preach.

Tim was being paid to do that job so he had the camerpeople lock the cameras down on medium or wide shots and walk away but he kept on videotaping from those fixed positions.

In my mind if you refuse to be videotaped you should have that worked out before you accept an invitation to speak.
Quick thinking on Tim's part.....lol!

[Carpenter]

The video camera incident is the extreme version of Keith Clark's antics one year at the JCM music conference before he was the President there but was just the invited speaker.

They had contracted with Tim Newstrand to videotape it with a multi camera setup for videos. When KC took the pulpit he made a big show about demanding that the video cameras be turned off before he would preach.

Tim was being paid to do that job so he had the camerpeople lock the cameras down on medium or wide shots and walk away but he kept on videotaping from those fixed positions.

In my mind if you refuse to be videotaped you should have that worked out before you accept an invitation to speak.

Well, you know, the camera adds 20 pounds and 10 years and maybe he didn't want his old age to be captured in perpetuity...ya know...just in case his teeny bopper bride would happen to get her hands on the tape...

:slaphappy

[Carpenter]

"Tired of doing without internet?
Weary of dresses without red in them?
Are you vexed at the argument against overhead projectors?
Try NEW UltraCon Light!"

It does kind of have a ring to it, doesn't it?

um...they don't believe in rings. :slaphappy

[CC1]

I thought it was kind of funny that one of the 50ish preachers sitting somewhere in front of me who had been a vocal "amener" during just about all of the sermon was checking either his text messages or the internet during the altar call at the end of service. LOL!!!

I also had seen another distinguished looking preacher head out of the room toward the end of the sermon holding a lit up phone in his hand like he had just g otten an important phone call or text message.

[Steadfast]

ROFLMBO!!!!!!!!!!!!!:toofunny

I've heard that 'other' commercial for years on the radio... but I just can't remember the rest of it. Something about "All the taste; less calories" or something like that.

Maybe we could do "UltraCon Light: All the Con... just less friends"

Nah, doesn't have that ring to it.

[Sister Alvear]

May, I break in and say something?
The service was nice..the preaching good but I think people should be careful what they say in big meetings for they are preaching to other preachers and other people's saints.
This time I am home and fixing to leave I have wept to see so many preachers that run people off for certain things and doctrines and see when "things" come home they have changed.
We must be careful what we say...things have a way of coming home...
It is best to preach what we live and live what we preach...weigh our words and pray MUCH...
Just a thought. I am here but only Brother Alvear went to morning service as we are recieving calls this morning from Brazil and he left instructions for the office helpers concering our up coming regional convention the last of this month. We return next Wednesday to Brazil. Pray for us as we return to the harvest fields there. Mother Alvear

[rgcraig]

I've heard that 'other' commercial for years on the radio... but I just can't remember the rest of it. Something about "All the taste; less calories" or something like that.

Maybe we could do "UltraCon Light: All the Con... just less friends"

Nah, doesn't have that ring to it.

Ultracon Light: All the Con.....sometimes tasteless?

[Carpenter]

May, I break in and say something?
The service was nice..the preaching good but I think people should be careful what they say in big meetings for they are preaching to other preachers and other people's saints.
This time I am home and fixing to leave I have wept to see so many preachers that run people off for certain things and doctrines and see when "things" come home they have changed.
We must be careful what we say...things have a way of coming home...
It is best to preach what we live and live what we preach...weigh our words and pray MUCH...
Just a thought. I am here but only Brother Alvear went to morning service as we are recieving calls this morning from Brazil and he left instructions for the office helpers concering our up coming regional convention the last of this month. We return next Wednesday to Brazil. Pray for us as we return to the harvest fields there. Mother Alvear


Mother, this is without a doubt the most profound and compelling post in this entire thread.

I appreciate what you have said here and I agree with you 100%.

Sometimes folks like to preach over the top of even what they believe in order to get a rise out of the crowd. It seems to me it would be very very difficult for some folks to live up to the impossible bar they would set forth in their sermons.

[CC1]

Mother, this is without a doubt the most profound and compelling post in this entire thread.

I appreciate what you have said here and I agree with you 100%.

Sometimes folks like to preach over the top of even what they believe in order to get a rise out of the crowd. It seems to me it would be very very difficult for some folks to live up to the impossible bar they would set forth in their sermons.

Carp,

I don't know Pastor Perdew but i did not get the feeling he was "showboating" for the crowd. I think he is 100% sincere in his approach and methodology. I think he is horribly misguided and offensive but I do think he was sincere.

[Sister Alvear]

I think he is very sincere and agree with many things he said. I did not hear it all as I had to go to my room for a while as I was not feeeling up to par but later returned and he was ending the message. He preached with a heavy burden and I believe he believes everything he preached. It just scares me for people to make some statements.
This is an example...31 years ago I went to the doctor to have my baby and a pastor called me and told me I should have died in the faith and not leaned on the arm of man...just a few years ago his daughter had to be rushed to the hospital...of course things change...and these are very good godly folks...

I know another great godly man that made people break up their marriage for they were married before in sin and when it came home the message changed...I know one good pastor that preached so hard against Christmas then took a church that believes in it and his story changed...

Things have a way of coming home and when it hits those we love the best sometimes things change...

I knew a pastor that held a belt to his kids not to take a shot at the dentist then when his pain got so bad he went to the doctor and died in a hospital.
Things like this scare me.
Now concerning the pastor that preached last night he wept and was very sincere. I would love to sit down and just talk with him and listen to some of his experiences....He came a mighty long way from the way he talked. I am blessed to see the pits God drags people from.

Whether we admit it or not we all use internet...maybe not in our homes but the banker uses it for us to check our account, the doctors use it, everyday life calls for it...
I am not a fan of internet and am very careful at our church and in our home. BUT it is here to stay...

Cars have computers...map guides...etc...

Well, I have talked to much. I just hope and pray that I would never do anything to cause someone to fall. Pray for me if I am wrong. Mother Alvear

[Nahum]

He pulled the whole 1 hour 45 minute thing during his 50 minute slot at Elder Haymon's Mile High Conference. Great message for the first 40 minutes (sound familiar?) and then launched into the whole holiness package... much like it seems he must have done last night. Mind you, I had no problem with that. There was the common barbs such as screaming "If you're submit to a Presbyter or organization your a 'weinie' (to which Bro. Adams from Kentucky said aloud "God bless the weinies!").

My problem came when he then ran over to the video camera who the Pastor's own precious daughter was running and screamed "And I preach against that, too!" at which time he launched a missle of spittle... which completely missed the camera and hit the daughter directly in the face. She wept as she wiped her face but kept doing as she was asked. To her credit her spirit before - and after - was pure and humble... and holier than the injustice she endured.

He then ran up on the Elder's platform and shouted at the son (who is now Pastor) and said, "Dear God, man, someday that old man's (pointing at his father) gonna die and SOMEONE has to start preaching holiness around here!" The Elder is a precious man who has preached a strong message for years. Let's just say that I wouldn't have been as gracious as the Pastors Haymon were. They just smiled in the face of their insult and, again, maintained a spirit more holy than the injustice they received.

In defense of Bro. Perdew, they said he doesn't do that kind of thing very often. I hope they are right. TWO THINGS I'm sure of:
1. I'm not sure I would have been as gracious if it was my daughter.
2. If he had 'capped' on me like that in front of my congregation my biggest challenge would have been keeping my men from dragging him out of the Church.

The Haymon family may, indeed, be more holy than I in that aspect.

Enough said.

I think this man qualifies for full "freakycon" status.

AND HE'S NOT EVEN UPC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[AGAPE]

The video camera incident is the extreme version of Keith Clark's antics one year at the JCM music conference before he was the President there but was just the invited speaker.

They had contracted with Tim Newstrand to videotape it with a multi camera setup for videos. When KC took the pulpit he made a big show about demanding that the video cameras be turned off before he would preach.

Tim was being paid to do that job so he had the camerpeople lock the cameras down on medium or wide shots and walk away but he kept on videotaping from those fixed positions.

In my mind if you refuse to be videotaped you should have that worked out before you accept an invitation to speak.

I didn't know that they kept on tapping????
WOW. What you learn on AFF ( I almost typed ADD by accident)

[Nahum]

The video camera incident is the extreme version of Keith Clark's antics one year at the JCM music conference before he was the President there but was just the invited speaker.

They had contracted with Tim Newstrand to videotape it with a multi camera setup for videos. When KC took the pulpit he made a big show about demanding that the video cameras be turned off before he would preach.

Tim was being paid to do that job so he had the camerpeople lock the cameras down on medium or wide shots and walk away but he kept on videotaping from those fixed positions.

In my mind if you refuse to be videotaped you should have that worked out before you accept an invitation to speak.

Keith Clark's problems are far greater than something as silly as a video camera. Its amazing how many of these guys have huge problems.

[South of I 90]

He pulled the whole 1 hour 45 minute thing during his 50 minute slot at Elder Haymon's Mile High Conference. Great message for the first 40 minutes (sound familiar?) and then launched into the whole holiness package... much like it seems he must have done last night. Mind you, I had no problem with that. There was the common barbs such as screaming "If you're submit to a Presbyter or organization your a 'weinie' (to which Bro. Adams from Kentucky said aloud "God bless the weinies!").

My problem came when he then ran over to the video camera who the Pastor's own precious daughter was running and screamed "And I preach against that, too!" at which time he launched a missle of spittle... which completely missed the camera and hit the daughter directly in the face. She wept as she wiped her face but kept doing as she was asked. To her credit her spirit before - and after - was pure and humble... and holier than the injustice she endured.

He then ran up on the Elder's platform and shouted at the son (who is now Pastor) and said, "Dear God, man, someday that old man's (pointing at his father) gonna die and SOMEONE has to start preaching holiness around here!" The Elder is a precious man who has preached a strong message for years. Let's just say that I wouldn't have been as gracious as the Pastors Haymon were. They just smiled in the face of their insult and, again, maintained a spirit more holy than the injustice they received.

In defense of Bro. Perdew, they said he doesn't do that kind of thing very often. I hope they are right. TWO THINGS I'm sure of:
1. I'm not sure I would have been as gracious if it was my daughter.
2. If he had 'capped' on me like that in front of my congregation my biggest challenge would have been keeping my men from dragging him out of the Church.

The Haymon family may, indeed, be more holy than I in that aspect.

Enough said.

It's a shame Borat missed this masterpiece!!

[TRIPLE E]

May, I break in and say something?
The service was nice..the preaching good but I think people should be careful what they say in big meetings for they are preaching to other preachers and other people's saints.
This time I am home and fixing to leave I have wept to see so many preachers that run people off for certain things and doctrines and see when "things" come home they have changed.
We must be careful what we say...things have a way of coming home...
It is best to preach what we live and live what we preach...weigh our words and pray MUCH...
Just a thought. I am here but only Brother Alvear went to morning service as we are recieving calls this morning from Brazil and he left instructions for the office helpers concering our up coming regional convention the last of this month. We return next Wednesday to Brazil. Pray for us as we return to the harvest fields there. Mother Alvear

Sis.Alvear ,what you posted was more than a thought,it was wisdom speaking,what great advice coming from a Mother in Israel! Thank-you for breaking in to say what was on your heart.

[South of I 90]

They have become the moderates.

I wouldn't consider them moderates.

Most of the guys lined up with ABN Global are against the use of TV on all fronts!!

[OGIA]

I wouldn't consider them moderates.

Most of the guys lined up with ABN Global are against the use of TV on all fronts!!That makes them not moderates?

[revrandy]

That makes them not moderates?

As quoted before by CC1.... Ultra-Con Lite....:D which is Genius!!

[OGIA]

which is Genius!!Yeah.....right up there with Einstein.




:nah

[revrandy]

Yeah.....right up there with Einstein.




:nah

Come..Bigboy...Whatcha' GOT??? Bring It!!! :slaphappy

[OGIA]

Come..Bigboy...Whatcha' GOT??? Bring It!!! :slaphappyA Milkbone dog biscuit?

[South of I 90]

That makes them not moderates?


IMO, YES!

[OGIA]

IMO, YES!O.

[revrandy]

A Milkbone dog biscuit?

Now my Tail's a waggin'..... :happydance :happydance

[Sherri]

He pulled the whole 1 hour 45 minute thing during his 50 minute slot at Elder Haymon's Mile High Conference. Great message for the first 40 minutes (sound familiar?) and then launched into the whole holiness package... much like it seems he must have done last night. Mind you, I had no problem with that. There was the common barbs such as screaming "If you're submit to a Presbyter or organization your a 'weinie' (to which Bro. Adams from Kentucky said aloud "God bless the weinies!").

My problem came when he then ran over to the video camera who the Pastor's own precious daughter was running and screamed "And I preach against that, too!" at which time he launched a missle of spittle... which completely missed the camera and hit the daughter directly in the face. She wept as she wiped her face but kept doing as she was asked. To her credit her spirit before - and after - was pure and humble... and holier than the injustice she endured.

He then ran up on the Elder's platform and shouted at the son (who is now Pastor) and said, "Dear God, man, someday that old man's (pointing at his father) gonna die and SOMEONE has to start preaching holiness around here!" The Elder is a precious man who has preached a strong message for years. Let's just say that I wouldn't have been as gracious as the Pastors Haymon were. They just smiled in the face of their insult and, again, maintained a spirit more holy than the injustice they received.

In defense of Bro. Perdew, they said he doesn't do that kind of thing very often. I hope they are right. TWO THINGS I'm sure of:
1. I'm not sure I would have been as gracious if it was my daughter.
2. If he had 'capped' on me like that in front of my congregation my biggest challenge would have been keeping my men from dragging him out of the Church.

The Haymon family may, indeed, be more holy than I in that aspect.

Enough said.
Well, if this had happened at our church, Eddie would have sat him down in the middle of the message. Sorry, but you just don't disrespect the "set man" of the house in front of his people, and you sure don't spit on ANYONE!! This kind of stuff gives ministers a bad name. What in the world would a visitor have thought?

[Jack Shephard]

Well, if this had happened at our church, Eddie would have sat him down in the middle of the message. Sorry, but you just don't disrespect the "set man" of the house in front of his people, and you sure don't spit on ANYONE!! This kind of stuff gives ministers a bad name. What in the world would a visitor have thought?

Sherri....
The visitors would hightail it outta there and find a church that where the preacher would use his brain and his heart, not his by-laws. Let by-laws be by-laws, but let the truth be the truth. Love-vs-by-laws....the winner is Love:heart

[Sherri]

Sherri....
The visitors would hightail it outta there and find a church that where the preacher would use his brain and his heart, not his by-laws. Let by-laws be by-laws, but let the truth be the truth. Love-vs-by-laws....the winner is Love:heart
JT--where in TN are you anyway? PM me if you want.

[Thumper]

Bro Steadfast,
I respect YOU and YOUR MINISTRY, but did this have to be brought back up???

Of course this had to be brought back up. What better way to disparage a meeting you don't like. There is no other reason for bringing it up

[daddyof2]

Of course this had to be brought back up. What better way to disparage a meeting you don't like. There is no other reason for bringing it up

I am sure glad no one else disparages things they do not like. :winkgrin

[CC1]

Of course this had to be brought back up. What better way to disparage a meeting you don't like. There is no other reason for bringing it up

Thumper,

I hope you did note that it was a conservative preacher that brought that situation up on this thread, not a lib trying to bash ultra cons. I did not know it had even happened.

[Thumper]

Thumper,

I hope you did note that it was a conservative preacher that brought that situation up on this thread, not a lib trying to bash ultra cons. I did not know it had even happened.

Oh yeah I know who it was that brought it up.

*the rest of this post has been editted*

[ChTatum]

Of course this had to be brought back up. What better way to disparage a meeting you don't like. There is no other reason for bringing it up

This is the one that should have been edited.....

[Thumper]

This is the one that should have been edited.....

I'm sure some would like it to be edited

[chaotic_resolve]

He pulled the whole 1 hour 45 minute thing during his 50 minute slot at Elder Haymon's Mile High Conference. Great message for the first 40 minutes (sound familiar?) and then launched into the whole holiness package... much like it seems he must have done last night. Mind you, I had no problem with that. There was the common barbs such as screaming "If you're submit to a Presbyter or organization your a 'weinie' (to which Bro. Adams from Kentucky said aloud "God bless the weinies!").

My problem came when he then ran over to the video camera who the Pastor's own precious daughter was running and screamed "And I preach against that, too!" at which time he launched a missle of spittle... which completely missed the camera and hit the daughter directly in the face. She wept as she wiped her face but kept doing as she was asked. To her credit her spirit before - and after - was pure and humble... and holier than the injustice she endured.

He then ran up on the Elder's platform and shouted at the son (who is now Pastor) and said, "Dear God, man, someday that old man's (pointing at his father) gonna die and SOMEONE has to start preaching holiness around here!" The Elder is a precious man who has preached a strong message for years. Let's just say that I wouldn't have been as gracious as the Pastors Haymon were. They just smiled in the face of their insult and, again, maintained a spirit more holy than the injustice they received.

In defense of Bro. Perdew, they said he doesn't do that kind of thing very often. I hope they are right. TWO THINGS I'm sure of:
1. I'm not sure I would have been as gracious if it was my daughter.
2. If he had 'capped' on me like that in front of my congregation my biggest challenge would have been keeping my men from dragging him out of the Church.

The Haymon family may, indeed, be more holy than I in that aspect.

Enough said.

This "preacher" would have been horse-collared, hog-tied and tossed out the front door if he would have done this at my fathers church. He showed a total lack of respect and I'm surprised he's still allowed behind a pulpit.

That said, if he apologized and made things right, and the people know what to expect -- by all means let him preach. Just warn the people ahead of time to wear raincoats and bring umbrellas. :grampa

[Theresa]

I'm sure some would like it to be edited

*delete*


we'll just leave this alone....

I re-read the thread and I have no right saying who did what for what reason..and you are entitled to your opinion.

I'll respect that and go back to the shoe thread :D

[Thumper]

Yes it was a very sweet spirit that brought up an unrelated incident on a thread about an ongoing meeting

:)

[rgcraig]

Yes it was a very sweet spirit that brought up an unrelated incident on a thread about an ongoing meeting

:)Same speaker seems pretty related to me. :tiphat

[Theresa]

Yes it was a very sweet spirit that brought up an unrelated incident on a thread about an ongoing meeting

:)

see above modifed post..

:D

[Thumper]

Hi Josh,

I see you lurking down there.

[BringItOn]

He pulled the whole 1 hour 45 minute thing during his 50 minute slot at Elder Haymon's Mile High Conference. Great message for the first 40 minutes (sound familiar?) and then launched into the whole holiness package... much like it seems he must have done last night. Mind you, I had no problem with that. There was the common barbs such as screaming "If you're submit to a Presbyter or organization your a 'weinie' (to which Bro. Adams from Kentucky said aloud "God bless the weinies!").

My problem came when he then ran over to the video camera who the Pastor's own precious daughter was running and screamed "And I preach against that, too!" at which time he launched a missle of spittle... which completely missed the camera and hit the daughter directly in the face. She wept as she wiped her face but kept doing as she was asked. To her credit her spirit before - and after - was pure and humble... and holier than the injustice she endured.

He then ran up on the Elder's platform and shouted at the son (who is now Pastor) and said, "Dear God, man, someday that old man's (pointing at his father) gonna die and SOMEONE has to start preaching holiness around here!" The Elder is a precious man who has preached a strong message for years. Let's just say that I wouldn't have been as gracious as the Pastors Haymon were. They just smiled in the face of their insult and, again, maintained a spirit more holy than the injustice they received.

In defense of Bro. Perdew, they said he doesn't do that kind of thing very often. I hope they are right. TWO THINGS I'm sure of:
1. I'm not sure I would have been as gracious if it was my daughter.
2. If he had 'capped' on me like that in front of my congregation my biggest challenge would have been keeping my men from dragging him out of the Church.

The Haymon family may, indeed, be more holy than I in that aspect.

Enough said.
This and alot more is why DP will never come preach for me

[BringItOn]

The only one I would listen to for that long is Steadfast & RRFord

[CC1]

The only one I would listen to for that long is Steadfast & RRFord

Elder Groce should be in that list. Some of the best sleep you will ever get is the word on the street!:happydance *














* Disclaimer. This is a joke. I have heard that Elder Groce is an excellent teacher and having met him and spoken with him I have no doubt.

[josh]

Hi Josh,

I see you lurking down there.

Yep.

I'll keep my spirit right and just add a little grain of salt to this big SPITTING story.

He no more intentially spit (at camera or girl) than any other preacher intentionally SPITS on people while preaching. While looking at the camera he put his tongue between his lips and made the vibrating sound that we call a "raspberry." Any spittle was totally unintentional.

You can take offense at the gesture, but please get it right and don't call it intentional or even SPITTING.

I will also say this. Bro Steadfast, I know that Bro Haymon wouldn't allow production of the tape and has not publicly spread this story. I think it would have been best to leave this be. However, I know that DP parked at the end of your pew and said some things very directly to you...so I can see where you have a bone to pick. I do think you should have stood up to him with your opinion instead of bringing it here.

[OGIA]

Yep.

I'll keep my spirit right and just add a little grain of salt to this big SPITTING story.

He no more intentially spit (at camera or girl) than any other preacher intentionally SPITS on people while preaching. While looking at the camera he put his tongue between his lips and made the vibrating sound that we call a "raspberry." Any spittle was totally unintentional.

You can take offense at the gesture, but please get it right and don't call it intentional or even SPITTING.

I will also say this. Bro Steadfast, I know that Bro Haymon wouldn't allow production of the tape and has not publicly spread this story. I think it would have been best to leave this be. However, I know that DP parked at the end of your pew and said some things very directly to you...so I can see where you have a bone to pick. I do think you should have stood up to him with your opinion instead of bringing it here.:popcorn2

[Thumper]

Yep.

I'll keep my spirit right and just add a little grain of salt to this big SPITTING story.

He no more intentially spit (at camera or girl) than any other preacher intentionally SPITS on people while preaching. While looking at the camera he put his tongue between his lips and made the vibrating sound that we call a "raspberry." Any spittle was totally unintentional.

You can take offense at the gesture, but please get it right and don't call it intentional or even SPITTING.

I will also say this. Bro Steadfast, I know that Bro Haymon wouldn't allow production of the tape and has not publicly spread this story. I think it would have been best to leave this be. However, I know that DP parked at the end of your pew and said some things very directly to you...so I can see where you have a bone to pick. I do think you should have stood up to him with your opinion instead of bringing it here.

Thanks for this Josh.

[Thumper]

So the story takes on a very different twist now.

Sounds to me like someone got their bell wrung and didn't like it

LOL

[CC1]

Josh & Thumper,

Far be it from me to enter the fray when cons and ultra cons are assailing each other (LOL) but I have to ask if you are actually excusing the behaviour of the preacher or are you just upset that conservative dirty laundry was brought up in a mixed forum?

I am asking this especially in light of Thumper's inference that this story was posted because the preacher had offended the person posting it.

[Sister Alvear]

Frank Bartleman was one who attended the meetings at 312 Azusa Street in Los Angeles in 1906. Listen to his description of the tenor of the meetings.



“Brother Seymour generally sat behind two empty boxes, one on top of the other. He usually kept his head inside the top one during the meeting, in prayer. There was no pride there. The services ran almost continuously. Seeking souls could be found under the power almost any hour of the day or night. The place was never closed nor empty. The people came to meet God-He was always there. Hence a continuous meeting. The meeting did not depend on the human leader. God’s presence became more and more wonderful. In that old building, with its low rafters and bare floors, God broke strong men and women to pieces, and put them together again for His glory. It was a tremendous overhauling process. Pride and self-assertion, self-importance, and self-esteem could not survive there. The religious ego preached its own funeral sermon quickly.



No subjects or sermons were announced ahead of time and no special speakers for such an hour. No one knew what might be coming, what God would do. All was spontaneous, ordered by the Spirit. We wanted to hear from God, through whomever He might speak. We had no respect of persons. All were equal. No flesh might glory in His presence. He could not use the self-opinionated. Those were Holy Spirit meetings, led of the Lord. It had to start in poor surroundings to keep out the selfish human element. All came down in humility together at His feet. They all looked alike and had all things in common, in that sense at least. The rafters were low, the tall must come down. By the time they got to Azusa, they were humbled, ready for the blessing. The fodder was thus placed for the lambs, not for giraffes. All could reach it.



We were delivered right there from ecclesiastical hierarchism and abuse. We wanted God. When we first reached the meeting we avoided human contact and greeting as much as possible. We wanted to meet God first. We got our head under some bench in the corner in prayer, and met men only in the Spirit, knowing them ‘after the flesh’ no more. The meetings started themselves, spontaneously, in testimony, praise, and worship. The testimonies were never hurried by a call for ‘popcorn.’ We had no prearranged program to be jammed through on time. Our time was the Lord’s. We had real testimonies, from fresh heart-experience. Otherwise, the shorter the testimonies, the better. A dozen might be on their feet at one time, trembling under the mighty power of God. We did not have to get our cue from some leader; yet we were free from lawlessness. We were shut up to God in prayer in the meetings, our minds on Him.



All obeyed God, in meekness and humility. In honor we “preferred one another.” The Lord was liable to burst through anyone. We prayed for this continually. Someone would finally get up, anointed for the message. All seemed to recognize this and give way. It might be a child, a woman, or a man. It might be from the back seat or from the front. It made no difference. We rejoiced that God was working. No one wished to show himself. We thought only of obeying God. In fact, there was an atmosphere of God there that forbade anyone but a fool from attempting to put himself forward without the real anointing- and such did not last long. Those were truly wonderful days. I often said that I would rather live six months at that time than fifty years of ordinary life. But God is just the same today. Only we have changed.



Someone might be speaking. Suddenly the Spirit would fall upon the congregation. God Himself would give the altar call. Men would fall all over the house, like the slain in battle, or rush for the altar en masse to seek God. The scene often resembled a forest of fallen trees. Such a scene cannot be imitated. I never saw an altar call given in those early days. God Himself would call them. And the preacher knew when to quit. When He spoke, we all obeyed. It seemed a fearful thing to hinder or grieve the Spirit. The whole place was steeped in prayer. God was in His holy temple. It was for man to keep silent. The Shekinah glory rested there. In fact, some claim to have seen the glory by night over the building. I do not doubt it. I have stopped more than once within two blocks of the place and prayed for strength before I dared go on. The presence of the Lord was so real.”



This is the meeting I long for...

[Thumper]

Josh & Thumper,

Far be it from me to enter the fray when cons and ultra cons are assailing each other (LOL) but I have to ask if you are actually excusing the behaviour of the preacher and are making excuses for him or are you just upset that conservative dirty laundry was brought up in a mixed forum?

I am asking this especially in light of Thumper's inference that this story was posted because the preacher had offended the person posting it.

I would never excuse offensive behavior however, as Josh has pointed out, the story as it was told was not neccesarily how it really played out. I could care less if dirty laundry is aired in public. What I find offensive is the way steadfast trys to run down AMC by his comments.

I have no doubt that steadfast will get on here later and make all kinds of wonderful heart felt statements about his love for the brethern at AMC, how he has many friends there right now, yada yada yada... that will play great to many in the crowd here. That being said, his only purpose for bringing it up here, especially HIS version of it, is to cast a shadow on an excellent meeting of conservative apostolics. He will of course deny this but hey that pentecostal politics for ya.

[jillian]

Frank Bartleman was one who attended the meetings at 312 Azusa Street in Los Angeles in 1906. Listen to his description of the tenor of the meetings.



“Brother Seymour generally sat behind two empty boxes, one on top of the other. He usually kept his head inside the top one during the meeting, in prayer. There was no pride there. The services ran almost continuously. Seeking souls could be found under the power almost any hour of the day or night. The place was never closed nor empty. The people came to meet God-He was always there. Hence a continuous meeting. The meeting did not depend on the human leader. God’s presence became more and more wonderful. In that old building, with its low rafters and bare floors, God broke strong men and women to pieces, and put them together again for His glory. It was a tremendous overhauling process. Pride and self-assertion, self-importance, and self-esteem could not survive there. The religious ego preached its own funeral sermon quickly.



No subjects or sermons were announced ahead of time and no special speakers for such an hour. No one knew what might be coming, what God would do. All was spontaneous, ordered by the Spirit. We wanted to hear from God, through whomever He might speak. We had no respect of persons. All were equal. No flesh might glory in His presence. He could not use the self-opinionated. Those were Holy Spirit meetings, led of the Lord. It had to start in poor surroundings to keep out the selfish human element. All came down in humility together at His feet. They all looked alike and had all things in common, in that sense at least. The rafters were low, the tall must come down. By the time they got to Azusa, they were humbled, ready for the blessing. The fodder was thus placed for the lambs, not for giraffes. All could reach it.



We were delivered right there from ecclesiastical hierarchism and abuse. We wanted God. When we first reached the meeting we avoided human contact and greeting as much as possible. We wanted to meet God first. We got our head under some bench in the corner in prayer, and met men only in the Spirit, knowing them ‘after the flesh’ no more. The meetings started themselves, spontaneously, in testimony, praise, and worship. The testimonies were never hurried by a call for ‘popcorn.’ We had no prearranged program to be jammed through on time. Our time was the Lord’s. We had real testimonies, from fresh heart-experience. Otherwise, the shorter the testimonies, the better. A dozen might be on their feet at one time, trembling under the mighty power of God. We did not have to get our cue from some leader; yet we were free from lawlessness. We were shut up to God in prayer in the meetings, our minds on Him.



All obeyed God, in meekness and humility. In honor we “preferred one another.” The Lord was liable to burst through anyone. We prayed for this continually. Someone would finally get up, anointed for the message. All seemed to recognize this and give way. It might be a child, a woman, or a man. It might be from the back seat or from the front. It made no difference. We rejoiced that God was working. No one wished to show himself. We thought only of obeying God. In fact, there was an atmosphere of God there that forbade anyone but a fool from attempting to put himself forward without the real anointing- and such did not last long. Those were truly wonderful days. I often said that I would rather live six months at that time than fifty years of ordinary life. But God is just the same today. Only we have changed.



Someone might be speaking. Suddenly the Spirit would fall upon the congregation. God Himself would give the altar call. Men would fall all over the house, like the slain in battle, or rush for the altar en masse to seek God. The scene often resembled a forest of fallen trees. Such a scene cannot be imitated. I never saw an altar call given in those early days. God Himself would call them. And the preacher knew when to quit. When He spoke, we all obeyed. It seemed a fearful thing to hinder or grieve the Spirit. The whole place was steeped in prayer. God was in His holy temple. It was for man to keep silent. The Shekinah glory rested there. In fact, some claim to have seen the glory by night over the building. I do not doubt it. I have stopped more than once within two blocks of the place and prayed for strength before I dared go on. The presence of the Lord was so real.”



This is the meeting I long for...

Me too!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I need to find my book......

[Sister Alvear]

We must be consumed with God's love and HIS love does not see man made boundries.

[CC1]

I would never excuse offensive behavior however, as Josh has pointed out, the story as it was told was not neccesarily how it really played out. I could care less if dirty laundry is aired in public. What I find offensive is the way steadfast trys to run down AMC by his comments.

I have no doubt that steadfast will get on here later and make all kinds of wonderful heart felt statements about his love for the brethern at AMC, how he has many friends there right now, yada yada yada... that will play great to many in the crowd here. That being said, his only purpose for bringing it up here, especially HIS version of it, is to cast a shadow on an excellent meeting of conservative apostolics. He will of course deny this but hey that pentecostal politics for ya.

I have to tell you that this guy's behaviour seems pretty hard to defend. I am really surprised to see it being done.

All of the good intentions in the world don't mean diddily squat when it comes to excusing inexcusable behavior.

I have always found it offensive when bad things are excused because someone "has a good heart" or "had the right intentions".

The other thing I am amazed gets excused is the innuendo's and sometimes direct attacks some of these men make on other Oneness Pentecostal preachers.

Why don't some ethical men straigthen someone like this guy out and tell him he can have strong views and express them without the inexcusable behavior.

My theory is that in conservative OP circles this is almost a sport. How many people can you skewer while you are behind a pulpit? It is not very Christlike.

Last night sounded more to me more like what old timey AMF meetings were known for than the actual two nights of an AMF GC I went to three or four years ago.

[ILuvFPC]

He pulled the whole 1 hour 45 minute thing during his 50 minute slot at Elder Haymon's Mile High Conference. Great message for the first 40 minutes (sound familiar?) and then launched into the whole holiness package... much like it seems he must have done last night. Mind you, I had no problem with that. There was the common barbs such as screaming "If you're submit to a Presbyter or organization your a 'weinie' (to which Bro. Adams from Kentucky said aloud "God bless the weinies!").

My problem came when he then ran over to the video camera who the Pastor's own precious daughter was running and screamed "And I preach against that, too!" at which time he launched a missle of spittle... which completely missed the camera and hit the daughter directly in the face. She wept as she wiped her face but kept doing as she was asked. To her credit her spirit before - and after - was pure and humble... and holier than the injustice she endured.

He then ran up on the Elder's platform and shouted at the son (who is now Pastor) and said, "Dear God, man, someday that old man's (pointing at his father) gonna die and SOMEONE has to start preaching holiness around here!" The Elder is a precious man who has preached a strong message for years. Let's just say that I wouldn't have been as gracious as the Pastors Haymon were. They just smiled in the face of their insult and, again, maintained a spirit more holy than the injustice they received.

In defense of Bro. Perdew, they said he doesn't do that kind of thing very often. I hope they are right. TWO THINGS I'm sure of:
1. I'm not sure I would have been as gracious if it was my daughter.
2. If he had 'capped' on me like that in front of my congregation my biggest challenge would have been keeping my men from dragging him out of the Church.

The Haymon family may, indeed, be more holy than I in that aspect.

Enough said.


goodness gracious.. sad.. I don't think our congregation would react too well if a preacher intentionally insulted my pastor and his son..

[IBCrazier2]

Yep.

I'll keep my spirit right and just add a little grain of salt to this big SPITTING story.

He no more intentially spit (at camera or girl) than any other preacher intentionally SPITS on people while preaching. While looking at the camera he put his tongue between his lips and made the vibrating sound that we call a "raspberry." Any spittle was totally unintentional.

You can take offense at the gesture, but please get it right and don't call it intentional or even SPITTING.

I will also say this. Bro Steadfast, I know that Bro Haymon wouldn't allow production of the tape and has not publicly spread this story. I think it would have been best to leave this be. However, I know that DP parked at the end of your pew and said some things very directly to you...so I can see where you have a bone to pick. I do think you should have stood up to him with your opinion instead of bringing it here.





We used to do raspberries when I was in elementary school............................................ .........

[BHILL]

Thumper,
Several posters asked sbout the famous spitting incident,so Steadfast told us about it,since he was sitting there.If DP had been more careful with his actions and words no one would be talking(and making excuses) about his bad behavior.

[Hesetmefree238]

My problem came when he then ran over to the video camera who the Pastor's own precious daughter was running and screamed "And I preach against that, too!" at which time he launched a missle of spittle... which completely missed the camera and hit the daughter directly in the face. She wept as she wiped her face but kept doing as she was asked. To her credit her spirit before - and after - was pure and humble... and holier than the injustice she endured.

He then ran up on the Elder's platform and shouted at the son (who is now Pastor) and said, "Dear God, man, someday that old man's (pointing at his father) gonna die and SOMEONE has to start preaching holiness around here!" The Elder is a precious man who has preached a strong message for years. Let's just say that I wouldn't have been as gracious as the Pastors Haymon were. They just smiled in the face of their insult and, again, maintained a spirit more holy than the injustice they received.

In defense of Bro. Perdew, they said he doesn't do that kind of thing very often. I hope they are right. .

Isn't once enough? That's a crying shame!

[Coonskinner]

Thump and others, I need to go back and re-read the thread, but I think it was just DP that was implicated, not the whole meeting.

Which i hope to be blessed to attend one of these years, incidentally.

[CC1]

I have to tell you that this guy's behaviour seems pretty hard to defend. I am really surprised to see it being done.

All of the good intentions in the world don't mean diddily squat when it comes to excusing inexcusable behavior.

I have always found it offensive when bad things are excused because someone "has a good heart" or "had the right intentions".

The other thing I am amazed gets excused is the innuendo's and sometimes direct attacks some of these men make on other Oneness Pentecostal preachers.

Why don't some ethical men straigthen someone like this guy out and tell him he can have strong views and express them without the inexcusable behavior.

My theory is that in conservative OP circles this is almost a sport. How many people can you skewer while you are behind a pulpit? It is not very Christlike.

Last night sounded more to me more like what old timey AMF meetings were known for than the actual two nights of an AMF GC I went to three or four years ago.


Thumper,

My follow up to my post above would be that I think preachers hide behind this "open pulpit" as an excuse to engage in this kind of crazy bad behaviour.

This preacher made a big point last night of talking about how few really "open pulpits" there are. That even ones that are supposed to be many times have an unspoken understanding of limitations, etc.

I think someone needs to explain to him that an "open pulpit" does not mean a pulpit you can use to abuse and bully people, other preachers, etc. These are the kind of sincere, dedicated men that need the help of true elders to mature.

I get the feeling he thinks if he isn't crude then he isn't being right and that is just not the case.

[CC1]

Thump and others, I need to go back and re-read the thread, but I think it was just DP that was implicated, not the whole meeting.

Which i hope to be blessed to attend one of these years, incidentally.

It is only 18 pages! Put that college degree to use and do some speed reading.:happydance

[BoredOutOfMyMind]

Thump and others, I need to go back and re-read the thread, but I think it was just DP that was implicated, not the whole meeting.

Which i hope to be blessed to attend one of these years, incidentally.


Post #63 quoted in post #170......

:tiphat

[Thumper]

I have to tell you that this guy's behaviour seems pretty hard to defend. I am really surprised to see it being done.

All of the good intentions in the world don't mean diddily squat when it comes to excusing inexcusable behavior.

I have always found it offensive when bad things are excused because someone "has a good heart" or "had the right intentions".

The other thing I am amazed gets excused is the innuendo's and sometimes direct attacks some of these men make on other Oneness Pentecostal preachers.

Why don't some ethical men straigthen someone like this guy out and tell him he can have strong views and express them without the inexcusable behavior.

My theory is that in conservative OP circles this is almost a sport. How many people can you skewer while you are behind a pulpit? It is not very Christlike.

Last night sounded more to me more like what old timey AMF meetings were known for than the actual two nights of an AMF GC I went to three or four years ago.

I am not excusing anyones behavior. I am simply commenting on steadfasts desire to use this as an opportunity to run down AMC.

I wasn't in denver in 99 so I don't know what happened however, Josh was and he tells the story different.

I think is a sad commentary on a man when he would use an unfortunate incident like this as a battering ram but then again I really ought not to be that surprised.

[Thumper]

Thumper,
Several posters asked sbout the famous spitting incident,so Steadfast told us about it,since he was sitting there.If DP had been more careful with his actions and words no one would be talking(and making excuses) about his bad behavior.

Actually steadfast made a veiled reference to the incident to spark others interest then went on to tell his version of the story. He knew full well that his veiled reference would be like raw meat in a dog pen.
:)

[Thumper]

Thump and others, I need to go back and re-read the thread, but I think it was just DP that was implicated, not the whole meeting.

Which i hope to be blessed to attend one of these years, incidentally.

Coon,

Steadfast is smarter than the average national park bear. He knew full well what telling this story from the previous decade would accomplish around here notwithstanding steadfasts soon to come vehement denials.

:)

[BoredOutOfMyMind]

Actually steadfast made a veiled reference to the incident to spark others interest then went on to tell his version of the story. He knew full well that his veiled reference would be like raw meat in a dog pen.
:)

It had been quite dull here recently.

[Thumper]

Thumper,

My follow up to my post above would be that I think preachers hide behind this "open pulpit" as an excuse to engage in this kind of crazy bad behaviour.

This preacher made a big point last night of talking about how few really "open pulpits" there are. That even ones that are supposed to be many times have an unspoken understanding of limitations, etc.

I think someone needs to explain to him that an "open pulpit" does not mean a pulpit you can use to abuse and bully people, other preachers, etc. These are the kind of sincere, dedicated men that need the help of true elders to mature.

I get the feeling he thinks if he isn't crude then he isn't being right and that is just not the case.

I agree whole heartedly. The pulpit ought never be a place to bully and abuse people. I don't know DP personally, I can't speak for or against him. There is a certain well known UPC guy that does this as regular part of his schtick and people just smile and say "Oh well that's just ..."

[Coonskinner]

I am not excusing anyones behavior. I am simply commenting on steadfasts desire to use this as an opportunity to run down AMC.

I wasn't in denver in 99 so I don't know what happened however, Josh was and he tells the story different.

I think is a sad commentary on a man when he would use an unfortunate incident like this as a battering ram but then again I really ought not to be that surprised.

Thump, deciphering folks' hidden motives is a pretty chancy thing. It's hard to know if you are judging righteous judgment when you engage in that most inexact of sciences.:)

Now, Steadfast is a personal friend of mine, and I love him like a brother, so I am naturally inclined to be prejudiced on his behalf.

I wasn't in Denver that fateful day either.

I would be equally surprised and disappointed if I found out that he was using this as a sideways attack on the Nashville Meeting. He has never in all my experience with him struck me that way.

[Thumper]

Well folks this has been enlightening as usual. God bless you all I'm gonna go get ready for church. It is a night off for me tonight I've got someone else in to preach so I only have to get song service ready. Hopefully he doesn't give my daughter the raspberry or tell me I need to preach holiness or else I will get offended.

I let you all know how it goes tomorrow.

:)

[Coonskinner]

Well folks this has been enlightening as usual. God bless you all I'm gonna go get ready for church. It is a night off for me tonight I've got someone else in to preach so I only have to get song service ready. Hopefully he doesn't give my daughter the raspberry or tell me I need to preach holiness or else I will get offended.

I let you all know how it goes tomorrow.

:)

Brother, I esteem you highly.

I pray you have a great move of God tonight.

[Thumper]

Brother, I esteem you highly.

I pray you have a great move of God tonight.

Thanks Bro.

I appreciate it.

[CC1]

I agree whole heartedly. The pulpit ought never be a place to bully and abuse people. I don't know DP personally, I can't speak for or against him. There is a certain well known UPC guy that does this as regular part of his schtick and people just smile and say "Oh well that's just ..."

I don't smile and say that if they are GIB, AMF, ALJC, UPC, Global, or any other brand. Right is right and wrong is wrong.

I pray that good Elders will take some of these sincere men and give them spiritual guidance so that bravado, rudeness, and cruelty are not mistaken for rightous indignation.

[CC1]

Brother, I esteem you highly.

I pray you have a great move of God tonight.

Stop using them there fancy words like some kind of "steam" here!!!:igotit

[Coonskinner]

I agree whole heartedly. The pulpit ought never be a place to bully and abuse people. I don't know DP personally, I can't speak for or against him. There is a certain well known UPC guy that does this as regular part of his schtick and people just smile and say "Oh well that's just ..."

If you are thinking of who I am thinking of, I can't stand to listen to him most of the time.

I am thinking of a perennial favorite at BOTT.

He is rude, and often pits the pulpit against the pew. That I don't like at all.

[South of I 90]

I have to tell you that this guy's behaviour seems pretty hard to defend. I am really surprised to see it being done.

All of the good intentions in the world don't mean diddily squat when it comes to excusing inexcusable behavior.

I have always found it offensive when bad things are excused because someone "has a good heart" or "had the right intentions".

The other thing I am amazed gets excused is the innuendo's and sometimes direct attacks some of these men make on other Oneness Pentecostal preachers.

Why don't some ethical men straigthen someone like this guy out and tell him he can have strong views and express them without the inexcusable behavior.

My theory is that in conservative OP circles this is almost a sport. How many people can you skewer while you are behind a pulpit? It is not very Christlike.

Last night sounded more to me more like what old timey AMF meetings were known for than the actual two nights of an AMF GC I went to three or four years ago.


This approach didn't help Don Imus!

[Guy]

:slaphappy Actually steadfast made a veiled reference to the incident to spark others interest then went on to tell his version of the story. He knew full well that his veiled reference would be like raw meat in a dog pen.
:)

Thumper
It sounds like you may have got thumped up the side of the head one to many times.:slaphappy
Have you got something against Steadfast?
Seems like you are making a big deal defending stupidity and trying to broaden it into an attack on the entire AMC.
Just wondering, how big would the crowd be at AMC if all of the UPC guys stayed home?

[OGIA]

Sorry if it's offensive to you, AGAPE... and I seriously mean that.

The only thing missing is the big fat "BUT" after this.


"BUT...........I'm going to offend you anyway. I know you asked me politely to consider why I would do this, but I choose to disregard your feelings. I prefer to dig up old turf instead."


I find it interesting the new information that's come out this afternoon, though. Seems there always is two sides to a story. I guess they're either both wrong or someone's right.

And to accuse those who present the side of what may have actually happened with approving of wrong behavior is being guilty of exactly the same thing you accuse -- overlooking that someone may have done something (posted) in a very wrong spirit.

[Monkeyman]

I headed up a Oneness Pentecostal's TV ministry for about ten years! I produced and directed hundreds of broadcasts includinig one year of a nationally televised program on the Inspirational Network in addition to local and regional telecasts.

I don't think that is exactly the ministry they had in mind but nevertheless.....:winkgrin
North Carolina?
I didn't know this about you!
Video editing/producing is my other passion besides music ministry

[Nahum]

The only thing missing is the big fat "BUT" after this.


"BUT...........I'm going to offend you anyway. I know you asked me politely to consider why I would do this, but I choose to disregard your feelings. I prefer to dig up old turf instead."


I find it interesting the new information that's come out this afternoon, though. Seems there always is two sides to a story. I guess they're either both wrong or someone's right.

And to accuse those who present the side of what may have actually happened with approving of wrong behavior is being guilty of exactly the same thing you accuse -- overlooking that someone may have done something (posted) in a very wrong spirit.

Back off Jack!

[Monkeyman]

He..he... Now that is a sweet spirit...

Whether it was my Daughter or Son.. I would have knocked him out in Jesus Name..
Man...imagine doing that around my family? Sheesh, the messicans wouldda __________________.

Speaking of the Haymons, the other son (or is it grandson) Chad, is now Music Director for Chester Mitchell in Washington DC/Virginia. Great guy.

Their entire team is here in Fredericton for "Infusion Canada". It's a church growth conference....wow

[berkeley]

FOR THE RECORD:

STEADFAST can preach for me ANYDAY!you are a pastor?

[ILuvFPC]

I am not excusing anyones behavior. I am simply commenting on steadfasts desire to use this as an opportunity to run down AMC.

I wasn't in denver in 99 so I don't know what happened however, Josh was and he tells the story different.

I think is a sad commentary on a man when he would use an unfortunate incident like this as a battering ram but then again I really ought not to be that surprised.

I didn't get this feeling at all.. and i'm UC.. and I believe there are several ministers from our church who are at the conference.. steadfast simply stating what happened at mile high conf a few years ago.. he was NOT slamming the entire AMC for crying out loud!

[berkeley]

Y'all are nuts!

[CC1]

I just remembered that Bishop1 told me that the woman who sang before the preacher preached was the wife of an evangelist I believe named Gary Trevino. She was very good. All of the music was very good.

[Truly Blessed]

Last night when he took the pulpit Pastor Perdew paid tribute to three men. The pastor he got in church under, D.L. Welch, Murray Burr, and Westberg from Kansas.

He said that Westberg showed that you could build a large church strong on standards, that he ran 600.

I was not aware that Kansas had any large Oneness Pentecostal churches. Does Elder Westberg's church still run that now? Who pastors it now?I think it says volumes when AMC folks think 600 is a large church. This Perdew guy sounds like a Jim Jones kind of guy to me.

[rrford]

Dumb thread that borders on idiocy and uselessness in the long run. (Excepting a few posts that actually had something good to say. :tiphat )

[Truly Blessed]

Dumb thread that borders on idiocy and uselessness in the long run. (Excepting a few posts that actually had something good to say. :tiphat )I was sitting here thinking the same thing, but decided not to say it. :)

[StillStanding]

We need more GOOD preaching like this! :friend

[Steadfast]

Of course this had to be brought back up. What better way to disparage a meeting you don't like. There is no other reason for bringing it up

Hey, Thump... has NOTHING to do with not liking the meeting. If you had read on you would find that I said it was a good meeting. But, alas, you sometimes see what you want to see.

I think the meeting IS a good meeting. I would suspect it would be fair to say that it's not for everyone.

[Steadfast]

Yep.

I'll keep my spirit right and just add a little grain of salt to this big SPITTING story.

He no more intentially spit (at camera or girl) than any other preacher intentionally SPITS on people while preaching. While looking at the camera he put his tongue between his lips and made the vibrating sound that we call a "raspberry." Any spittle was totally unintentional.

You can take offense at the gesture, but please get it right and don't call it intentional or even SPITTING.

I will also say this. Bro Steadfast, I know that Bro Haymon wouldn't allow production of the tape and has not publicly spread this story. I think it would have been best to leave this be. However, I know that DP parked at the end of your pew and said some things very directly to you...so I can see where you have a bone to pick. I do think you should have stood up to him with your opinion instead of bringing it here.

Josh,

Sorry, but I was there. I saw what happened. I saw what happened after the service as well.

I understand that men make mistakes. I think it was in horrible judgment. Also, you should know that it has nothing to do with 'standing up to him'. I think you know me enough to know that 'standing up' isn't a problem with me.

Additionally, to think that I'm the cause of this 'scenario' being known is a gross misjudgment. The other preachers were getting calls within an hour of the service ending asking about the whole event. The next day I was in the airport with preachers who were getting calls left and right wanting to know if it 'happened like they said'. It was a 'shot heard round the world' before we even left the meeting.

I understand wishing it hadn't happened and wasn't known. I do, personally, want to think he learned a lot from that scenario. I hope so.

Again, I'm sorry if you think it's a personal vendetta. It's not. I just can't see acting like it didn't happen just because he's of 'our' camp.

[Steadfast]

I would never excuse offensive behavior however, as Josh has pointed out, the story as it was told was not neccesarily how it really played out. I could care less if dirty laundry is aired in public. What I find offensive is the way steadfast trys to run down AMC by his comments.

I have no doubt that steadfast will get on here later and make all kinds of wonderful heart felt statements about his love for the brethern at AMC, how he has many friends there right now, yada yada yada... that will play great to many in the crowd here. That being said, his only purpose for bringing it up here, especially HIS version of it, is to cast a shadow on an excellent meeting of conservative apostolics. He will of course deny this but hey that pentecostal politics for ya.

The only thing missing is the big fat "BUT" after this.


"BUT...........I'm going to offend you anyway. I know you asked me politely to consider why I would do this, but I choose to disregard your feelings. I prefer to dig up old turf instead."


I find it interesting the new information that's come out this afternoon, though. Seems there always is two sides to a story. I guess they're either both wrong or someone's right.

And to accuse those who present the side of what may have actually happened with approving of wrong behavior is being guilty of exactly the same thing you accuse -- overlooking that someone may have done something (posted) in a very wrong spirit.

Ahhhhh yes.... it would appear that I'm now anathema because I spoke against what I perceived as extremely unholy from an ultra-conservative preacher.

For all of my 'brutish' behaviour I have to search out where I did the real wrong:
* I didn't once speak derogatory of the AMC meeting. Rather I said from the very beginning it was a good meeting with good men.
* I didn't begin this thread nor did I intend for it to become what it has become. Rather I posted for the first time in a while and offered a joking statement... with NO ulterior motives.
* I surely didn't spit on anybody.

So now I'm 'suspect' in a wide variety of things:
* I'm 'political'. I'm not.
* I've got 'personal reasons' for my actions. He didn't really bother me.
* I'm trying to attack the meeting. I'm not and never have.
* I lied about what really happened. I didn't.

I guess just about all that is left is the famous, "You're not really a conservative anyway!" That is usually what comes next.

I love you guys anyway. Doesn't really phase me except that I find it amazing how quickly one can go from being a 'good guy' to being a 'trouble maker' just because I don't agree with what I consider unholy behaviour in the name of 'holiness'.

(Maybe I should have just spit, too! :toofunny )

[berkeley]

Steadfast,

You touched their annointed! :nah

[crakjak]

He pulled the whole 1 hour 45 minute thing during his 50 minute slot at Elder Haymon's Mile High Conference. Great message for the first 40 minutes (sound familiar?) and then launched into the whole holiness package... much like it seems he must have done last night. Mind you, I had no problem with that. There was the common barbs such as screaming "If you're submit to a Presbyter or organization your a 'weinie' (to which Bro. Adams from Kentucky said aloud "God bless the weinies!").

My problem came when he then ran over to the video camera who the Pastor's own precious daughter was running and screamed "And I preach against that, too!" at which time he launched a missle of spittle... which completely missed the camera and hit the daughter directly in the face. She wept as she wiped her face but kept doing as she was asked. To her credit her spirit before - and after - was pure and humble... and holier than the injustice she endured.

He then ran up on the Elder's platform and shouted at the son (who is now Pastor) and said, "Dear God, man, someday that old man's (pointing at his father) gonna die and SOMEONE has to start preaching holiness around here!" The Elder is a precious man who has preached a strong message for years. Let's just say that I wouldn't have been as gracious as the Pastors Haymon were. They just smiled in the face of their insult and, again, maintained a spirit more holy than the injustice they received.

In defense of Bro. Perdew, they said he doesn't do that kind of thing very often. I hope they are right. TWO THINGS I'm sure of:
1. I'm not sure I would have been as gracious if it was my daughter.
2. If he had 'capped' on me like that in front of my congregation my biggest challenge would have been keeping my men from dragging him out of the Church.

The Haymon family may, indeed, be more holy than I in that aspect.

Enough said.

Forget it SF, this man does not need any defense, he carries it with offense.

[crakjak]

Oh well, at least DP is one of the originals, with a distinct personality. ;)

The understatement of the evening, or is it morning?

[Rhymis]

some folk ain't got enough gumption to spit

[crakjak]

Sounds like you must be one of those evil people Pastor Perdew spoke about last night who would "muzzle the ox". He spoke about there being very few open pulpits. That even when they supposedly were there was an undercurrent of what not to say.

(I would imagine though that if spitting on people and insulting the pastor were your idea of an "open pulpit" then you might find very few "open" after a short time!)

Well, AMEN!:nah

[Steadfast]

some folk ain't got enough gumption to spit

:aaa

[Sister Alvear]

Tonight the preaching was very good...

[Sister Alvear]

Brother Alvear and I really enjoyed Brother Don Meade.

[Steadfast]

Tonight the preaching was very good...

I suspect it was good every service, Sister Alvear. They do have some incredible preachers lined up!

How long will you folks be here before going back overseas?

[crakjak]

No matter what he was aiming at with his spit, the words were directed to her and the pastor in FRONT of everyone.

If he had a problem with them videoing the service, then he should have talked to the pastor before service about that.

The wanted to get it on video so he could be censored? :winkgrin Remember they were smiling!

[Steadfast]

Brother Alvear and I really enjoyed Brother Don Meade.

I've known Bro. Meade for over 20 years. He was very kind to me in my early ministry and saved me one night from a very 'stressful' situation in a service... :friend

I think he's a man of great integrity and have always appreciated that in him.

[crakjak]

The video camera incident is the extreme version of Keith Clark's antics one year at the JCM music conference before he was the President there but was just the invited speaker.

They had contracted with Tim Newstrand to videotape it with a multi camera setup for videos. When KC took the pulpit he made a big show about demanding that the video cameras be turned off before he would preach.

Tim was being paid to do that job so he had the camerpeople lock the cameras down on medium or wide shots and walk away but he kept on videotaping from those fixed positions.

In my mind if you refuse to be videotaped you should have that worked out before you accept an invitation to speak.

I can understand KC not wanting his preaching recorded on video!

[crakjak]

Yep.

I'll keep my spirit right and just add a little grain of salt to this big SPITTING story.

He no more intentially spit (at camera or girl) than any other preacher intentionally SPITS on people while preaching. While looking at the camera he put his tongue between his lips and made the vibrating sound that we call a "raspberry." Any spittle was totally unintentional.

You can take offense at the gesture, but please get it right and don't call it intentional or even SPITTING.

I will also say this. Bro Steadfast, I know that Bro Haymon wouldn't allow production of the tape and has not publicly spread this story. I think it would have been best to leave this be. However, I know that DP parked at the end of your pew and said some things very directly to you...so I can see where you have a bone to pick. I do think you should have stood up to him with your opinion instead of bringing it here.


Here come the new posse!!!!!!:hug3 :amen :party :violin :grumpy

[Sister Alvear]

We leave early Wed. morning for Brazil...We do plan to come back in Oct as I have a ladies meeting to do and Brother Alvear has been asked to preach several places. Yes, Brother Meade has such a kind spirit. I wept a lot while he was preaching and so did Brother Alvear.

[Sister Alvear]

I think we should respect other people's flock and their pulpit...
We have had a few preachers in Brazil I don't think Brother Alvear would ask back but on the other hand we have had many that have been an untold blessing.

[Trouvere]

Some of the stuff posted on this thread just grieves me.We need holiness of heart as well as other things.

[Straightline]

What!?!?!? No spitting?

I bet a few of them feel so let down with poor Bro. Perdew.

For what it's worth, I'm proud of him for restraining himself from the whole spitting thing.

:happydance

The disparaging, unnecessary words that hijacked an entire thread.

I was not in Denver in 1999, so I will make no comment.
I was in Nashville 2007 for AMC, on this I will comment: Each service and speaker was tremendous, annointed of God.
However, if preaching were to be judged by the length and intensity of the altar service, Wednesday night was an A++. CC1 was not there to report that part of the story, so his reporting and analysis is lacking.



The road from Nashville to home will not follow a
Straightline

[Straightline]

Yep.

I'll keep my spirit right and just add a little grain of salt to this big SPITTING story.

He no more intentially spit (at camera or girl) than any other preacher intentionally SPITS on people while preaching. While looking at the camera he put his tongue between his lips and made the vibrating sound that we call a "raspberry." Any spittle was totally unintentional.

You can take offense at the gesture, but please get it right and don't call it intentional or even SPITTING.

I will also say this. Bro Steadfast, I know that Bro Haymon wouldn't allow production of the tape and has not publicly spread this story. I think it would have been best to leave this be. However, I know that DP parked at the end of your pew and said some things very directly to you...so I can see where you have a bone to pick. I do think you should have stood up to him with your opinion instead of bringing it here.


Josh:

Thank you for bringing balance to this story.
(it was nice to have finally meet you:winkgrin shhhh......)

The Heavenly Finish Line I seek is a
Straightline

[berkeley]

CC1 was not there to report that part of the story, so his reporting and analysis is lacking.



The road from Nashville to home will not follow a
Straightline
What is lacking? CC1 only reported on the night that he attended.

[Straightline]

What is lacking? CC1 only reported on the night that he attended.

My post was regarding the altar service, which he did not stay for.

"Because I left before service was completely over....."


When you "throw out the Lifeline", it will be a
Straightline

[berkeley]

My post was regarding the altar service, which he did not stay for.

"Because I left before service was completely over....."


When you "throw out the Lifeline", it will be a
Straightline

mmkay.. thanks

[josh]

Josh,

Sorry, but I was there. I saw what happened. I saw what happened after the service as well.

I understand that men make mistakes. I think it was in horrible judgment. Also, you should know that it has nothing to do with 'standing up to him'. I think you know me enough to know that 'standing up' isn't a problem with me.

Additionally, to think that I'm the cause of this 'scenario' being known is a gross misjudgment. The other preachers were getting calls within an hour of the service ending asking about the whole event. The next day I was in the airport with preachers who were getting calls left and right wanting to know if it 'happened like they said'. It was a 'shot heard round the world' before we even left the meeting.

I understand wishing it hadn't happened and wasn't known. I do, personally, want to think he learned a lot from that scenario. I hope so.

Again, I'm sorry if you think it's a personal vendetta. It's not. I just can't see acting like it didn't happen just because he's of 'our' camp.

Brother, I am not trying to say that you impugned AMC at all.

The camera girl, who was not the pastor's daughter, said that after he made his gesture she took a cloth and wiped the lens of the camera which did pick up some flecks of spittle. She did not have to wipe anything off herself. I didn't see it, but I have her first hand testimony about it.

I don't defend his actions and neither does he. However, I think it is totally wrong to imply that he SPIT on the girl.

I don't mean to say that you are the only one speaking of this. However, I do feel that you have continued to bring it up in public forum. If there are residual feelings over this you should go to the brother yourself. I would be glad to set up any contact that might bring some closure to this in your mind.

[Bishop1]

CC1
We just arrived home from The AMC-07
We enjoyed your company during the
Wednesday Night Service.
The Message in Tongues & Interpetation
Set The Atmosphere for The Fantastic
Altar Service.
I am sorry that you had to leave and rush
to the Airport -

I was just about to give you an Ole Fashioned
Bear Hug amd my famous hammerlock which
could be only released when you grabbed the
Altar Screaming for a Holiness Or Hell Blessing
BUT I Looked Around and alas, You Were
G O N E !

* FOR THE RECORD
During the first part of his Sermon,
Elder Perdue
acknowledged past crude transgressions.
He futher stated
that he has learned from his mistakes
and trys not to do them anymore

BTW
I Actually Enjoyed Bro Perdue's Message
Wednesday Evening.
Even In His Crudeness I think that I had rather listen
to listen to him
than
Endure the ANTICS of
"Florida's Jeffery A."
Or
Endure a repeat of the statement made in the
UPCI Conference in Birmingham by the
Kansas General "Kornwall"
I Heard Him Say
That He Has Converted
And Won More People To The LORD
Than Anybody Else In The World"
{* I hope he was evangelistlicly speaking,}
AND
I
AM NOT
SLAMMING THE UPCI Either

There Was A Good Spitit Of Worship & Fellowship
At The AMC-07
I Felt More Unity At This Meeting This Year -

GOD BLESS -

Bishop1
:beatdeadhorse

[OGIA]

Ahhhhh yes.... it would appear that I'm now anathema because I spoke against what I perceived as extremely unholy from an ultra-conservative preacher.

For all of my 'brutish' behaviour I have to search out where I did the real wrong:
* I didn't once speak derogatory of the AMC meeting. Rather I said from the very beginning it was a good meeting with good men.
* I didn't begin this thread nor did I intend for it to become what it has become. Rather I posted for the first time in a while and offered a joking statement... with NO ulterior motives.
* I surely didn't spit on anybody.

So now I'm 'suspect' in a wide variety of things:
* I'm 'political'. I'm not.
* I've got 'personal reasons' for my actions. He didn't really bother me.
* I'm trying to attack the meeting. I'm not and never have.
* I lied about what really happened. I didn't.

I guess just about all that is left is the famous, "You're not really a conservative anyway!" That is usually what comes next.

I love you guys anyway. Doesn't really phase me except that I find it amazing how quickly one can go from being a 'good guy' to being a 'trouble maker' just because I don't agree with what I consider unholy behaviour in the name of 'holiness'.

(Maybe I should have just spit, too! :toofunny )

Wow! All of that and really all I am wondering is what motive you had in digging this up? AGAPE gave you a cautionary yellow light, but you chose to ignore it. You haven't addressed that yet. All I see is you justifying why you did it and now playing the martyr.

My post never accused you of what you proclaim above, and your post above gives no acknowledgement that you MAY HAVE BEEN wrong in continuing on just to please the masses who wanted to know what your "spitting" comment referred to. It is THAT attitude that is JUST AS WRONG as this minister "spitting" on someone (which is your accusation, one that has since been brought into question).

[Actaeon]

Reading through this quagmire of thoughts that range from mockery, uninformed appraisals, calloused, unintelligent, to the careful, moderate, pleading, warning and informed observations -- what comes to mind is:

O, what a tangled web we weave,
When first we practice to deceive!
A Palmer too! - no wonder why
I felt rebuked beneath his eye:."

[AGAPE]

CC1
We just arrived home from The AMC-07
We enjoyed your company during the
Wednesday Night Service.
The Message in Tongues & Interpetation
Set The Atmosphere for The Fantastic
Altar Service.
I am sorry that you had to leave and rush
to the Airport -

I was just about to give you an Ole Fashioned
Bear Hug amd my famous hammerlock which
could be only released when you grabbed the
Altar Screaming for a Holiness Or Hell Blessing
BUT I Looked Around and alas, You Were
G O N E !

* FOR THE RECORD
During the first part of his Sermon,
Elder Perdue
acknowledged past crude transgressions.
He futher stated
that he has learned from his mistakes
and trys not to do them anymore

BTW
I Actually Enjoyed Bro Perdue's Message
Wednesday Evening.
Even In His Crudeness I think that I had rather listen
to listen to him
than
Endure the ANTICS of
"Florida's Jeffery A."
Or
Endure a repeat of the statement made in the
UPCI Conference in Birmingham by the
Kansas General "Kornwall"
I Heard Him Say
That He Has Converted
And Won More People To The LORD
Than Anybody Else In The World"
{* I hope he was evangelistlicly speaking,}
AND
I
AM NOT
SLAMMING THE UPCI Either

There Was A Good Spitit Of Worship & Fellowship
At The AMC-07
I Felt More Unity At This Meeting This Year -

GOD BLESS -

Bishop1
:beatdeadhorse

typo???:slaphappy :slaphappy

[IAintMovin]

He is the spittin' image of the group he hangs with.
I am backtracking and readind... but PP that is funny right there....

[Carpenter]

Reading through this quagmire of thoughts that range from mockery, uninformed appraisals, calloused, unintelligent, to the careful, moderate, pleading, warning and informed observations -- what comes to mind is:

O, what a tangled web we weave,
When first we practice to deceive!
A Palmer too! - no wonder why
I felt rebuked beneath his eye:."

I am learning more and more to not ask any more questions...stupid or otherwise. :D

[IAintMovin]

Brother, I am not trying to say that you impugned AMC at all.

The camera girl, who was not the pastor's daughter, said that after he made his gesture she took a cloth and wiped the lens of the camera which did pick up some flecks of spittle. She did not have to wipe anything off herself. I didn't see it, but I have her first hand testimony about it.

I don't defend his actions and neither does he. However, I think it is totally wrong to imply that he SPIT on the girl.

I don't mean to say that you are the only one speaking of this. However, I do feel that you have continued to bring it up in public forum. If there are residual feelings over this you should go to the brother yourself. I would be glad to set up any contact that might bring some closure to this in your mind.

There is one thing I will say for Steadfast, he speaks truth...he has nothing to gain by saying anything but what happened.... I do not appreciate that you are implying he is speaking anything but the truth...FTR - if Steadfast has it wrong, why did on the first night of this conference, before he spoke, did Bro. P. acknowledge his past mistake in judgement as was reported here??? ... now bare in mind I am going off of reports as I was not there myself and dont know exactly what Bro. P. said before he preached.....

[BoredOutOfMyMind]

Any reports from the OTHER speakers?

What about the day services?

[OGIA]

Any reports from the OTHER speakers?

What about the day services?
Bro. Groce posted on CAF, in only a way he can, that " the dovetailing and synchronization of all the messages was without doubt divinely arranged."


Seems it was an awesome conference.

[Sister Alvear]

yes, many others were good but Brother Meade's message spoke to our hearts...as far as holiness, we are holiness folks but my husband is kind but everybody has their own way of presenting things. Of the night speakers Brother Meade's message spoke to our heart because we have suffered a lot in the areas he spoke about. We want to be kind even to those that come into our city and say "things" about us that are lies...We want to be true to what we believe and we were hurt that someone is in our city now and we feel would do naything to hurt us if they follow thier past procedures but we may be wrong. We are going through a trial and we have never been "money people" or "political" so it seemed like God was speaking to us that all will be well...and He will make a way for us.
I personally mean no harm saying which service I enjoyed the most but all the services were good. I am deeply thankful for all God's men and women that are on this upward trail with us.
We all need one another no matter how different our convictions may be. We are brothers and sisters.
If I had any thing to say that might better the conference it might be having some prayer with the minister's wives. Quite a few ask me to pray for them. Not only the men need strentgh but the minister wife in this hour carries such a great load.
I personally have nothing but good to say. Look for the good and remember we are all God's family and let's be kind to those that hurt us. By this shall all men know we are His disciples.

[Sister Alvear]

Brother Steve Pixler taught a good message along with others. Most of the messages and lessons were on soul winning.

[Sister Alvear]

I had to go out during DP message for a time so I only heard the first 30 or so minute and the very end so I cannot tell you much about his message. I think it must have been almost a couple hours. I do not know him so I cannot say anything. What I heard was good but I did not hear it all. The speakers I heard were very annointed.
We are all different andj we come from different fields of labor. Quite a few missionaries were in attendance.

[BoredOutOfMyMind]

Bro. Groce posted on CAF, in only a way he can, that " the dovetailing and synchronization of all the messages was without doubt divinely arranged."


Seems it was an awesome conference.


This is not CAF, and some members here do not subscribe to both boards.

Perhaps Elder Groce will repost here.

[OGIA]

This is not CAF, and some members here do not subscribe to both boards. Which is why I posted what I did after you asked. :tiphat

[CC1]

Acteon,

One problem I had sitting near the rear is I couldn't tell when Elder Epley was running the aisles or not. I kept looking to see if I saw a raised hand racing up and down any aisles just over peoples heads but to no avail.

[Sister Alvear]

The elder sat near us he was on the first row. Very nice person.

[Bishop1]

typo???:slaphappy :slaphappy




LOL

YEP IT WUZ -

I MEANT TO SAY
S P I R I T
Sorry
But We Left Nashville Around Midnite
Stopped at the Franklin Steak-n-Shake
AND
Got Home At 6 AM !
Just Dog Tired -
:tiphat



Bishop1
:beatdeadhorse

[CC1]

LOL

YEP IT WUZ -

I MEANT TO SAY
S P I R I T
Sorry
But We Left Nashville Around Midnite
Stopped at the Franklin Steak-n-Shake
AND
Got Home At 6 AM !
Just Dog Tired -
:tiphat



Bishop1
:beatdeadhorse

I have had many a chocolate milkshake from tht Steak N Shake!!!

[BoredOutOfMyMind]

I have had many a chocolate milkshake from tht Steak N Shake!!!


To think you could have been in Franklin and blessed the Bishop.....

[CC1]

To think you could have been in Franklin and blessed the Bishop.....

LOL!! I don't live in that neck of the woods anymore since we bought our new home but what he ate was a lot better than what I did.

I made the mistake of passing up the exit with my Steak N Shake that night. I was counting on the Shoney's near my home I have never eaten at. Turns out that Shoney's closes at 10 pm so I had to settle for the late night McDonalds drive through where I got a "Big N Tasty" burger that was "Medium & Gross". I think they had cooked it for lunch and it had been sitting under a heat lamp since.

[revrandy]

tried out Steak N Shake when we were Indian'er...


at least I know what the shake means!!!


and what it does to your stomach!!!

[BoredOutOfMyMind]

LOL!! I don't live in that neck of the woods anymore since we bought our new home but what he ate was a lot better than what I did.

I made the mistake of passing up the exit with my Steak N Shake that night. I was counting on the Shoney's near my home I have never eaten at. Turns out that Shoney's closes at 10 pm so I had to settle for the late night McDonalds drive through where I got a "Big N Tasty" burger that was "Medium & Gross". I think they had cooked it for lunch and it had been sitting under a heat lamp since.

Due to the Coffee in the lap deal, every Fast Food establishment now seems to be afeared of hot food.

Nothing worse than greasy food cold.

[CC1]

Due to the Coffee in the lap deal, every Fast Food establishment now seems to be afeared of hot food.

Nothing worse than greasy food cold.


I should have known better. McDonalds is only good for breakfast and the new honey mustard chicken wrap (and then only order the wrap during busy hours where you at least have a chance of it having been cooked within the past half hour).

[CC1]

tried out Steak N Shake when we were Indian'er...


at least I know what the shake means!!!


and what it does to your stomach!!!

I like Steak N Shakes milkshakes but I am not crazy about their food. I usually get the salad with chicken tenders in it rather than the burgers.

[Old Paths]

Some of the posts on this thread proves once again that the view from the cheap seats remains distorted.

:banghead