Help! My Best Friend is a Liberal!!

[Theophilus]

Is your best friend a laid back liberal? A mushy moderate? A mean-spirited Conservative? A pharisaical UC?

What do you do when your best friend isn't of your persuasion or changes course? Can there truly be fellowship when the lines have been redefined? If so, how so? Is there a limit? Can you ever hope to accomplish anything together for the Kingdom if you are not equally yoked and/or no longer "say the same thing?"

[mizpeh]

Is your best friend a laid back liberal? A mushy moderate? A mean-spirited Conservative? A pharisaical UC?

What do you do when your best friend isn't of your persuasion or changes course? Can there truly be fellowship when the lines have been redefined? If so, how so? Is there a limit? Can you ever hope to accomplish anything together for the Kingdom if you are not equally yoked and/or no longer "say the same thing?"

It depends on where you draw the lines of fellowship. My line is drawn by my understanding of when one becomes a born again son/daughter of God and who God is. Once in the body of Christ there has to be forbearance, love, peacableness, etc for one another within the body.

Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

[Theophilus]

It depends on where you draw the lines of fellowship. My line is drawn by my understanding of when one becomes a born again son/daughter of God and who God is. Once in the body of Christ there has to be forbearance, love, peacableness, etc for one another within the body.

Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

Good post. What does that verse mean? When do we all come into the unity of the faith, etc?

And how does that verse coincide with the following?

1Co 1:10 ~ Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.

[Sheltiedad]

I would be changing friends by default because if my best friend became conservative, his life would start revolving around church and we wouldn't be able to spend any time together unless it was at a church function.

[Barb]

It depends on where you draw the lines of fellowship. My line is drawn by my understanding of when one becomes a born again son/daughter of God and who God is. Once in the body of Christ there has to be forbearance, love, peacableness, etc for one another within the body.

Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:
Interesting...the bolded portion of that verse formed the UPCI, and it worked...for a while.

[Theophilus]

I would be changing friends by default because if my best friend became conservative, his life would start revolving around church and we wouldn't be able to spend any time together unless it was at a church function.

Really? Would that be a bad thing?

I know many conservatives that enjoy life outside of a "church" function.

If he was your best friend, your best friend, you would dump him for being too involved in "church" for you tastes?

[Theophilus]

Interesting...the bolded portion of that verse formed the UPCI, and it worked...for a while.

Quite right. What is your opinion Barb, in general and about the meaning of this verse?

[Sheltiedad]

I wouldn't dump him but I'm sure we would slowly grow apart since I am not interested in going to church functions on a regular basis.

Maybe things have changed the last few years but I know that all of my relatives who are conservative are completely wrapped up in church functions... even their non-church activities are with their church friends. I have found that when people get really involved in church, they just don't have much time left over for anything else.

[Theophilus]

I wouldn't dump him but I'm sure we would slowly grow apart since I am not interested in going to church functions on a regular basis.

Maybe things have changed the last few years but I know that all of my relatives who are conservative are completely wrapped up in church functions... even their non-church activities are with their church friends.

Do you think that is unhealthy? I think they probably use some scripture to support that, and I would support their decision to an extent. However, do you feel that it makes them too seclusive, and therefore not able to reach out as the Lord would? Is it possible, on the other hand, that one can spend too much time with the world? That being with church goers and at church functions is a little bit of an uneasy situation, or just no "fun" at all?

[Sheltiedad]

I think I am too biased to have a good opinion on whether it is too seclusive or not.

Church makes other people happy... it makes me depressed, miserable and annoyed (and I realize I am the only person in the entire world who doesn't like church (with the possible exception of Michlow. lol). So I would have to go with the no fun option... the only uneasiness for me is having to walk on my tiptoes to keep from offending anyone.

[OP_Carl]

What do you do when your best friend isn't of your persuasion or changes course?

It means that your friendship is going to change. It simply cannot be as deep, on as many levels, as it was.

It means that you're headed for some bumpy going as you "discover" the areas of disagreement. The two of you will have to agree to leave certain topics alone, or one of you will have to use diversionary conversation tactics when discussion drifts toward these polarizing elements. You've got to be careful not to let things get out of hand, so you don't say something you'll regret. For instance, you can never un-say, "YOU'RE WRONG, AND YOU'RE AN IDIOT ! ! ! !" It might be forgiven, but never forgotten.

It is going to feel somewhat like you've lost a friend, because you've lost a portion of what has seemed like a stable relationship.

God Bless you and help you.

[Rico]

Is your best friend a laid back liberal? A mushy moderate? A mean-spirited Conservative? A pharisaical UC?

What do you do when your best friend isn't of your persuasion or changes course? Can there truly be fellowship when the lines have been redefined? If so, how so? Is there a limit? Can you ever hope to accomplish anything together for the Kingdom if you are not equally yoked and/or no longer "say the same thing?"


Well, I guess you'd have to ask yourself which was more important, standards or your friendship.

[Fireside]

Well, I guess you'd have to ask yourself which was more important, standards or your friendship.


It isn't quite that simple.

A very close friend of mine went totally charismatic.

I still love him. I am kind to him.

But we no longer have the same things in common. His fellowship has completely changed. He has sought out friends who affirm his choices. He goes to their meetings. We have little to talk about now.

He changed, not me. I am still what I was when we met.

The affection I have for him as a friend is still there, but our paths are no longer the same.

[Theophilus]

Well, I guess you'd have to ask yourself which was more important, standards or your friendship.

For one, it's never all about "standards" anyway.

Two, I rather cherish having some kind of a standard, especially when based on Biblical Principle. We all have standards, one way or the other, and if you choose not to decide...you still have made a choice.

For some, it is like asking to make a decision between friends and God. Yet, is there a way to maintain both?

Nevertheless, to what extent can someone's lack of any standards retard one's friendship with one another in Christ, or, one's adherence to too many standards?

What scripture do we have to deal with such a dilemma?

[Theophilus]

It isn't quite that simple.

A very close friend of mine went totally charismatic.

I still love him. I am kind to him.

But we no longer have the same things in common. His fellowship has completely changed. He has sought out friends who affirm his choices. He goes to their meetings. We have little to talk about now.

He changed, not me. I am still what I was when we met.

The affection I have for him as a friend is still there, but our paths are no longer the same.

This explains my personal situation to a tee, yet, from time to time he still comes around. The problem is that it seems to be in effort to impose his persuasion subtly, though his persuasion has failed him over and over. That is usually when he comes back around, when his ways have cost him. To what extent should I maintain the friendship? It’s really a family to family friendship with a fairly bumpy past. We love them, but find ourselves in a dilemma on whether or not and to what extent we ought to fellowship.

I do not want to make this thread too personal, but rather to the issue in general.

[Theophilus]

It means that your friendship is going to change. It simply cannot be as deep, on as many levels, as it was.

It means that you're headed for some bumpy going as you "discover" the areas of disagreement. The two of you will have to agree to leave certain topics alone, or one of you will have to use diversionary conversation tactics when discussion drifts toward these polarizing elements. You've got to be careful not to let things get out of hand, so you don't say something you'll regret. For instance, you can never un-say, "YOU'RE WRONG, AND YOU'RE AN IDIOT ! ! ! !" It might be forgiven, but never forgotten.

It is going to feel somewhat like you've lost a friend, because you've lost a portion of what has seemed like a stable relationship.

God Bless you and help you.

Great post OP. You speak as though you've had similar experiences.

[Theophilus]

I think I am too biased to have a good opinion on whether it is too seclusive or not.

Church makes other people happy... it makes me depressed, miserable and annoyed (and I realize I am the only person in the entire world who doesn't like church (with the possible exception of Michlow. lol). So I would have to go with the no fun option... the only uneasiness for me is having to walk on my tiptoes to keep from offending anyone.

I appreciate your openness and honesty. Do you foresee a progression in your walk with Christ that may at some point ease some of this?

[Rico]

It isn't quite that simple.

A very close friend of mine went totally charismatic.

I still love him. I am kind to him.

But we no longer have the same things in common. His fellowship has completely changed. He has sought out friends who affirm his choices. He goes to their meetings. We have little to talk about now.

He changed, not me. I am still what I was when we met.

The affection I have for him as a friend is still there, but our paths are no longer the same.


Unless I missed it, nothing was mentioned about anyone going charismatic.

[mizpeh]

Originally Posted by mizpeh
It depends on where you draw the lines of fellowship. My line is drawn by my understanding of when one becomes a born again son/daughter of God and who God is. Once in the body of Christ there has to be forbearance, love, peacableness, etc for one another within the body.

Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

Theophilus replied: Good post. What does that verse mean? When do we all come into the unity of the faith, etc?

And how does that verse coincide with the following?

1Co 1:10 ~ Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.

Theo,

I think you know the answer to your question. I don't. But I will give it a feeble attempt.

If a house is to stand it has to be united. Paul pointed out in many of his epistles things that might divide the body of Christ...such as heresies (circumcision and keeping the law of Moses in Galatians and I've been told Colossians was written against Gnosticism) Jesus, the Spirit, pointed out other heresies in the first few chapters of Revelation. Heresies will divide the body.

Pride and the pushing forward of a personal agenda will divide the body. We can see that in the Corinthian church...I am of Paul, I am of Apollos, I am of Peter...etc.

The members of the body need to have charity toward one another and seek peace.

Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace. and

From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love

Those two verses 1 Cor 1:10 and Ephesians 4:13 would fit perfectly together if read one right after another.

Sorry this post is a little scattered.

[Rico]

For one, it's never all about "standards" anyway.

Two, I rather cherish having some kind of a standard, especially when based on Biblical Principle. We all have standards, one way or the other, and if you choose not to decide...you still have made a choice.

For some, it is like asking to make a decision between friends and God. Yet, is there a way to maintain both?

Nevertheless, to what extent can someone's lack of any standards retard one's friendship with one another in Christ, or, one's adherence to too many standards?

What scripture do we have to deal with such a dilemma?

Who's telling you not to keep your standards? I don't base my friendships with other apostolics on standards. There was a time I did, and I found out it was because I had a rotten attitude and thought I was better than other people. I'm not trying to sound like MLK, but something he said makes a lot of sense. He prayed for the day when men are judged by the content of their character and not the color of their skin. Well, what's wrong with judging someone by the content of their character and not their adherance to dress standards? Wearing or not wearing pants (for a woman) does not make the person a good or bad person. Bearded or clean shaven does not determine if someone is a good person or not either.

[Rico]

This explains my personal situation to a tee, yet, from time to time he still comes around. The problem is that it seems to be in effort to impose his persuasion subtly, though his persuasion has failed him over and over. That is usually when he comes back around, when his ways have cost him. To what extent should I maintain the friendship? It’s really a family to family friendship with a fairly bumpy past. We love them, but find ourselves in a dilemma on whether or not and to what extent we ought to fellowship.

I do not want to make this thread too personal, but rather to the issue in general.

Well, you didn't say that in your opening post. I got the impression you were talking about liberal, moderate, conservative, and ultra conservative apostolics.

[Sheltiedad]

I think I would find it (standards) a matter of convenience... if I were going to the beach but knew if I went with my Pentecostal friend and was going to spend half the day looking for a secluded beach to avoid mixed bathing, or I could go with my other friends and just park in the first spot that looks good, I would probably lean towards my non-Pentecostal friends.

If I was doing something where standards didn't matter (like playing games at someone's house), then it would just depend on if I wanted to go or not.

[SarahElizabeth]

Who's telling you not to keep your standards? I don't base my friendships with other apostolics on standards. There was a time I did, and I found out it was because I had a rotten attitude and thought I was better than other people. I'm not trying to sound like MLK, but something he said makes a lot of sense. He prayed for the day when men are judged by the content of their character and not the color of their skin. Well, what's wrong with judging someone by the content of their character and not their adherance to dress standards? Wearing or not wearing pants (for a woman) does not make the person a good or bad person. Bearded or clean shaven does not determine if someone is a good person or not either.

That's what we should be doing - character more than clothing - that ought to be our motto!!

[Sheltiedad]

I appreciate your openness and honesty. Do you foresee a progression in your walk with Christ that may at some point ease some of this?

Honestly I have no idea... I don't really see that I have a walk, and the problem is I don't even desire one... I just want to be a good person and continue to improve myself as a person, that's the extent of my ambition spiritually. (I think my "spiritual" needs meter is broken).

I'm willing to discuss this further if you feel it will help you understand your relationship with your friend.

[crakjak]

Is your best friend a laid back liberal? A mushy moderate? A mean-spirited Conservative? A pharisaical UC?

What do you do when your best friend isn't of your persuasion or changes course? Can there truly be fellowship when the lines have been redefined? If so, how so? Is there a limit? Can you ever hope to accomplish anything together for the Kingdom if you are not equally yoked and/or no longer "say the same thing?"

If this friend still loves God and is seeking after Him, that could be a basis for continuing relationship. Usually after time folks realize that what they left is not their enemy and moderate the attitude. There is so much in scripture that you should eventually be to celebrate together, things of the heart, and intimacy with the Lord. However, if this person has left even the love and pursuit of the Lord, then not too much for relationship at this time. If you hunt or do other activities with them maybe you could occasionally continue those for contact and possibility of future restoration.

[Theophilus]

Theophilus replied:

Theo,

I think you know the answer to your question. I don't. But I will give it a feeble attempt.

If a house is to stand it has to be united. Paul pointed out in many of his epistles things that might divide the body of Christ...such as heresies (circumcision and keeping the law of Moses in Galatians and I've been told Colossians was written against Gnosticism) Jesus, the Spirit, pointed out other heresies in the first few chapters of Revelation. Heresies will divide the body.

Pride and the pushing forward of a personal agenda will divide the body. We can see that in the Corinthian church...I am of Paul, I am of Apollos, I am of Peter...etc.

The members of the body need to have charity toward one another and seek peace.

Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace. and

From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love

Those two verses 1 Cor 1:10 and Ephesians 4:13 would fit perfectly together if read one right after another.

Sorry this post is a little scattered.

Thanks for your input. I wouldn't call it feeble.

I have some ideas about those verses and there context, and unity in general, naturally, but I didn't ask my question for any other reason than to seek your opinion, as well as others.

I suppose the crux of the issue seems to be defining at what point is possible peace and unity breeched.

Ro 12:18 ~ If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.

When is it no longer possible or rather when do you say enough is enough and put the friendship on hold?

[Mr. Steinway]

If I were a conservative, I would maintain a friendship with a friend that went liberal, as long a they didn't 'flaunt' their new freedom to me.

I try to show respect to my conservative friends. Most are still friends, but there are a few that won't give me the time of day since they learned I was 'liberal'! :nah

[Theophilus]

Well, you didn't say that in your opening post. I got the impression you were talking about liberal, moderate, conservative, and ultra conservative apostolics.

That is why I don't want to make it personal. My interest is in all points of view and how other's have dealt with the issue within friendships.

Have you ever had to deal with a similar situation?

[Barb]

Quite right. What is your opinion Barb, in general and about the meaning of this verse?

Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

It means to me that the Body is not going to always agree on every point.

1Co 1:10 ~ Now I beseech you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that ye all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you; but that ye be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment.

IMO, speaking the same thing is the Godhead, belief, repentance, baptism in the Name, Spirit infilling, living a godly and modest life, separated from the evil that this world represents.

Going back to my earlier post, in this the framers formed a united organization. The PCIer and PAJCer alike could agree on this and spoke the same thing, so much so that one could not tell who was who.

Where they disagreed, they would not contend for their different issues, "till we all come in the unity of the faith..."

[Theophilus]

Who's telling you not to keep your standards? I don't base my friendships with other apostolics on standards. There was a time I did, and I found out it was because I had a rotten attitude and thought I was better than other people. I'm not trying to sound like MLK, but something he said makes a lot of sense. He prayed for the day when men are judged by the content of their character and not the color of their skin. Well, what's wrong with judging someone by the content of their character and not their adherance to dress standards? Wearing or not wearing pants (for a woman) does not make the person a good or bad person. Bearded or clean shaven does not determine if someone is a good person or not either.

Like I said, it's not all about "standards" and certainly not just dress standards. There are other standards of greater importance save perhaps functional nakedness.

[Sheltiedad]

Not sure if this fits here, but recently my mom begged me to go to their Anniversary service in the city where my dad pastors about 60 miles away.

I am a guy that is normally in bed by 9pm every night of the week and up by 5am.

My wife and I went to the service and they didn't even start the preaching until after 9pm... then around 11pm they were having a reception in the back with cake and stuff... I believe I came off as rude to some of my mom and dad's preacher friends, but I'm honestly just not used to staying up as late as Pentecostal people do... plus I am a morning person anyway... I start out my day full of energy and my batteries run down and I get cranky the longer I stay up.

It wasn't so much that I didn't want to participate in their "moment" as that all I could think about was when I could go home and go to sleep. Next time, I think a firm "no" would be better than appearing to be rude to the church people.

I brought this up because this is an example of a non-church type person trying to socialize with church-type people...

[Rico]

That is why I don't want to make it personal. My interest is in all points of view and how other's have dealt with the issue within friendships.

Have you ever had to deal with a similar situation?

Only when I decided to leave the uc church I had been attending for several years. I found out very quickly who truly was and wasn't my friend.

[crakjak]

Honestly I have no idea... I don't really see that I have a walk, and the problem is I don't even desire one... I just want to be a good person and continue to improve myself as a person, that's the extent of my ambition spiritually. (I think my "spiritual" needs meter is broken).

Sheltiedad,

God has not left you, you have simply left a human interpretation of Him. You will recognize Him where you believe, and He will guide you on His path for you life. He is with you or you would not breathe or be alive, just know that He is fond of you and wants to relate to you where you are, simply desire to know Him as He really is, "Come unto me...my yoke is easy, and my burden light..." Jesus said.

[SarahElizabeth]

Only when I decided to leave the uc church I had been attending for several years. I found out very quickly who truly was and wasn't my friend.

I found that once I left an ultra con church, nobody there was my friend - or that's the way it seems.

[Rico]

Like I said, it's not all about "standards" and certainly not just dress standards. There are other standards of greater importance save perhaps functional nakedness.

I see. At some point you are going to have to decide if continuing the friendship will drag you down spiritually. I believe there's room for tolerance but not at the expense of your walk with the Lord.

[Theophilus]

If this friend still loves God and is seeking after Him, that could be a basis for continuing relationship. Usually after time folks realize that what they left is not their enemy and moderate the attitude. There is so much in scripture that you should eventually be to celebrate together, things of the heart, and intimacy with the Lord. However, if this person has left even the love and pursuit of the Lord, then not too much for relationship at this time. If you hunt or do other activities with them maybe you could occasionally continue those for contact and possibility of future restoration.

Good post. I think there is something to be said for the wisdom of longsuffering here.

[Mr. Steinway]

Only when I decided to leave the uc church I had been attending for several years. I found out very quickly who truly was and wasn't my friend.

I found that once I left an ultra con church, nobody there was my friend - or that's the way it seems.

It's heartbreaking to find out someone that you thought was a true friend rejects you.

The enlightenment goes both ways though! You will also be surprised at those who will still remain friends that you thought would forsake you! :)

[Theophilus]

I see. At some point you are going to have to decide if continuing the friendship will drag you down spiritually. I believe there's room for tolerance but not at the expense of your walk with the Lord.

You're right, I'm fairly strong, but when you start to factor in family fellowship you start to wonder what effect it might have on the children. We teach them tolerance, but it's hard sometimes for them not to see compromise. I just don't want to send the wrong message in my efforts to maintain a friendship with an individual or their family. Just an extra factor thrown in there for the challenge. Thanks Rico.

[Theophilus]

It's heartbreaking to find out someone that you thought was a true friend rejects you.

The enlightenment goes both ways though! You will also be surprised at those who will still remain friends that you thought would forsake you! :)

Absolutely..you find out who your friends are.

[CC1]

I think I am too biased to have a good opinion on whether it is too seclusive or not.

Church makes other people happy... it makes me depressed, miserable and annoyed (and I realize I am the only person in the entire world who doesn't like church (with the possible exception of Michlow. lol). So I would have to go with the no fun option... the only uneasiness for me is having to walk on my tiptoes to keep from offending anyone.

Christ Church Nashville woulde not make you feel this way.

[CC1]

I think I would find it (standards) a matter of convenience... if I were going to the beach but knew if I went with my Pentecostal friend and was going to spend half the day looking for a secluded beach to avoid mixed bathing, or I could go with my other friends and just park in the first spot that looks good, I would probably lean towards my non-Pentecostal friends.

If I was doing something where standards didn't matter (like playing games at someone's house), then it would just depend on if I wanted to go or not.

I am not ashamed to be seen with my conservative Pentecostal friends with a strict dress code except when it comes to water sports, skiing, etc.

I refuse to be associated with women swimming in blue jean skirts or skiing with skirts on over snow suits. That is just lunacy one step over the line.

[Theophilus]

Not sure if this fits here, but recently my mom begged me to go to their Anniversary service in the city where my dad pastors about 60 miles away.

I am a guy that is normally in bed by 9pm every night of the week and up by 5am.

My wife and I went to the service and they didn't even start the preaching until after 9pm... then around 11pm they were having a reception in the back with cake and stuff... I believe I came off as rude to some of my mom and dad's preacher friends, but I'm honestly just not used to staying up as late as Pentecostal people do... plus I am a morning person anyway... I start out my day full of energy and my batteries run down and I get cranky the longer I stay up.

It wasn't so much that I didn't want to participate in their "moment" as that all I could think about was when I could go home and go to sleep. Next time, I think a firm "no" would be better than appearing to be rude to the church people.

I brought this up because this is an example of a non-church type person trying to socialize with church-type people...

It fits just fine, in a sense. One of our biggest issues with "church" was the hours kept. Not all of us were preachers, some of us have to, and like you and I, enjoy getting up in the morning.

[CC1]

I have no problem with conservative Pentecostal friends. If I want to go to the movies and I am with Elder Epley I can go see Transfomers and just leave him in the parking lot placing "You are going to hell for being here" tracts on the windshields of the cars.

Then afterwards we can just go grab some good food and have a good time talking and fellowshipping!

[Mr. Steinway]

You're right, I'm fairly strong, but when you start to factor in family fellowship you start to wonder what effect it might have on the children. We teach them tolerance, but it's hard sometimes for them not to see compromise. I just don't want to send the wrong message in my efforts to maintain a friendship with an individual or their family. Just an extra factor thrown in there for the challenge. Thanks Rico.
I think an honest talk with your friend would be helpful. Them him/her that you desire to keep your friendship, but at the same time you must keep your moral and religious standards. If he/she is a real friend, they will respect you and your beliefs.

If not, you just found out that your friendship was conditional.

[Theophilus]

Honestly I have no idea... I don't really see that I have a walk, and the problem is I don't even desire one... I just want to be a good person and continue to improve myself as a person, that's the extent of my ambition spiritually. (I think my "spiritual" needs meter is broken).

I'm willing to discuss this further if you feel it will help you understand your relationship with your friend.

I have friends similar to you. You can have a personal walk with the Lord without traditional "church." Though just being a good person will not allow you to move on beyond this life to see and experience what the Creator of the Universe( you and I included ) has in store, it is a excellent quailty and can very well be a point of departure in beginning or redeveloping a walk with the Lord. I spent 16 years trying to do it on my own. Though he was always there for me, my life since actively seeking and walking with him is totally different for the far better. Just my POV that I wanted to extent to you. :)

[Theophilus]

I think an honest talk with your friend would be helpful. Them him/her that you desire to keep your friendship, but at the same time you must keep your moral and religious standards. If he/she is a real friend, they will respect you and your beliefs.

If not, you just found out that your friendship was conditional.

Good point, even in general.

[Theophilus]

I have no problem with conservative Pentecostal friends. If I want to go to the movies and I am with Elder Epley I can go see Transfomers and just leave him in the parking lot placing "You are going to hell for being here" tracts on the windshields of the cars.

Then afterwards we can just go grab some good food and have a good time talking and fellowshipping!

Now that's funny, I don't care who ya are...

[Sheltiedad]

I have no problem with conservative Pentecostal friends. If I want to go to the movies and I am with Elder Epley I can go see Transfomers and just leave him in the parking lot placing "You are going to hell for being here" tracts on the windshields of the cars.

Then afterwards we can just go grab some good food and have a good time talking and fellowshipping!

Reminds me of the Looney Tunes cartoon where "Sam" the sheepdog and Wile E Coyote clock in together with their lunch boxes and then are mortal enemies for most of the episode and then clock out. :)

[Theophilus]

Reminds me of the Looney Tunes cartoon where "Sam" the sheepdog and Wile E Coyote clock in together with their lunch boxes and then are mortal enemies for most of the episode and then clock out. :)

LOL!

Hey, I've been thinking about that series all week, though it has to do with a situation at work.

[CC1]

Reminds me of the Looney Tunes cartoon where "Sam" the sheepdog and Wile E Coyote clock in together with their lunch boxes and then are mortal enemies for most of the episode and then clock out. :)

Exactly!!

I have no doubt I would be skewered if ever in a service that my ultra con freinds are preaching. Not neccesarily because I would be a target (though I am sure that would be tempting and influence them somewhat) but just because of the nature of their beliefs and usual preaching.

BTW - Did you see my post where I said that you would not hate Christ Church? I don't think it would make you depressed, angry, etc.

I can't remember where you live but if it is the Dallas area you ought to check out Mike Hayes Covenant Church.

[Theophilus]

I am not ashamed to be seen with my conservative Pentecostal friends with a strict dress code except when it comes to water sports, skiing, etc.

I refuse to be associated with women swimming in blue jean skirts or skiing with skirts on over snow suits. That is just lunacy one step over the line.

Alot of things different Christians do is kinda crazy, but I have to respect their efforts per convictions even if it's apparently wrong or unbiblical. Much of the time, it's harmless to others, yet helpful to them.

[CC1]

Alot of things different Christians do is kinda crazy, but I have to respect their efforts per convictions even if it's apparently wrong or unbiblical. Much of the time, it's harmless to others, yet helpful to them.

They are free to do it but I am not going to be within a country mile!!!!!

[Theophilus]

Well, ya all have a good 4th. I'll check in from time to time.

Thanks for all the input, both personally and generally. I've thought it to be an important and interesting topic worthy of a thread in AFF. God Bless.

[Mr. Steinway]

They are free to do it but I am not going to be within a country mile!!!!!

Now CC1!!!! You know you would love the attention that other boaters would give you! :D

[Theophilus]

They are free to do it but I am not going to be within a country mile!!!!!

LOL! I'm sure they feel likewise...:winkgrin

[Pragmatist]

Not sure if this fits here, but recently my mom begged me to go to their Anniversary service in the city where my dad pastors about 60 miles away.

I am a guy that is normally in bed by 9pm every night of the week and up by 5am.

My wife and I went to the service and they didn't even start the preaching until after 9pm... then around 11pm they were having a reception in the back with cake and stuff... I believe I came off as rude to some of my mom and dad's preacher friends, but I'm honestly just not used to staying up as late as Pentecostal people do... plus I am a morning person anyway... I start out my day full of energy and my batteries run down and I get cranky the longer I stay up.

It wasn't so much that I didn't want to participate in their "moment" as that all I could think about was when I could go home and go to sleep. Next time, I think a firm "no" would be better than appearing to be rude to the church people.

I brought this up because this is an example of a non-church type person trying to socialize with church-type people...

Maybe this is a regional thing?

We're early to bed, early to rise people also. I get cranky if Wednesday night church isn't dismissed before 9PM. We recently declined to go to a fellowship meeting because we would get home too late and with the addition of a fussy baby at night, it would be too much.

[Jehoram]

My best friend attends a Oneness Charismatic church. It has not affected our relationship at all. I'd still love him if he were to totally backslide, though it would break my heart.

I do think there are some extreme changes that friendships cannot survive.

[Pragmatist]

I am not ashamed to be seen with my conservative Pentecostal friends with a strict dress code except when it comes to water sports, skiing, etc.

I refuse to be associated with women swimming in blue jean skirts or skiing with skirts on over snow suits. That is just lunacy one step over the line.

Totally agree with this one. I wear clothing appropriate for the activity or I decline.

[Pragmatist]

Back on topic, I think it depends on the attitude of your friend. If they believe things differently, but still respect your beliefs, you should be fine. If they want to "flaunt" their freedom, persuade, or belittle, then I would be kind to them, but choose not to spend much time with them.

[Sheltiedad]

Maybe this is a regional thing?

We're early to bed, early to rise people also. I get cranky if Wednesday night church isn't dismissed before 9PM. We recently declined to go to a fellowship meeting because we would get home too late and with the addition of a fussy baby at night, it would be too much.

When I was growing up, one unnamed preacher would purposefully (actually said this during his sermon but I don't remember the exact words) keep the service going until after the last restaurant closed just to prove a point to the people who looked forward to going out to eat after church... so I think it is a mentality thing.

What's funny to me is that I feel that Pentecostals keep the same kinds of hours as the people I know who go out drinking and dancing... and both groups think I am boring. lol.

[Sheltiedad]

Exactly!!

I have no doubt I would be skewered if ever in a service that my ultra con freinds are preaching. Not neccesarily because I would be a target (though I am sure that would be tempting and influence them somewhat) but just because of the nature of their beliefs and usual preaching.

BTW - Did you see my post where I said that you would not hate Christ Church? I don't think it would make you depressed, angry, etc.

I can't remember where you live but if it is the Dallas area you ought to check out Mike Hayes Covenant Church.

I'm right down the road from Jabo Greens... we've thought of visiting there sometime. My problem is not having a desire to go to church at all. My wife has only been in a few Apostolic services (only on Sunday mornings) and one time it got a little crazy and freaked her out... I could not imagine her in a Sunday night service. lol.

The most I do is clap my hands if I am enjoying a song, so I am not really into the demonstrative worship (and no, I don't shout at sporting events either... I'm the guy sitting there watching everyone else. lol)

[Pragmatist]

When I was growing up, one unnamed preacher would purposefully (actually said this during his sermon but I don't remember the exact words) keep the service going until after the last restaurant closed just to prove a point to the people who looked forward to going out to eat after church... so I think it is a mentality thing.

What's funny to me is that I feel that Pentecostals keep the same kinds of hours as the people I know who go out drinking and dancing... and both groups think I am boring. lol.

Yeah, the unnamed preacher had control issues, apparently.

And my husband and I fit the boring label, too. But then, we are educated and have to go to jobs in the morning where our brains are utilized. :)

[Sister Alvear]

pictures coming up of my best friends...on this thread...

[Brother Price]

I have some very liberal friends. I have some friends who make me look liberal. The deal is that we both have an understanding to be friends, and just have a good time with one another. We eat together and share with one another.

[CC1]

I'm right down the road from Jabo Greens... we've thought of visiting there sometime. My problem is not having a desire to go to church at all. My wife has only been in a few Apostolic services (only on Sunday mornings) and one time it got a little crazy and freaked her out... I could not imagine her in a Sunday night service. lol.

The most I do is clap my hands if I am enjoying a song, so I am not really into the demonstrative worship (and no, I don't shout at sporting events either... I'm the guy sitting there watching everyone else. lol)

You ought to at least check Jabba The Hut out. I have only been in service there once and it was right after he left the UPC and had started the group that later merged with Pastor Hardwick's group and became Global. The service was a Global meeting so I didn't really get to experience his church plus that was probably more than 15 years ago.

If I were in the Houston area I would probably go there or to Grace church.

Paul Russell, our former Associate pastor, started a church in the Houston area but I don't remember where. I heard that it merged with another church but I don't know the details. You would probably really like him also. He is very positive and has a wicked dry sense of humor.

[Sister Alvear]

http://i199.photobucket.com/albums/aa132/missionary_2007/MVC-002S.jpg my friends and my blood sisters...

[Sister Alvear]

http://i199.photobucket.com/albums/aa132/missionary_2007/MVC-014S.jpg This sister has helped me many times paying my bills and many other things.

[Sister Alvear]

http://i199.photobucket.com/albums/aa132/missionary_2007/MVC-006S.jpg been telling her to sell those rings so I can build another church!

[Sister Alvear]

I am really crying right now...I love my sisters and church has never caused an uneasy moment between us. I pray for them and they pray for me. If love is a fault and failure then I am guilty. Would you pray for me.

[crakjak]

http://i199.photobucket.com/albums/aa132/missionary_2007/MVC-006S.jpg been telling her to sell those rings so I can build another church!

Epley would have a heart attack!!:slaphappy

[Sister Alvear]

My sisters are so kind and loving. When ever I am in a church close to them they always go to hear me or any of our family. Even though I have been gone for 40 years we remain very close. My sister sent me such a pretty card about the story of two different sisters.
I went with one of them to her church to meet some missionaries from China I believe it was. Very sweet caring doctors giving their services to the sick and suffering. I was very impressed by their sacrifice.
I refrain from judging others... I may not see eye to eye or even near eye to eye with some but judging I leave to the Judge of the earth.

I hope in some way even with sometimes my conservative thinking I will not play God. I am a simple person and my motto has always been: preach what you live and live what you preach. That I have tried to do!

[crakjak]

My sisters are so kind and loving. When ever I am in a church close to them they always go to hear me or any of our family. Even though I have been gone for 40 years we remain very close. My sister sent me such a pretty card about the story of two different sisters.
I went with one of them to her church to meet some missionaries from China I believe it was. Very sweet caring doctors giving their services to the sick and suffering. I was very impressed by their sacrifice.
I refrain from judging others... I may not see eye to eye or even near eye to eye with some but judging I leave to the Judge of the earth.

I hope in some way even with sometimes my conservative thinking I will not play God. I am a simple person and my motto has always been: preach what you live and live what you preach. That I have tried to do!

Thank you Sister Alvear, you seem to have a very sweet spirit and attitude, may the Lord continue to bless you in all that you do.