View Full Version : How much stock do you put in prophecy?
Malvaro
02-24-2007, 07:57 PM
How about prophecies made about your ministry or the direction of your life??? Do you think of them as road-signs "silently" guiding your life or milemarkers "confirming" what had been previously said?
I, of course, believe that prophecies are still for today.... and could be right or wrong depending on who said them.... what are some guidelines that you use in deciding whether to write them off or not....
hammondb3klingon1
02-24-2007, 07:58 PM
I have 14 shares.
hammondb3klingon1
02-24-2007, 07:59 PM
Prophecies as in foretelling or preaching with fervency?
Malvaro
02-24-2007, 07:59 PM
I have 14 shares.
what does that mean?
Malvaro
02-24-2007, 08:00 PM
Prophecies as in foretelling or preaching with fervency?
Prophecies as in foretelling
Rhoni
02-24-2007, 08:00 PM
How about prophecies made about your ministry or the direction of your life??? Do you think of them as road-signs "silently" guiding your life or milemarkers "confirming" what had been previously said?
I, of course, believe that prophecies are still for today.... and could be correct or wrong depending on who said them.... what are some guidelines that you use in deciding whether to write them off or not....
I only accept a prophecy toward myself if God has spoken to me first...he then confirms it through the man of God in prophecy.
Blessings, Rhoni
hammondb3klingon1
02-24-2007, 08:02 PM
Foretelling is very interesting. When I here it, IF it lines up with the word, I accept it at face value. Otherwise, I just say thanks and ignore.
Felicity
02-24-2007, 08:09 PM
I get a lot of "prophetic words" and I appreciate the fact God seems to single me out for this often. Most of the time the ones that bear witness with me are the ones that confirm what I've been speaking to God about or feeling like He's been dealing with me about.
I've had people read my mail to the point I was just blown away. God definitely had to have spoken to them and showed them what was going on in my life. There's no other way they could know such intimate details of conversations and dialogue going on between the Lord and I. Just amazing!
Then there are others that I just kind of say, "Okay .... if this is God, fine. If it isn't no big deal. My confidence is in God - not man!" :)
The gift of prophecy is for edification (building up), exhortation (stirring up), and comfort (cheering up or lifting up). Prophecy needs to be judged by the written Word. Prophetic utterances are on a par with testimonies, preaching, and teaching. A person speaks as they think God is guiding them and therefore can be can be affected by the humanness of the person speaking. Prophecy can be ministered vocally as in a testimony or sermon, in a letter or card, in a phone call, in a prayer, etc.
RevDWW
02-24-2007, 08:14 PM
I have 14 shares.
That there is funny :killinme :killinme :killinme :killinme
Buy low, sell high!!!!
RevDWW
02-24-2007, 08:20 PM
I have never had a "word" spoken to me. Having been raise in the UPC and having seen it happen to many around me, I wondered why I never had one. I was in a service were a man of God was ministering. I felt the power of the Spirit. Toward thhe end of am alter service he motion for me to come over to him. "Finally" I thought, a word for me. As I leaned in to hear what he had to say he said "Could you please go get me a cold drink of water". On my way to get it I had to laugh.
Sister Truth Seeker
02-24-2007, 09:30 PM
How about prophecies made about your ministry or the direction of your life??? Do you think of them as road-signs "silently" guiding your life or milemarkers "confirming" what had been previously said?
I, of course, believe that prophecies are still for today.... and could be right or wrong depending on who said them.... what are some guidelines that you use in deciding whether to write them off or not....
I don't know...it depends on who is doing it to start with...and then some things the Bible says we can not know...soooooo not sure. I have never had anyone speak over me before, but I know some who have...some things came to pass some have not as of right now anyway!
The gift of prophecy is for edification (building up), exhortation (stirring up), and comfort (cheering up or lifting up). Prophecy needs to be judged by the written Word. Prophetic utterances are on a par with testimonies, preaching, and teaching. A person speaks as they think God is guiding them and therefore can be can be affected by the humanness of the person speaking. Prophecy can be ministered vocally as in a testimony or sermon, in a letter or card, in a phone call, in a prayer, etc.
Same would apply to tongues and interpretation.
T + I = P
Tongues plus Interpretation equal Prophecy.
Tongues and interpretation are like two nickels and prophecy is like a dime.
sis.m
02-25-2007, 05:39 AM
I had a man of God tell me things about my future when I was a teenager, (a couple of years ago!!), and when I look back it was as he said. I know these were conditional--whether I maintained my walk with the Lord or not. I believe God wants to share with us and give us direction as we follow after Him. It is also His will to edify and build us up. I have also seen "so called prophecies" given and I was a bit horrified because I knew the person being prophecied over was living in sin. I know the Lord may have had a word for that person regarding what the Lord had in store for them if they would turn around, but for those listening who did not understand it would have seemed that the Lord was condoning their sin. It is a good lesson for those who are used in that gift to be very sensitive to what the Lord is telling them. Sometimes a few words can make a big difference in the meaning.
I have never had a "word" spoken to me. Having been raise in the UPC and having seen it happen to many around me, I wondered why I never had one. I was in a service were a man of God was ministering. I felt the power of the Spirit. Toward thhe end of am alter service he motion for me to come over to him. "Finally" I thought, a word for me. As I leaned in to hear what he had to say he said "Could you please go get me a cold drink of water". On my way to get it I had to laugh.
I remember we had a man at our church that was often used in this gift. the service was powerfull and he was calling people out and ministering one on one with so many.
this was in the middle of the time when I was really making decisions about the direction of my own ministry. My prayer time alone was a real struggle and I felt absolutly lost. I was begging God for a "word" .
This guy would walk past me, look at me and keep going. ????????
what was that all about. eventually he went to my mom and spoke to her about me... but not to me.
I went to dinner one night with the evangelist and we talked some. He told me God told him that I would have to figure it out for myself. now aint that sumpen.
The Bible's prophecy: 100%
Prophecy by Christians today: None.
RevDWW
02-25-2007, 07:13 AM
I remember we had a man at our church that was often used in this gift. the service was powerfull and he was calling people out and ministering one on one with so many.
this was in the middle of the time when I was really making decisions about the direction of my own ministry. My prayer time alone was a real struggle and I felt absolutly lost. I was begging God for a "word" .
This guy would walk past me, look at me and keep going. ????????
what was that all about. eventually he went to my mom and spoke to her about me... but not to me.
I went to dinner one night with the evangelist and we talked some. He told me God told him that I would have to figure it out for myself. now aint that sumpen.
I knew I felt a kindred spirit in you. :highfive :friend
Malvaro
02-25-2007, 07:28 AM
The Bible's prophecy: 100%
Prophecy by Christians today: None.
although I dont agree with you, please go into more detail as to why you said that....
whollyHis
02-25-2007, 08:15 AM
There was time in my life, that I believed 100% in personal propecy, given to someone through the man of God. But, over the years, I have seen scads of prophecies NEVER come to pass, and I refuse to believe that it was because it was 'conditional' and that all of those precious folk failed God- thus, losing their 'word' from the Lord. Failed prophecy is NEVER the fault of the Prophet. It's always the person that was prophecied to that is at fault...at least that's what the 'prophets' tell us...*sigh* Where's the accountability? Can someone tell me THAT?
How much 'stock' do I put in personal prophecy? Not much.
Esther
02-25-2007, 08:27 AM
I still believe in prophecy.
Man can fail, but for me almost without exception God confirms it through more than one person.
But it usually takes awhile before it happens. :(
I know some things are given to us conditionally, although there are some that discount that as being a "missed" prophecy. However, they need to go read the bible where got gave conditional promises, I believe it is in Exodus. He gave them a lot of promises IF they would obey His commandments.
Today's generation, we want it now, on our terms, OR it must not have been from God.
Ferd, I think as we mature in God, he sends us less and less Words, because He expects us to mature and get our Words directly from Him. But sometimes we just need a confirmation.
JMO
Sister Alvear
02-25-2007, 09:01 AM
I believe in prophecy...but I do not base my decisions on prophecy...I listen carefully, pray about it and generally wait for what my heart tells me to do. If it is of God things come to pass...I do not believe all missed prophecy is of the devil! There are many factors involved in prophecy.
I have seen people lose out with God running after so called prophets. There must be balance in everything.
Much of the Bible is prophecy...some things have come to pass oter things are future.
I believe in the gift of prophecy...but like anything else it has it's place.
I was associated with some "friends" that really wanted to take over the Brazil work...They gave us a prophecy...we did not do what the prophecy said for us to do because we felt it was from the wrong spirit and time has proven us right...
Be very careful when dealing with prophecy...God can speak and God does speak but He does not go against His written word, the Bible.
Not bragging, but I have been used in the gift of prophecy on certain occasions but I do not feel I am a prophetess. Once in a meeting without realizing what I was doing, I spoke and said, someone here will die tomorrow...we all fell in the alter...the next day a young man that was in the meeting fell dead at work.
I dreamed about a certain preacher and in the dream the Lord spoke to me about a sin in his life and unless he repented he would die...I went to him...he laughed but within weeks he was shot...His wife bent over the coffin crying keep saying over and over, OH! if you would have only listened to the missionary..."
The spirit of the prophet is subject. "Let two or three prophets speak, and let the others weigh what is said. If a revelation is made to another sitting by, let the first be silent. For you can all prophesy one by one, so that all may learn and all be encouraged; and the spirits of prophets are subject to prophets. For God is not a God of confusion but of peace."(1 Corinthians 14:29-33a RSV)
I have no faith in "bathroom and parking lot" prophecies... but there is the Real thing...and we must have enough spirit of God to know the difference...and enough humbleness to harken to the voice of God but one thing for certain God does obey His ORDER set up in HIS word...
although I dont agree with you, please go into more detail as to why you said that....
I said that because I believe the gift of prophecy is not available to any Christians outside of the Christians in the New Testament. The numerous failed prophecies I have witnessed from today's self-proclaimed prophets strengthens that belief. I simply do not buy the excuse that the prophecies failed to come to pass because someone lacked faith, because someone failed to fulfil their part of the prophecy, or any of the other excuses prophets come up with when their prophecies fail. I have had many wonderful and flattering prophecies given to me that my fleshly nature would love to embrace, but I have chosen to reject those prophesies in favor of a Christian faith that relies solely on the written, infallable word of God for guidance.
Sister Alvear
02-25-2007, 11:32 AM
You believe that prophecy no longer exists? If this were true what about the other gifts? Do they no longer exists because someone is a fake healer or someone made up a miracle?
What about the gift of tongues? If one gift would cease then it would seem all gifts ceased...
Sister Alvear
02-25-2007, 11:36 AM
What about gifts of wisdom and knowledge?
Helps is a gift...there are many gifts we find throughout the Bible....
1 Corinthians 12:8-11 :
words of wisdom;
words of knowledge;
faith;
healing;
miracle-working;
prophecy;
distinguishing of spirits;
tongues;
interpretation of tongues.
Sister Alvear
02-25-2007, 11:38 AM
My friend, Christians are a gift to this lost, sick, dying world...
LaVonne
02-25-2007, 01:01 PM
It depends on who is doing the propheseying...
Steve Epley
02-25-2007, 01:18 PM
It depends on who is doing the propheseying...
This is surely true!:highfive
LaGirl
02-25-2007, 01:29 PM
It depends on who is doing the propheseying...
my thoughts EXACTLY!
LadyChocolate
02-25-2007, 02:06 PM
my thoughts EXACTLY!
I see that thou spendeth too much timeth concerning the area of sports... Getteth the sportest offest your mindest.....
Trouvere
02-25-2007, 03:31 PM
I do believe in the gift of prophecy.I have been told numerous things by minsters and they have almost all come to pass and some are yet to come to pass.I don't however go around basing my life on them.They are confirmations and edifications.
They are for the building up of the church(me the church.lol).I do believe that some
prophecy at times out of good will.That is not what I mean.I mean the God given gift.I have been told some awesome things by Brothers Charles Pierce,Freddie Clark,Eldrige Anselmi,James Randall,Sister Shelly Tolbird,Brother Tolbird,an elder I cannot remember his name anymore but who pastored and evanglized from Mansfield,La,Brother David Cheramie,Brother Gordon Winslow,Brother Strange,
Brother Beard,Sister Lois Mitchell and many other ministers.
God still has those today that are used and speak thus saith the Lord.
Do I run to prophecy meetings? No it just happens in church service and sometimes I get emails telling me things etc.God still works this way.
How about prophecies made about your ministry or the direction of your life??? Do you think of them as road-signs "silently" guiding your life or milemarkers "confirming" what had been previously said?
I, of course, believe that prophecies are still for today.... and could be right or wrong depending on who said them.... what are some guidelines that you use in deciding whether to write them off or not....
Prophecy is like knowing where you are going but not how fast you will get there.
All I am concerned about is the time between birth and death.
If God tarries we will all die.
Not knowing how fast I will get there either way.
So many men have played with the time calculator.
Remember the 88 reasons Christ was to return in 1988.
What a joke....
The prophectic word for any of us is this....
Stay in the truth and committed to God and repent of your sins.
And you will see the Kingdom of God...
LaGirl
02-25-2007, 05:12 PM
I see that thou spendeth too much timeth concerning the area of sports... Getteth the sportest offest your mindest.....
like i said.....depends on the person! :tease :tease :tease :tease
HeavenlyOne
02-25-2007, 08:04 PM
I no longer believe in prophecy. Prophecy preachers burned me out on that a long time ago.
Sherri
02-25-2007, 08:11 PM
H.O., I'm sorry that you feel that way about prophecies, because there are true prophets. My husband isn't a prophet, but he is often used in the prophetic gifting. I have heard him get very specific and God has used him mightily in this gift. He always tells people though to write it down and pray about it; not to change anything in their lives because of what someone prophesies. I think prophecies are for confirmation of what God is already doing in your life.
Sister Alvear
02-25-2007, 08:57 PM
Sherri will you pm me your phone number? thanks..
H.O., I'm sorry that you feel that way about prophecies, because there are true prophets. My husband isn't a prophet, but he is often used in the prophetic gifting. I have heard him get very specific and God has used him mightily in this gift. He always tells people though to write it down and pray about it; not to change anything in their lives because of what someone prophesies. I think prophecies are for confirmation of what God is already doing in your life.
That sounds like a good, common sense way to look at the gift of prophecy.
Trouvere
02-25-2007, 09:33 PM
Prophecy is like knowing where you are going but not how fast you will get there.
All I am concerned about is the time between birth and death.
If God tarries we will all die.
Not knowing how fast I will get there either way.
So many men have played with the time calculator.
Remember the 88 reasons Christ was to return in 1988.
What a joke....
The prophectic word for any of us is this....
Stay in the truth and committed to God and repent of your sins.
And you will see the Kingdom of God...
Brother I think you are looking at a different subject such as eschatology.
HeavenlyOne
02-25-2007, 10:40 PM
H.O., I'm sorry that you feel that way about prophecies, because there are true prophets. My husband isn't a prophet, but he is often used in the prophetic gifting. I have heard him get very specific and God has used him mightily in this gift. He always tells people though to write it down and pray about it; not to change anything in their lives because of what someone prophesies. I think prophecies are for confirmation of what God is already doing in your life.
I have no doubt that God uses people for this purpose. I don't put much stock into it, however. I didn't mean to offend you.
Felicity
02-26-2007, 01:18 AM
There was time in my life, that I believed 100% in personal propecy, given to someone through the man of God. But, over the years, I have seen scads of prophecies NEVER come to pass, and I refuse to believe that it was because it was 'conditional' and that all of those precious folk failed God- thus, losing their 'word' from the Lord. Failed prophecy is NEVER the fault of the Prophet. It's always the person that was prophecied to that is at fault...at least that's what the 'prophets' tell us...*sigh* Where's the accountability? Can someone tell me THAT?
How much 'stock' do I put in personal prophecy? Not much.Being given a prophetic word isn't always about foretelling. It's forthtelling :) in other words simply someone speaking into your life with a word of knowledge or word of wisdom that oftentimes confirms what God has already spoken to you and lets you know God knows where you're at and gives added knowledge or wisdom to encourage you in your situation.
I had this happen again just last Sunday AM. I was praying with someone else in the altar and the evangelist came along, laid hands on me and began to minister to me in the Holy Ghost and woah!! ... was the presence of God ever powerful and real.
He had no clue as to my own personal circumstances or situation or what's been going on in my life, my head or my heart yet he spoke directly and nailed right on the head where I've been at in regards to ministry.
I asked my husband yesterday if he's been talking to this preacher about me. He assured me that no, he definitely had not! That let me know that God spoke through this man with the word of knowledge and totally zeroed in on where I've been at .... like I said in regard to my own personal walk with God and usefulness and then let me know what the truth is, what God has for me and the promise that God's anointing, presence and power is with me.
Now it's up to me ..... (as it always is with all of us of course :)) ..... whether or not I'm going to get on board and cooperate with what God is wanting and desiring and got planned for me.
originalsecretplace
02-26-2007, 06:27 AM
How about prophecies made about your ministry or the direction of your life??? Do you think of them as road-signs "silently" guiding your life or milemarkers "confirming" what had been previously said?
I, of course, believe that prophecies are still for today.... and could be right or wrong depending on who said them.... what are some guidelines that you use in deciding whether to write them off or not....
I believe in the gift of prophecy but I am very skeptical about how it's done today.
There is an office of Prophet which seems to be filled with many pretenders. There seems to be the prophecy circus that comes to town every so often that gets some people excited and into the building but doesn't seem to have any lasting effect when it leaves. In my own experience most personal prophecies are very vague and really could mean anything. Also, I've never heard anyone I know personally have a prophecy come true.
I've been at meetings where many things were promised as the "prophecy guy" was scheduled to speak to get people hyped up. People were prayed for but there were no healings; people were called out but there were nothing substantial. Of course, the excuse was that people's faith was low.
One other thing I noticed was that the prophecies were given mostly to the ministry. of course, they are the ones that invite people back.
If you think I've been disappointed and disallusioned by these meetings you are correct.
I've had more direction and God's will shown in my life by my brothers and sisters ministering daily than by the "prophet" coming to town. In those cases there was alot less hype and alot more ministry and substantial results.
Fireside
02-26-2007, 06:33 AM
I am very saddened to read the accounts of those who have been so jaded by all the fluff and nonsense that passes for the gifts these days in some places.
I am so thankful that I have been acquainted with the real.
originalsecretplace
02-26-2007, 06:42 AM
I am very saddened to read the accounts of those who have been so jaded by all the fluff and nonsense that passes for the gifts these days in some places.
I am so thankful that I have been acquainted with the real.
Don't even get me started on the REAL reason some of these people are invited to a church or set up shop in your neighbourhood.
It's all about the money....
I don't think ALL of these people who minister in prophecy are into it for the money but I haven't met one who wasn't either invited to get people to give to the cause de jour and/or told you that you had to show your faith by giving money before God could do His work. :sad
I thinl they like to call it "planting a seed". To me it's almost like paying for someone to read your palm.
philjones
02-26-2007, 06:56 AM
Don't even get me started on the REAL reason some of these people are invited to a church or set up shop in your neighbourhood.
It's all about the money....
I don't think ALL of these people who minister in prophecy are into it for the money but I haven't met one who wasn't either invited to get people to give to the cause de jour and/or told you that you had to show your faith by giving money before God could do His work. :sad
I thinl they like to call it "planting a seed". To me it's almost like paying for someone to read your palm.
Almost sounds like you are speaking evil of a native son of the North country!:tease :tease
LadyChocolate
02-26-2007, 07:26 AM
like i said.....depends on the person! :tease :tease :tease :tease
now, it doesn't take a prophet to see this!!! :heeheehee
Esther
02-26-2007, 07:36 AM
I believe in prophecy...but I do not base my decisions on prophecy...I listen carefully, pray about it and generally wait for what my heart tells me to do. If it is of God things come to pass...I do not believe all missed prophecy is of the devil! There are many factors involved in prophecy.
I have seen people lose out with God running after so called prophets. There must be balance in everything.
Much of the Bible is prophecy...some things have come to pass oter things are future.
I believe in the gift of prophecy...but like anything else it has it's place.
I was associated with some "friends" that really wanted to take over the Brazil work...They gave us a prophecy...we did not do what the prophecy said for us to do because we felt it was from the wrong spirit and time has proven us right...
Be very careful when dealing with prophecy...God can speak and God does speak but He does not go against His written word, the Bible.
Not bragging, but I have been used in the gift of prophecy on certain occasions but I do not feel I am a prophetess. Once in a meeting without realizing what I was doing, I spoke and said, someone here will die tomorrow...we all fell in the alter...the next day a young man that was in the meeting fell dead at work.
I dreamed about a certain preacher and in the dream the Lord spoke to me about a sin in his life and unless he repented he would die...I went to him...he laughed but within weeks he was shot...His wife bent over the coffin crying keep saying over and over, OH! if you would have only listened to the missionary..."
The spirit of the prophet is subject. "Let two or three prophets speak, and let the others weigh what is said. If a revelation is made to another sitting by, let the first be silent. For you can all prophesy one by one, so that all may learn and all be encouraged; and the spirits of prophets are subject to prophets. For God is not a God of confusion but of peace."(1 Corinthians 14:29-33a RSV)
I have no faith in "bathroom and parking lot" prophecies... but there is the Real thing...and we must have enough spirit of God to know the difference...and enough humbleness to harken to the voice of God but one thing for certain God does obey His ORDER set up in HIS word...
Not sure what you are implying here? Do you think God is limited where He can work? Knowing you as I think I do, I would be surprised. Therefore, that is why I am asking for a clarification on what you meant here.)
I said that because I believe the gift of prophecy is not available to any Christians outside of the Christians in the New Testament. The numerous failed prophecies I have witnessed from today's self-proclaimed prophets strengthens that belief. I simply do not buy the excuse that the prophecies failed to come to pass because someone lacked faith, because someone failed to fulfil their part of the prophecy, or any of the other excuses prophets come up with when their prophecies fail. I have had many wonderful and flattering prophecies given to me that my fleshly nature would love to embrace, but I have chosen to reject those prophesies in favor of a Christian faith that relies solely on the written, infallable word of God for guidance.
What scripture to you use to back up that statement?:ranting
I no longer believe in prophecy. Prophecy preachers burned me out on that a long time ago.
That is sad to say. But I know there are people who don't believe in doctors either because of bad experiences. Doesn't mean every doctor is a quack, no more than every prophecy is a quack.
I believe in the gift of prophecy but I am very skeptical about how it's done today.
There is an office of Prophet which seems to be filled with many pretenders. There seems to be the prophecy circus that comes to town every so often that gets some people excited and into the building but doesn't seem to have any lasting effect when it leaves. In my own experience most personal prophecies are very vague and really could mean anything. Also, I've never heard anyone I know personally have a prophecy come true.
I've been at meetings where many things were promised as the "prophecy guy" was scheduled to speak to get people hyped up. People were prayed for but there were no healings; people were called out but there were nothing substantial. Of course, the excuse was that people's faith was low.
One other thing I noticed was that the prophecies were given mostly to the ministry. of course, they are the ones that invite people back.
If you think I've been disappointed and disallusioned by these meetings you are correct.
I've had more direction and God's will shown in my life by my brothers and sisters ministering daily than by the "prophet" coming to town. In those cases there was alot less hype and alot more ministry and substantial results.
I have been to these meetings and seem people healed as I have been also.
Sometimes I guess we see what we want to see. :dunno
I am very saddened to read the accounts of those who have been so jaded by all the fluff and nonsense that passes for the gifts these days in some places.
I am so thankful that I have been acquainted with the real.
Here to!
It is very sad to see folks lose faith in all the gifts that God has blessed the church with.
Reminds me of the word DECEPTION, many deceived in many ways. :(
LadyChocolate
02-26-2007, 07:40 AM
I am very saddened to read the accounts of those who have been so jaded by all the fluff and nonsense that passes for the gifts these days in some places.
I am so thankful that I have been acquainted with the real.
You are so right, brother.... I have had the displeasure of seeing the fakes out there. I remember being a service where a brother told my father in law that he was going to get an "important" phone call this week and it was supposed to have something to do with 10,000.00 dollars. I had to drop my head to hide my laughter because my inlaws were the only people in the church at that time with out a phone. I saw the big collections afterward and how people are just on the edge of their seats just hoping something will be said to the "from God". That kinda of stuff really made me sick...
HOWEVER:
With the crazies out there like that, THE REAL POWER OF GOD IS STILL WORKING. I have seen men of God speak to people and he was just reading their mail. we were in service one night a the evangelist was just preaching away when he turned to my husband and I and totally out of context with his message, began to say " when the doctors say it is impossible, just look at the baby right there in your arms...." The next day we got a phone call about the test that were taken the child I was carrying at the time and it was not good. We'd seen it before and experienced death. We called or pastor---prayer was made----and the doctors called us back and said they made a mistake...they didn't read the reports right! No, they didn't make a mistake, God turned the situation around.....! I have had men of God say things to me, that I know noone else knew because I don't talk to people about my problems. I remember on minister told my husband something about me and it bothered me for years, but I knew he was right.....Years later a different man of God came by and confirmed that and spoke to me! It was exactly what I had been praying about. God's power is still working among the fakes and phonies... GOD is still talking to HIS people. I don't care how many false prophets come by, I know the real God and I know His voice....... Truth will always prevail....Why would you get soo disheartened by the fake that you give up on God?
Esther
02-26-2007, 08:02 AM
You are so right, brother.... I have had the displeasure of seeing the fakes out there. I remember being a service where a brother told my father in law that he was going to get an "important" phone call this week and it was supposed to have something to do with 10,000.00 dollars. I had to drop my head to hide my laughter because my inlaws were the only people in the church at that time with out a phone. I saw the big collections afterward and how people are just on the edge of their seats just hoping something will be said to the "from God". That kinda of stuff really made me sick...
HOWEVER:
With the crazies out there like that, THE REAL POWER OF GOD IS STILL WORKING. I have seen men of God speak to people and he was just reading their mail. we were in service one night a the evangelist was just preaching away when he turned to my husband and I and totally out of context with his message, began to say " when the doctors say it is impossible, just look at the baby right there in your arms...." The next day we got a phone call about the test that were taken the child I was carrying at the time and it was not good. We'd seen it before and experienced death. We called or pastor---prayer was made----and the doctors called us back and said they made a mistake...they didn't read the reports right! No, they didn't make a mistake, God turned the situation around.....! I have had men of God say things to me, that I know noone else knew because I don't talk to people about my problems. I remember on minister told my husband something about me and it bothered me for years, but I knew he was right.....Years later a different man of God came by and confirmed that and spoke to me! It was exactly what I had been praying about. God's power is still working among the fakes and phonies... GOD is still talking to HIS people. I don't care how many false prophets come by, I know the real God and I know His voice....... Truth will always prevail....Why would you get soo disheartened by the fake that you give up on God?
Good post!
Fireside
02-26-2007, 08:04 AM
There has to be a real before there can ever be a counterfeit.
MrsMcD
02-26-2007, 08:09 AM
I received prophecy yesterday and I know that God spoke through the evangelist because the evangelist did not know me. He had only sat beside me at a restaurant the night before. We didn’t talk about anything personal that would give him any ammunition to say anything to me. He did tell me the night before that he had a word from God for me. God gave it to him while he was sitting beside me. I know the prophecy came from God because what was said to me by this evangelist, only God knew how I felt and what I was thinking. Never had I said anything to anybody.
I am thankful that God cares enough about me to speak to me. I am also thankful that there are men of God willing to listen and obey him.
philjones
02-26-2007, 08:11 AM
There has to be a real before there can ever be a counterfeit.
I agree!
Although many operate in the flesh and blame the Holy Spirit of our God, this in no way negates the reality of the voice of God speaking prophetically through a submitted vessel!:bliss
SPEAK LORD, Thy servant heareth!
LadyChocolate
02-26-2007, 08:14 AM
Don't even get me started on the REAL reason some of these people are invited to a church or set up shop in your neighbourhood.
It's all about the money....
I don't think ALL of these people who minister in prophecy are into it for the money but I haven't met one who wasn't either invited to get people to give to the cause de jour and/or told you that you had to show your faith by giving money before God could do His work. :sad
I thinl they like to call it "planting a seed". To me it's almost like paying for someone to read your palm.
I am very leary of those "prophets" who are invited to come to a church because he is known for his prophetic ministry. People line up at the doors because they want a word. Those kind of people make me think of those who don't want to sacrifice and get on their face and plow their way thru spiritual warfare to get an answer from God ON Their OWN. It saddens me when they pack out a church because a preacher is known for his healing ministry....Because the focus becomes that " this guy can heal me" and the focus is off of God.... And yet, I know that many have been healed in services like these because God honors faith! Faith moves God. I can't stand to see men do what they do "in the name of God" But the real men of God that I know, who are used in prophecy, they are just plain ole preachers (no disrespect meant)who lay on their face before God, who sacrifice their time and seek God's face. They fight thru spiritual warfare, they fast, dig into the Word....yeah, those are the ones that I have faith in......Hearing from God doesn't come cheap.......
Being given a prophetic word isn't always about foretelling. It's forthtelling :) in other words simply someone speaking into your life with a word of knowledge or word of wisdom that oftentimes confirms what God has already spoken to you and lets you know God knows where you're at and gives added knowledge or wisdom to encourage you in your situation.
I had this happen again just last Sunday AM. I was praying with someone else in the altar and the evangelist came along, laid hands on me and began to minister to me in the Holy Ghost and woah!! ... was the presence of God ever powerful and real.
He had no clue as to my own personal circumstances or situation or what's been going on in my life, my head or my heart yet he spoke directly and nailed right on the head where I've been at in regards to ministry.
I asked my husband yesterday if he's been talking to this preacher about me. He assured me that no, he definitely had not! That let me know that God spoke through this man with the word of knowledge and totally zeroed in on where I've been at .... like I said in regard to my own personal walk with God and usefulness and then let me know what the truth is, what God has for me and the promise that God's anointing, presence and power is with me.
Now it's up to me ..... (as it always is with all of us of course :)) ..... whether or not I'm going to get on board and cooperate with what God is wanting and desiring and got planned for me.
Amen, Sis. Felicity...many people do not know the difference.
It is always a blessing when a man or woman of God will speak a word of confirmation in our spirit.
There has to be a real before there can ever be a counterfeit.
I agree, Elder...I have seen and experienced the real thing and it was always such a blessing.
Esther
02-26-2007, 08:29 AM
I am very leary of those "prophets" who are invited to come to a church because he is known for his prophetic ministry. People line up at the doors because they want a word. Those kind of people make me think of those who don't want to sacrifice and get on their face and plow their way thru spiritual warfare to get an answer from God ON Their OWN. It saddens me when they pack out a church because a preacher is known for his healing ministry....Because the focus becomes that " this guy can heal me" and the focus is off of God.... And yet, I know that many have been healed in services like these because God honors faith! Faith moves God. I can't stand to see men do what they do "in the name of God" But the real men of God that I know, who are used in prophecy, they are just plain ole preachers (no disrespect meant)who lay on their face before God, who sacrifice their time and seek God's face. They fight thru spiritual warfare, they fast, dig into the Word....yeah, those are the ones that I have faith in......Hearing from God doesn't come cheap.......
You might not would have been comfortable following Jesus then, because there were masses of people coming for healing.
Why shouldn't they be able to do that today?
LadyChocolate
02-26-2007, 08:33 AM
You might not would have been comfortable following Jesus then, because there were masses of people coming for healing.
Why shouldn't they be able to do that today?
You didn't understand...Maybe I didn't make myself clear.... i am speaking of those who want to make a name for themselves. They want to make a profit form the prophecies. When Christ healed them, he told them not to tell anyone. I know the difference between the real and counterfeit. I have a problem with those who use the name of God for their own glory...I've been in services where the minister was just going about healing and fortelling money to people, and then fill up his guitar case full of money..... I've also been in services where God was truly using the minister and people were healed. I've seen people healed of cancer. I have seen people who have tumors go back to the doc and the tumor be gone. I've have seen disease fall leave, miraculously.... And I watch as the real men of God walk away humbly and they don't even want a thank you because they feel so unworthy to be used by God. They don't ask for more money because they prophecied...... I've seen the difference.
Same would apply to tongues and interpretation.
T + I = P
Tongues plus Interpretation equal Prophecy.
Tongues and interpretation are like two nickels and prophecy is like a dime.Tongues and interpretation have nothing whatsoever to do with prophecy. They are separate gifts. You are spouting mere Pentecostal false "tradition" and not what the Bible itself says.
LaVonne
02-26-2007, 09:17 AM
Being given a prophetic word isn't always about foretelling. It's forthtelling :) in other words simply someone speaking into your life with a word of knowledge or word of wisdom that oftentimes confirms what God has already spoken to you and lets you know God knows where you're at and gives added knowledge or wisdom to encourage you in your situation.
I had this happen again just last Sunday AM. I was praying with someone else in the altar and the evangelist came along, laid hands on me and began to minister to me in the Holy Ghost and woah!! ... was the presence of God ever powerful and real.
He had no clue as to my own personal circumstances or situation or what's been going on in my life, my head or my heart yet he spoke directly and nailed right on the head where I've been at in regards to ministry.
I asked my husband yesterday if he's been talking to this preacher about me. He assured me that no, he definitely had not! That let me know that God spoke through this man with the word of knowledge and totally zeroed in on where I've been at .... like I said in regard to my own personal walk with God and usefulness and then let me know what the truth is, what God has for me and the promise that God's anointing, presence and power is with me.
Now it's up to me ..... (as it always is with all of us of course :)) ..... whether or not I'm going to get on board and cooperate with what God is wanting and desiring and got planned for me.
Felicity, just curious...wouldn't a "word of knowledge" or a "word of wisdom" be just that...I never thought those things to be considered prophesey. I'm sincerely curious about this...we've had several "prophets" come through our church over the years who were basically false prophets in my opinion and focused more on sensationalism. However, I do know a prophet or two among us and have full confidence in their ministry.
Trouvere
02-26-2007, 09:19 AM
Tongues and interpretation have nothing whatsoever to do with prophecy. They are separate gifts. You are spouting mere Pentecostal false "tradition" and not what the Bible itself says.
Brother Chan they can be prophecy for the whole church.The tongue goes forth and then after the interpretation. Still prophecy as a gift stands on its own as well.
Thankfully I have experienced the use of all the gifts in a congregation.
Brother Chan they can be prophecy for the whole church.The tongue goes forth and then after the interpretation. Still prophecy as a gift stands on its own as well.
Thankfully I have experienced the use of all the gifts in a congregation.No. Prophecy is entirely separate from tongues and interpretation.
LaVonne
02-26-2007, 09:26 AM
From what I understand, tongues and interpretation are for the edification of the church.
Edification means moral improvement or guidance.
From what I understand, tongues and interpretation are for the edification of the church.
Edification means moral improvement or guidance.The Greek word for "edification" has the following meanings:
(the act of) building, building up
metaph. edifying, edification
the act of one who promotes another's growth in Christian wisdom, piety, happiness, holiness
a building (i.e. the thing built, edifice)The Greek word is used four times in 1 Corinthians 14 (14:3, 14:5, 14:12, and 14:26); see also how it is used in 1 Corinthians 3:9; it is used elsewhere in the New Testament as well.
LaVonne
02-26-2007, 09:44 AM
The Greek word for "edification" has the following meanings:
(the act of) building, building up
metaph. edifying, edification
the act of one who promotes another's growth in Christian wisdom, piety, happiness, holiness
a building (i.e. the thing built, edifice)The Greek word is used four times in 1 Corinthians 14 (14:3, 14:5, 14:12, and 14:26); see also how it is used in 1 Corinthians 3:9; it is used elsewhere in the New Testament as well.
Great...I did not post all the meanings...
originalsecretplace
02-26-2007, 10:10 AM
I have been to these meetings and seem people healed as I have been also.
Sometimes I guess we see what we want to see. :dunno
I very MUCH wanted to see God move and heal and restore people. That's why I was so very very very disappointed.
I've seen people healed without all the hoopla i.e. saints who can minister in the gifts without the fanfare or the donation.
Great...I did not post all the meanings...I don't see how you got "Edification means moral improvement or guidance."
originalsecretplace
02-26-2007, 10:11 AM
Almost sounds like you are speaking evil of a native son of the North country!:tease :tease
Any resemeblance to anyone living or dead is strictly coincidental. :tease
Esther
02-26-2007, 10:17 AM
I have been to these meetings and seem people healed as I have been also.
Sometimes I guess we see what we want to see. :dunno
I very MUCH wanted to see God move and heal and restore people. That's why I was so very very very disappointed.
I've seen people healed without all the hoopla i.e. saints who can minister in the gifts without the fanfare or the donation.
I have seen both. God is not limited, we are the ones that limit Him. :)
LaVonne
02-26-2007, 10:26 AM
I don't see how you got "Edification means moral improvement or guidance."
Got it off Dictionary.com...I don't think it's such a big deal.
LaVonne
02-26-2007, 10:27 AM
I have seen both. God is not limited, we are the ones that limit Him. :)
That's right!
You might not would have been comfortable following Jesus then, because there were masses of people coming for healing.
Why shouldn't they be able to do that today?
They can, and they do. Look at the masses of sick people who show up at Benny Hinn crusades. Look at all the people who travel to Brazil to be treated by John of God. There is no shortage of people claiming that miraculous healings are available.
But there is, in my opinion, a huge shortage of people who claim to offer miracles that actually deliver. Herein lies the problem. It is not that there isn't enough faith. It's not that there aren't enough people who believe in the miraculous power of God. It's that there are too many people making promises that, unlike Jesus's promises, do not come to pass. Then they add insult to injury by claiming it was the person's own fault for not getting healed.
Mr. Steinway
02-26-2007, 10:37 AM
I know this sounds bad, but I've been around and heard enough over the years to be very skeptic of any prophecy.
If someone were to prophecy to me, I would blow it off unless God gave me a peace about it and confirmed it. Instead of generalities, I would like specifics.
"You will have a great trial come upon you soon, and if you'll put your faith in the Lord, he'll bring you through it!" This has no specifics!
I have great trials on a weekly basis, and the Lord has always brought me through them! I ALREADY KNOW that God will bring me through any trial that comes my way. I don't think I need a prophecy to confirm that! A drunkard can come up to me and prophecy in generalities.
Now, if someone were to come to me and tell me things that the Lord has revealed to them that nobody knew about, they would have my attention!
Got it off Dictionary.com...I don't think it's such a big deal.It's not Bible. :)
originalsecretplace
02-26-2007, 10:42 AM
I have seen both. God is not limited, we are the ones that limit Him. :)
I'm not saying that God can't in either situation. What I'm saying that in my experience I haven't seen the real thing.
And there was no limit placed on God by me. It just didn't happen....
HeavenlyOne
02-26-2007, 12:21 PM
I know this sounds bad, but I've been around and heard enough over the years to be very skeptic of any prophecy.
If someone were to prophecy to me, I would blow it off unless God gave me a peace about it and confirmed it. Instead of generalities, I would like specifics.
"You will have a great trial come upon you soon, and if you'll put your faith in the Lord, he'll bring you through it!" This has no specifics!
I have great trials on a weekly basis, and the Lord has always brought me through them! I ALREADY KNOW that God will bring me through any trial that comes my way. I don't think I need a prophecy to confirm that! A drunkard can come up to me and prophecy in generalities.
Now, if someone were to come to me and tell me things that the Lord has revealed to them that nobody knew about, they would have my attention!
This is pretty much how I feel about it.
Esther
02-26-2007, 12:25 PM
I know this sounds bad, but I've been around and heard enough over the years to be very skeptic of any prophecy.
If someone were to prophecy to me, I would blow it off unless God gave me a peace about it and confirmed it. Instead of generalities, I would like specifics.
"You will have a great trial come upon you soon, and if you'll put your faith in the Lord, he'll bring you through it!" This has no specifics!
I have great trials on a weekly basis, and the Lord has always brought me through them! I ALREADY KNOW that God will bring me through any trial that comes my way. I don't think I need a prophecy to confirm that! A drunkard can come up to me and prophecy in generalities.
Now, if someone were to come to me and tell me things that the Lord has revealed to them that nobody knew about, they would have my attention!
I asked a man of God to pray with me years ago about buying another vehicle as the one I had had a lot of miles and I was not working at the time and my husband had gotten a promotion which meant he was making less money since he no longer got paid for his overtime.
We prayed and the Lord showed him a large white car and then he showed him a small blue truck. He said I am not saying that you will get a white car but that is what the Lord is showing me.
As it turned out, I bought a White Town Car and not to long after that my husband totaled out our car in a tropical storm and bought a blue Ranger truck.
So everything the man of God said came to pass exactly as God showed him.
I do believe in Prophecy.
I know this sounds bad, but I've been around and heard enough over the years to be very skeptic of any prophecy.
If someone were to prophecy to me, I would blow it off unless God gave me a peace about it and confirmed it. Instead of generalities, I would like specifics.
"You will have a great trial come upon you soon, and if you'll put your faith in the Lord, he'll bring you through it!" This has no specifics!
I have great trials on a weekly basis, and the Lord has always brought me through them! I ALREADY KNOW that God will bring me through any trial that comes my way. I don't think I need a prophecy to confirm that! A drunkard can come up to me and prophecy in generalities.
Now, if someone were to come to me and tell me things that the Lord has revealed to them that nobody knew about, they would have my attention!
No, it doesn't sound bad at all...
Really, Felicity hit it when she said that there is a difference between foretelling and forthtelling.
Foretelling would be a specific prophecy...by specific I mean, if someone says that it's going to snow on my house in February, that's not prophetic. I live in Michigan and it's almost a given that it's gonna snow on my house sometime in February.
But if they say that at 12:03 am on February 29th it will snow, they're a prophet...if it snows before or later, they missed it.
So yes, foretelling is specific.
Forthtelling, IMHO, is a confirmation of a word already present in my inner beings. I do not believe God will give you a word He has not already dealt with me about, in some form or fashion. It may be expounded in a more and perfect way, but it will be more or less the same word.
Felicity
02-26-2007, 12:41 PM
There has to be a real before there can ever be a counterfeit.Exactly! And even if somebody makes a mistake or tells me something that's off the wall it doesn't diminish my faith in God or His ability or the fact that these gifts are authentic and still very much a reality in the Church. Like I've said so many times, my faith is in God - not man, but God uses man.
Amen! :)
Esther
02-26-2007, 12:42 PM
No, it doesn't sound bad at all...
Really, Felicity hit it when she said that there is a difference between foretelling and forthtelling.
Foretelling would be a specific prophecy...by specific I mean, if someone says that it's going to snow on my house in February, that's not prophetic. I live in Michigan and it's almost a given that it's gonna snow on my house sometime in February.
But if they say that at 12:03 am on February 29th it will snow, they're a prophet...if it snows before or later, they missed it.
So yes, foretelling is specific.
Forthtelling, IMHO, is a confirmation of a word already present in my inner beings. I do not believe God will give you a word He has not already dealt with me about, in some form or fashion. It may be expounded in a more and perfect way, but it will be more or less the same word.
I agree with all you said except the bold part. Because you are given a specific date doesn't eliminate other dates, IMO. Just as long as it snows on that date is all that matters to me.
Even though you live where it snows often can you say now what day it will snow next? I doubt it. Just that it will most likely snow.
HOWEVER, if you lived here in the South and you said it was going to snow, you wouldn't have to give a date, make sure the year is right. :)
Esther
02-26-2007, 12:42 PM
Exactly! And even if somebody makes a mistake or tells me something that's off the wall it doesn't diminish my faith in God or His ability or the fact that these gifts are authentic and still very much a reality in the Church. Like I've said so many times, my faith is in God - not man, but God uses man.
Amen! :)
I agree.
And I might add, sometimes we miss interpretate what was said.
Exactly! And even if somebody makes a mistake or tells me something that's off the wall it doesn't diminish my faith in God or His ability or the fact that these gifts are authentic and still very much a reality in the Church. Like I've said so many times, my faith is in God - not man, but God uses man.
Amen! :)
Exactly!!
Digging4Truth
02-26-2007, 12:50 PM
True story...
During an all night prayer meeting one brother walked up to a sister and told her that the Lord showed him that she was going to have another baby.
When she told her husband what she had been told he calmly stated (with a slow methodic country drawl) "I'm just glad he's a truck driver and not a prophet. :)
originalsecretplace
02-26-2007, 12:54 PM
They can, and they do. Look at the masses of sick people who show up at Benny Hinn crusades. Look at all the people who travel to Brazil to be treated by John of God. There is no shortage of people claiming that miraculous healings are available.
But there is, in my opinion, a huge shortage of people who claim to offer miracles that actually deliver. Herein lies the problem. It is not that there isn't enough faith. It's not that there aren't enough people who believe in the miraculous power of God. It's that there are too many people making promises that, unlike Jesus's promises, do not come to pass. Then they add insult to injury by claiming it was the person's own fault for not getting healed.
:highfive
Esther
02-26-2007, 12:57 PM
True story...
During an all night prayer meeting one brother walked up to a sister and told her that the Lord showed him that she was going to have another baby.
When she told her husband what she had been told he calmly stated (with a slow methodic country drawl) "I'm just glad he's a truck driver and not a prophet. :)
lol:killinme
Felicity
02-26-2007, 01:07 PM
Felicity, just curious...wouldn't a "word of knowledge" or a "word of wisdom" be just that...I never thought those things to be considered prophesey. I'm sincerely curious about this...we've had several "prophets" come through our church over the years who were basically false prophets in my opinion and focused more on sensationalism. However, I do know a prophet or two among us and have full confidence in their ministry.
Carey .......
The point has already been made that there are those who are out for their own gain or who are deceived in thinking they have this gift, but I know for absolute sure that there are also many genuine men used in this gift. Absolutely.
"Prophetic word" is a term that seems to have become more widely used in the last 30 years or so - least it seems that way to me. Perhaps the following will help in understanding that "prophecy" has more than one definition as the word is used in Scripture.
Propheteia (Gk.) = Prophecy:
A discourse emanating from divine inspiration and declaring the purposes of God, whether by reproving and admonishing the wicked, or comforting the afflicted, or revealing things hidden; esp. by foretelling future events.
Used in the NT of the utterance of OT prophets.
1) of the prediction of events relating to Christ's kingdom and its speedy triumph, together with the consolations and admonitions pertaining to it, the spirit of prophecy, the divine mind, to which the prophetic faculty is due
2) of the endowment and speech of the Christian teachers called prophets
3) the gifts and utterances of these prophets, esp. of the predictions of the works of which, set apart to teach the gospel, will accomplish for the kingdom of Christ
So ... you can see from the above that a prophecy and the calling or office of a prophet isn't all about foretelling. It's also about "FORTHtelling" but can have the element of foretelling in it.
:)
LaVonne
02-26-2007, 01:19 PM
Carey .......
The point has already been made that there are those who are out for their own gain or who are deceived in thinking they have this gift, but I know for absolute sure that there are also many genuine men used in this gift. Absolutely.
"Prophetic word" is a term that seems to have become more widely used in the last 30 years or so - least it seems that way to me. Perhaps the following will help in understanding that "prophecy" has more than one definition as the word is used in Scripture.
Propheteia (Gk.) = Prophecy:
A discourse emanating from divine inspiration and declaring the purposes of God, whether by reproving and admonishing the wicked, or comforting the afflicted, or revealing things hidden; esp. by foretelling future events.
Used in the NT of the utterance of OT prophets.
1) of the prediction of events relating to Christ's kingdom and its speedy triumph, together with the consolations and admonitions pertaining to it, the spirit of prophecy, the divine mind, to which the prophetic faculty is due
2) of the endowment and speech of the Christian teachers called prophets
3) the gifts and utterances of these prophets, esp. of the predictions of the works of which, set apart to teach the gospel, will accomplish for the kingdom of Christ
So ... you can see from the above that a prophecy and the calling or office of a prophet isn't all about foretelling. It's also about "FORTHtelling" but can have the element of foretelling in it.
:)
Felicity,
Thank you for clarifying. I guess I just always thought that a word of knowledge and or a word of wisdom would be separate from a word of prophesey. I'm sorry, I'm probably not making a whole lot of sense.
Now reading your post again, I can see what you are saying. That all of these "words' (knowledge, wisdom, prophesey) can come from a prophet and are not necessarily separate.
:ty
Felicity
02-26-2007, 01:23 PM
Felicity,
Thank you for clarifying. I guess I just always thought that a word of knowledge and or a word of wisdom would be separate from a word of prophesey. I'm sorry, I'm probably not making a whole lot of sense.
Now reading your post again, I can see what you are saying. That all of these "words' (knowledge, wisdom, prophesey) can come from a prophet and are not necessarily separate.
:tyOops, I meant to but forgot to address your point about the possibility of the word of knowledge/wisdom being separate from a prophecy or prophetic word.
They can be separate. Like I mean someone could be praying for you in a general sense and then out of the blue comes a word of knowledge or of wisdom --- a flash of inspiration from the Holy Ghost.
Isn't it awesome how God works? I'm so thankful for anointed called men of God used in the Holy Ghost who minister to us in this way. I've been the recipient many many times!
Like you ..... I believe that the Lord can do ANYTHING! :)
Pastor Keith
02-26-2007, 01:27 PM
Couldnt resist weighing in on this one. You cannot read an OT definition into the NT version of prophecy. The only thing that they have in common is the operation.
Prophecy in the NT is basically "speaking words given by the Holy Spirit".
They have either a foretelling aspect (future things) or can have a forth telling aspect (right now).
Most prophecies are conditional, also if a prophecy is wrong the fault generally lies with that prophetic person. They most likely missed it, misinterpreted the word or vision or just wasn't of God.
Prophetic words need to be judged and evaluated. I Cor. 14 says much about this.
NT prophetic words should not be binding or directive in the sense that it should alread confirm what the receipient knows or feels like God is already saying.
Felicity
02-26-2007, 01:29 PM
Couldnt resist weighing in on this one. You cannot read an OT definition into the NT version of prophecy. The only thing that they have in common is the operation.
Prophecy in the NT is basically "speaking words given by the Holy Spirit".
They have either a foretelling aspect (future things) or can have a forth telling aspect (right now).
Most prophecies are conditional, also if a prophecy is wrong the fault generally lies with that prophetic person. They most likely missed it, misinterpreted the word or vision or just wasn't of God.
Prophetic words need to be judged and evaluated. I Cor. 14 says much about this.
NT prophetic words should not be binding or directive in the sense that it should alread confirm what the receipient knows or feels like God is already saying.Good post.
whollyHis
02-26-2007, 01:30 PM
I was in a service one time, with a well known 'prophet' in the UPCI ranks- he told a lady that she would conceive within tweo years. The church went NUTS. Why?? Because this lady had underwent a complete hysterectomy many years before and could never have children. Folks believed that she was gonna conceive and carry a child with no Womb, no ovaries...She never had a child- and she was devastated, she thought that God was going to perform a miracle in her life.
I have heard prophets tell folks that God was gonna heal them of their cancers in that revival- just to be attending their funeral while still in revival.
Do I believe that God still speaks to us today? Absolutely. But, I no longer have the 'blind faith' in a man as I once did.
Label me however you want.
Pastor Keith
02-26-2007, 01:32 PM
I was in a service one time, with a well known 'prophet' in the UPCI ranks- he told a lady that she would conceive within tweo years. The church went NUTS. Why?? Because this lady had underwent a complete hysterectomy many years before and could never have children. Folks believed that she was gonna conceive and carry a child with no Womb, no ovaries...She never had a child- and she was devastated, she thought that God was going to perform a miracle in her life.
I have heard prophets tell folks that God was gonna heal them of their cancers in that revival- just to be attending their funeral while still in revival.
Do I believe that God still speaks to us today? Absolutely. But, I no longer have the 'blind faith' in a man as I once did.
Label me however you want.
Words like this need to be accountable, that pastor should have a conversation with that prophetic person about these words.
Pastor Keith
02-26-2007, 01:40 PM
The host pastor that I stayed with in India, a few years back he came to the states. He went to a church in Southern California pastored by one of the Munsey brothers. Robert Mitchell, (he is not perfect and has flaws) was there in service, there were approx 2000 or more people there. He was sitting in the back row and had his head down in his bible asking the Lord to speak to him. The service went on and was closing, when Robert Mitchell walked back to where my friend was sitting and put his arm around him and said to him this:
You are a pastor (he was) you are not from here( India) and thus says the Lord you have 10 churches right now (true), but in a one years time you will have 30 churches (this word came to pass exactly as the Lord said it would.
Now we can debate all the wrong prophetic words all we want and there is a time a place for that, but there are legitimate prophets and they do speak amazing words of accuracy for the edification, exhortation and comfort of the body of Christ.
By the way, more damage has been done to people in the body of Christ with erroneous interpretations of scripture than all of the poor examples of the operation of the Gifts of the Spirit in history put together.
revrandy
02-26-2007, 02:04 PM
One thing I notice in the New Testament is that Peter and Paul played down their ministry.. using words like "we're men just like you".... when folks wanted to bow to them...
I think that some have come to accept their "elevated status" to the point of making such mistakes...
I personally do not care for folks that tell you.."They are a Prophet or they used in the gifts"... they like the title... but carry none of the responsibility...
I would prefer someone just tell me what they feel... than to tell me "who" they are...
Trouvere
02-26-2007, 02:08 PM
One thing I notice in the New Testament is that Peter and Paul played down their ministry.. using words like "we're men just like you".... when folks wanted to bow to them...
I think that some have come to accept their "elevated status" to the point of making such mistakes...
I personally do not care for folks that tell you.."They are a Prophet or they used in the gifts"... they like the title... but carry none of the responsibility...
I would prefer someone just tell me what they feel... than to tell me "who" they are...
Some do not hear the living word as it comes forth as the preacher is preaching and prophesying at the same time.Pray before service next time and listen differently.You may hear some surprises.Some leave saying...that preacher sounded like he was at my house.Preaching can be both fortelling and forthtelling.
H.O., I'm sorry that you feel that way about prophecies, because there are true prophets. My husband isn't a prophet, but he is often used in the prophetic gifting. I have heard him get very specific and God has used him mightily in this gift. He always tells people though to write it down and pray about it; not to change anything in their lives because of what someone prophesies. I think prophecies are for confirmation of what God is already doing in your life.
I do believe in the prophetic word....
Brother I think you are looking at a different subject such as eschatology.
You might be right...
Sister Alvear
02-26-2007, 02:19 PM
it is always amazing to me how people fall for all that stuff...where is maturity in Pentecost?
Originally Posted by LaGirl
like i said.....depends on the person
now, it doesn't take a prophet to see this!!! :heeheehee
But I will prophecy the Cubs will lose 95 games this year...
GO Brewers....
Nathan Eckstadt (Milwaukee)
Digging4Truth
02-26-2007, 02:39 PM
Since I did take the time to share a funny incident where someone made a "prophecy" I would like to also take the time to say that I do believe that there are true prophetic words given. Also as some have mentioned... sometimes it tells a future event and sometimes it speaks to the right now.
Several examples...
One saturday night I was up with a terrible flu type thing. No real outward symptoms (runny nose, hoarse voice etc) I just felt terrible and had congestion that just would not quit.
I got up that night and decided that God was going to heal this thing so I could get some rest. I challenged God to heal me. He did not. I spoke scripture... I spoke in absolute faith... nothing.
The next day we went to church. Not even my wife knew of the battle I had faced during the night. I was really upset about this because I had put God on the line and nothing had happened.
A visiting minister was there that day (one who is known for his operation in the prophetic) and during the service he called me out.
He said "Brother I see something right in here (moving his hand over my chest area) I just see something white in this area and it has really tried your faith. God is going to touch you right now brother... and he prayed for me.
I was healed... and I also knew beyond the shadow of a doubt that God knew exactly where I was.
Another example dealing more with the telling of a future happening...
My wife and I had been through 8 months of terrible car trouble. We had 3 vehicles and it was everything we could do to just keep one running enough to get me to work and back. For nearly 2 months we couldn't afford to pay any bills. It took all of our money to just keep a car running so I wouldn't lose my job.
One night on the way to church our car caught fire. We left it on the side of the road and walked to church. That night I danced around with my keys in my hand and the pastors wife said "That's right brother... claim a car" or something like that. I stopped the service and made it known (with all respect to the pastors wife) that I wasn't dancing with my keys claiming a car. I was dancing with my keys and telling the devil "Remember that sound"... Remember when My God took away the keys to death, hell and the grave"
He had tried to defeat me but I made it anyway and I was just making sure he knew that he was defeated one more time. SO Many stories I could tell about that 8 month period.
I remember one time my car died and the battery was dead. I was trying to get home to get to church. I remember standing behind Church's chicken in Minden Lousiana saying to God "You can make the lightning fly from the east to the west and all I need is 12 tiny volts" :) Ahhhh the memories. :)
One night the pastor called me out and said "Brother... I want to tell you something. You have been through a lot but I see a light at the end of the tunnel and it's not a train." :) He said... "God is fixing to send someone to you... someone you would least expect and your coming out of this trial"
Needless to see you would have done well to not be standing near me about that moment. :)
The next morning on the way to work... the transmission went out. LOL I was on my back... under my car... in the driving rain... with 1/4" to 1/2" constant flow of water parting around me like a rock in a river.... with a smile on my face. I had received a word.... I believed the word... and I had hope.
Not long after that a man knocked on my door who basically trusts no one. He has been through a lot has a very big "everybody is out to get me" type mentality and he doesn't do much for people because he is just afraid people will just want what he can do to help them.
he said "Do you know what my preacher preached on this morning?" "He preached on Jesus turning the water into wine. Do you know why Jesus turned the water into wine?
I answered "No sir"
He said... "No one was dying... no one was going to hell... why did he turn the water into wine?"
I still didn't know.
He said "Just to make people happy" He then reached into his pocket and pulled out a set of keys to a used car he had bought and spent several thousand dollars fixing it up real nice for his daughter. She didn't want it. It wasn't nice enough.
He threw the keys across the room to me and said... "Here.... just to make you happy"
Oh friend... there are people who tout their words as prophecies and God is nowhere near it. But through these instances and others like it I have seen the power that a word from God in due season has to shake a life thoroughly with the realization that the Almight God... the creator of this universe... He knows where I am and He cares.
And that realization.... is a life changing event.
(Okay... gotta go now... it's hot in here... my eyes are sweating :) )
LaVonne
02-26-2007, 03:18 PM
Oops, I meant to but forgot to address your point about the possibility of the word of knowledge/wisdom being separate from a prophecy or prophetic word.
They can be separate. Like I mean someone could be praying for you in a general sense and then out of the blue comes a word of knowledge or of wisdom --- a flash of inspiration from the Holy Ghost.
Isn't it awesome how God works? I'm so thankful for anointed called men of God used in the Holy Ghost who minister to us in this way. I've been the recipient many many times!
Like you ..... I believe that the Lord can do ANYTHING! :)
Ok, that's what I thought too...but at first I wasn't sure what you meant. I thought maybe you thought that the word of knowledge/wisdom was not separate from that of a prophet.
Anyway, Thanks!
Malvaro
02-26-2007, 03:22 PM
D4T, awesome testimonies....
Pastor Keith
02-26-2007, 03:25 PM
Since I did take the time to share a funny incident where someone made a "prophecy" I would like to also take the time to say that I do believe that there are true prophetic words given. Also as some have mentioned... sometimes it tells a future event and sometimes it speaks to the right now.
Several examples...
One saturday night I was up with a terrible flu type thing. No real outward symptoms (runny nose, hoarse voice etc) I just felt terrible and had congestion that just would not quit.
I got up that night and decided that God was going to heal this thing so I could get some rest. I challenged God to heal me. He did not. I spoke scripture... I spoke in absolute faith... nothing.
The next day we went to church. Not even my wife knew of the battle I had faced during the night. I was really upset about this because I had put God on the line and nothing had happened.
A visiting minister was there that day (one who is known for his operation in the prophetic) and during the service he called me out.
He said "Brother I see something right in here (moving his hand over my chest area) I just see something white in this area and it has really tried your faith. God is going to touch you right now brother... and he prayed for me.
I was healed... and I also knew beyond the shadow of a doubt that God knew exactly where I was.
Another example dealing more with the telling of a future happening...
My wife and I had been through 8 months of terrible car trouble. We had 3 vehicles and it was everything we could do to just keep one running enough to get me to work and back. For nearly 2 months we couldn't afford to pay any bills. It took all of our money to just keep a car running so I wouldn't lose my job.
One night on the way to church our car caught fire. We left it on the side of the road and walked to church. That night I danced around with my keys in my hand and the pastors wife said "That's right brother... claim a car" or something like that. I stopped the service and made it known (with all respect to the pastors wife) that I wasn't dancing with my keys claiming a car. I was dancing with my keys and telling the devil "Remember that sound"... Remember when My God took away the keys to death, hell and the grave"
He had tried to defeat me but I made it anyway and I was just making sure he knew that he was defeated one more time. SO Many stories I could tell about that 8 month period.
I remember one time my car died and the battery was dead. I was trying to get home to get to church. I remember standing behind Church's chicken in Minden Lousiana saying to God "You can make the lightning fly from the east to the west and all I need is 12 tiny volts" :) Ahhhh the memories. :)
One night the pastor called me out and said "Brother... I want to tell you something. You have been through a lot but I see a light at the end of the tunnel and it's not a train." :) He said... "God is fixing to send someone to you... someone you would least expect and your coming out of this trial"
Needless to see you would have done well to not be standing near me about that moment. :)
The next morning on the way to work... the transmission went out. LOL I was on my back... under my car... in the driving rain... with 1/4" to 1/2" constant flow of water parting around me like a rock in a river.... with a smile on my face. I had received a word.... I believed the word... and I had hope.
Not long after that a man knocked on my door who basically trusts no one. He has been through a lot has a very big "everybody is out to get me" type mentality and he doesn't do much for people because he is just afraid people will just want what he can do to help them.
he said "Do you know what my preacher preached on this morning?" "He preached on Jesus turning the water into wine. Do you know why Jesus turned the water into wine?
I answered "No sir"
He said... "No one was dying... no one was going to hell... why did he turn the water into wine?"
I still didn't know.
He said "Just to make people happy" He then reached into his pocket and pulled out a set of keys to a used car he had bought and spent several thousand dollars fixing it up real nice for his daughter. She didn't want it. It wasn't nice enough.
He threw the keys across the room to me and said... "Here.... just to make you happy"
Oh friend... there are people who tout their words as prophecies and God is nowhere near it. But through these instances and others like it I have seen the power that a word from God in due season has to shake a life thoroughly with the realization that the Almight God... the creator of this universe... He knows where I am and He cares.
And that realization.... is a life changing event.
(Okay... gotta go now... it's hot in here... my eyes are sweating :) )
A good example why we need body life, yes God is soveriegn and can and does heal people anywhere. But we far underestimate the role the Body (people, flesh and blood) plays in healing and deliverance. These gifts operate in the body life of believers. God had healing for you, but he had to wait for you to get in the presence of the body. It really does matter who prays for you according to I Cor. 12.
Digging4Truth
02-26-2007, 03:27 PM
A good example why we need body life, yes God is soveriegn and can and does heal people anywhere. But we far underestimate the role the Body (people, flesh and blood) plays in healing and deliverance. These gifts operate in the body life of believers. God had healing for you, but he had to wait for you to get in the presence of the body. It really does matter who prays for you according to I Cor. 12.
Thanks for posting this Brother Keith....
Although the testimony happened to me I never saw what you have said here myself. What a great edification.
My not seeing what you have shared here is just another example of how incomplete we are without the rest of the body.
LaVonne
02-26-2007, 03:33 PM
Since I did take the time to share a funny incident where someone made a "prophecy" I would like to also take the time to say that I do believe that there are true prophetic words given. Also as some have mentioned... sometimes it tells a future event and sometimes it speaks to the right now.
Several examples...
One saturday night I was up with a terrible flu type thing. No real outward symptoms (runny nose, hoarse voice etc) I just felt terrible and had congestion that just would not quit.
I got up that night and decided that God was going to heal this thing so I could get some rest. I challenged God to heal me. He did not. I spoke scripture... I spoke in absolute faith... nothing.
The next day we went to church. Not even my wife knew of the battle I had faced during the night. I was really upset about this because I had put God on the line and nothing had happened.
A visiting minister was there that day (one who is known for his operation in the prophetic) and during the service he called me out.
He said "Brother I see something right in here (moving his hand over my chest area) I just see something white in this area and it has really tried your faith. God is going to touch you right now brother... and he prayed for me.
I was healed... and I also knew beyond the shadow of a doubt that God knew exactly where I was.
Another example dealing more with the telling of a future happening...
My wife and I had been through 8 months of terrible car trouble. We had 3 vehicles and it was everything we could do to just keep one running enough to get me to work and back. For nearly 2 months we couldn't afford to pay any bills. It took all of our money to just keep a car running so I wouldn't lose my job.
One night on the way to church our car caught fire. We left it on the side of the road and walked to church. That night I danced around with my keys in my hand and the pastors wife said "That's right brother... claim a car" or something like that. I stopped the service and made it known (with all respect to the pastors wife) that I wasn't dancing with my keys claiming a car. I was dancing with my keys and telling the devil "Remember that sound"... Remember when My God took away the keys to death, hell and the grave"
He had tried to defeat me but I made it anyway and I was just making sure he knew that he was defeated one more time. SO Many stories I could tell about that 8 month period.
I remember one time my car died and the battery was dead. I was trying to get home to get to church. I remember standing behind Church's chicken in Minden Lousiana saying to God "You can make the lightning fly from the east to the west and all I need is 12 tiny volts" :) Ahhhh the memories. :)
One night the pastor called me out and said "Brother... I want to tell you something. You have been through a lot but I see a light at the end of the tunnel and it's not a train." :) He said... "God is fixing to send someone to you... someone you would least expect and your coming out of this trial"
Needless to see you would have done well to not be standing near me about that moment. :)
The next morning on the way to work... the transmission went out. LOL I was on my back... under my car... in the driving rain... with 1/4" to 1/2" constant flow of water parting around me like a rock in a river.... with a smile on my face. I had received a word.... I believed the word... and I had hope.
Not long after that a man knocked on my door who basically trusts no one. He has been through a lot has a very big "everybody is out to get me" type mentality and he doesn't do much for people because he is just afraid people will just want what he can do to help them.
he said "Do you know what my preacher preached on this morning?" "He preached on Jesus turning the water into wine. Do you know why Jesus turned the water into wine?
I answered "No sir"
He said... "No one was dying... no one was going to hell... why did he turn the water into wine?"
I still didn't know.
He said "Just to make people happy" He then reached into his pocket and pulled out a set of keys to a used car he had bought and spent several thousand dollars fixing it up real nice for his daughter. She didn't want it. It wasn't nice enough.
He threw the keys across the room to me and said... "Here.... just to make you happy"
Oh friend... there are people who tout their words as prophecies and God is nowhere near it. But through these instances and others like it I have seen the power that a word from God in due season has to shake a life thoroughly with the realization that the Almight God... the creator of this universe... He knows where I am and He cares.
And that realization.... is a life changing event.
(Okay... gotta go now... it's hot in here... my eyes are sweating :) )
That's awesome!!! We serve an awesome God!!!
By the way, more damage has been done to people in the body of Christ with erroneous interpretations of scripture than all of the poor examples of the operation of the Gifts of the Spirit in history put together.
This statement actually scares me. How can you possibly measure the amount of damage that has been done by false prophecies?
From what I understand, tongues and interpretation are for the edification of the church.
Edification means moral improvement or guidance.
And so is prophecy for edification.
Steve Epley
03-01-2007, 09:38 PM
My all time favorite is you have a condition in the lower area of your body!
Digging4Truth
03-01-2007, 09:40 PM
This statement actually scares me. How can you possibly measure the amount of damage that has been done by false prophecies?
Dude... I love you avatar... That is just fantastic. :)
My all time favorite is you have a condition in the lower area of your body!
or
there is a woman here with female trouble
or
there is someone here tonight with back trouble
or
somebody here tonight has been suffering with headaches
or
somebody here has not been sleeping well at night
etc
1 Thessalonians 5 gives 22 commandments for Christians.
three of them are
despise not prophesyings (don't look down on prophesying)
prove all things (check it out)
hold fast that which is good (hang onto the good stuff)
Remember this mathematical formula
P=T+I which stands for
Prophecy equals tongues plus interpretatation
Prophecy is like a dime and tongues and interpretation are like 2 nickels
When someone gives a message in tongues and interpretation or when someone prophesies publicly, listen to it and then test it. One test is, does it agree with the written Word? Another test is does it edify (build up), exhort (stir up) or comfort (build up or lift up)? Don't give any more credence to a prophetic word than you do to a sermon, testimony, etc. It's not the same as when God wrote the 10 commandments on stone tablets or when He inspired the prophets to write what became our Scriptures. What prophecy or tongues and interpretation are SUPPOSED to be are someone expressing what they think God is leading or guiding them to say at a particular time. What they CAN be is someone "faking it" for some reason or another, maybe for control or to appear more spiritual than others or it may be someone feeling strongly about something and expressing it this way thinking their feelings are God-given. Messages given this way can express what a person believes even if what that person believes is wrong. In the early days of the Pentecostal movement there were times when teaching was given in tongues and interpretation and people were warned against eating pork, etc because that was a bias of the person giving the interpretation. Thomas Fudge tells about Nathan Urshan giving a prophecy at Harvey Camp in New Brunswick in the late 1960s which said, "Yea, yea, I say unto you. There is no salvation outside of being baptized in water and Spirit in the name of Jesus." (page 160 of CWtC. Now, what was Bro. Urshan doing? I don't know his heart, only God does. But he was at a camp meeting where many of the ministers did not believe that water and Spirit baptism were necessary for salvation. He may have been deliberately faking it, trying to impress the people there with a "message directly from God" that backed up what he believed and did not agree with what they believed. Or (and I hope this is true) he may have so strongly believed that he was right and the ministers in that district were wrong that he sincerely believed that God wanted him to deliver that message to them.
That's why I say that we need to check out messages in tongues and interpretation and prophecy and if they sound like they line up with the Bible and they build up, stir up, lift up, etc, take them as a word from God. If they don't ring true, file them and forget them like you do lots of other stuff you hear that you know isn't right.
God works through humans and all humans are imperfect. On this side of Heaven, we "know in part" and we "prophesy in part."
Steve Epley
03-02-2007, 08:00 AM
1 Thessalonians 5 gives 22 commandments for Christians.
three of them are
despise not prophesyings (don't look down on prophesying)
prove all things (check it out)
hold fast that which is good (hang onto the good stuff)
Remember this mathematical formula
P=T+I which stands for
Prophecy equals tongues plus interpretatation
Prophecy is like a dime and tongues and interpretation are like 2 nickels
When someone gives a message in tongues and interpretation or when someone prophesies publicly, listen to it and then test it. One test is, does it agree with the written Word? Another test is does it edify (build up), exhort (stir up) or comfort (build up or lift up)? Don't give any more credence to a prophetic word than you do to a sermon, testimony, etc. It's not the same as when God wrote the 10 commandments on stone tablets or when He inspired the prophets to write what became our Scriptures. What prophecy or tongues and interpretation are SUPPOSED to be are someone expressing what they think God is leading or guiding them to say at a particular time. What they CAN be is someone "faking it" for some reason or another, maybe for control or to appear more spiritual than others or it may be someone feeling strongly about something and expressing it this way thinking their feelings are God-given. Messages given this way can express what a person believes even if what that person believes is wrong. In the early days of the Pentecostal movement there were times when teaching was given in tongues and interpretation and people were warned against eating pork, etc because that was a bias of the person giving the interpretation. Thomas Fudge tells about Nathan Urshan giving a prophecy at Harvey Camp in New Brunswick in the late 1960s which said, "Yea, yea, I say unto you. There is no salvation outside of being baptized in water and Spirit in the name of Jesus." (page 160 of CWtC. Now, what was Bro. Urshan doing? I don't know his heart, only God does. But he was at a camp meeting where many of the ministers did not believe that water and Spirit baptism were necessary for salvation. He may have been deliberately faking it, trying to impress the people there with a "message directly from God" that backed up what he believed and did not agree with what they believed. Or (and I hope this is true) he may have so strongly believed that he was right and the ministers in that district were wrong that he sincerely believed that God wanted him to deliver that message to them.
That's why I say that we need to check out messages in tongues and interpretation and prophecy and if they sound like they line up with the Bible and they build up, stir up, lift up, etc, take them as a word from God. If they don't ring true, file them and forget them like you do lots of other stuff you hear that you know isn't right.
God works through humans and all humans are imperfect. On this side of Heaven, we "know in part" and we "prophesy in part."
Elder Urshan's prophecy at Harvey Camp may have been the only genuine given there??????????????? At least it was Biblical. But as a disclaimer I wonder if anyone remembers this from the Harvey camp??? Felicity do you remmeber folks talking about this???? I asked EF he didn't remember it.
Nahum
03-02-2007, 08:20 AM
A lot.
My all time favorite is you have a condition in the lower area of your body!
I actually attended a revival where the evangelist gave out words of knowledge, and every single word of knowledge was for someone who had pain in some part of their body.
"There are 3 people in that section over there with pain in your right knee. There's somebody in that section over there with pain in your left shoulder."
Pastor Keith
03-02-2007, 12:04 PM
This statement actually scares me. How can you possibly measure the amount of damage that has been done by false prophecies?
Take a deep breath, with over 33,000 different denominations, each with their own take or interpretation of the scripture, not to mention tri-theistic doctrines, churches and movements that deny the virgin birth, the Holy Ghost, advocate sprinkling of infants, or teach millennialism. How can you deny that false teaching and erroneous teachings have done more damage to the church and people in general than someone giving a false prophecy or word of knowledge.
How can you deny that false teaching and erroneous teachings have done more damage to the church and people in general than someone giving a false prophecy or word of knowledge.
Because it's impossible to measure how many people and to what extent their lives were harmed by false prophecies.
Steve Epley
03-02-2007, 12:23 PM
Because it's impossible to measure how many people and to what extent their lives were harmed by false prophecies.
I have personally witnessed folks lives destroyed forever over reckless 'prophecies'. But it is tOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO late whem the home's destroyed to say I missed it.
Pastor Keith
03-02-2007, 12:27 PM
Because it's impossible to measure how many people and to what extent their lives were harmed by false prophecies.
Good read a book on church history! You will find that my generalizations are really only part of the story.
Pastor Keith
03-02-2007, 12:28 PM
I have personally witnessed folks lives destroyed forever over reckless 'prophecies'. But it is tOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO late whem the home's destroyed to say I missed it.
I bet the # of homes destoryed with false teaching far outweighs whatever has been done because some prophet gave a wrong word or a general word of knowledge.
Pastor Keith
03-02-2007, 12:29 PM
Because it's impossible to measure how many people and to what extent their lives were harmed by false prophecies.
Ever hear of the Roman Catholic Church?
A lot.
What post or question is your answer "a lot" in response to?
Steve Epley
03-02-2007, 12:43 PM
I bet the # of homes destoryed with false teaching far outweighs whatever has been done because some prophet gave a wrong word or a general word of knowledge.
True however we were discussing personal prophecy. I have PERSONALLY seen up close homes destroyed beyond repair over personal prophecy. However after saying that I do believe the gift is in the church today. But 1 miss and your out you don't get a second try. Prophecy and guessing is not the same.
Esther
03-02-2007, 12:49 PM
True however we were discussing personal prophecy. I have PERSONALLY seen up close homes destroyed beyond repair over personal prophecy. However after saying that I do believe the gift is in the church today. But 1 miss and your out you don't get a second try. Prophecy and guessing is not the same.
Should this not be used for the same standard of preaching? After all, lives are being weighed in the balance. Did you preach what God wanted or what man wanted? (you-not being you specific)
Pastor Keith
03-02-2007, 12:52 PM
True however we were discussing personal prophecy. I have PERSONALLY seen up close homes destroyed beyond repair over personal prophecy. However after saying that I do believe the gift is in the church today. But 1 miss and your out you don't get a second try. Prophecy and guessing is not the same.
That is why we are not to depise personal prophecy but put it to the tests and checks found in scripture, the fact is that there hasnt been much teaching done on this wonderful gift therefore abuses abound.
My point is when weighed in the balance more damage has been done to the church and individuals through bad teaching than spiritual gifts gone bad.
Steve Epley
03-02-2007, 12:53 PM
Should this not be used for the same standard of preaching? After all, lives are being weighed in the balance. Did you preach what God wanted or what man wanted? (you-not being you specific)
How my preaching has not told you marry so and so saith the Lord!!! My preaching has not said sell all you have move across the country saith the Lord. My preaching has said the Lord doesn't care that we are having this "affair" saith the Lord.
Should this not be used for the same standard of preaching? After all, lives are being weighed in the balance. Did you preach what God wanted or what man wanted? (you-not being you specific)
these are vastly different things. can you explain what you mean by preaching and missing?
are you suggesting that if a guy preaches about standards but cant back up the claim with scripture, or you can refute his claim with scripture, that this is the same as some guy who claims in a prophetic utterance that something will happen but doesnt?
Esther
03-19-2007, 03:56 PM
these are vastly different things. can you explain what you mean by preaching and missing?
are you suggesting that if a guy preaches about standards but cant back up the claim with scripture, or you can refute his claim with scripture, that this is the same as some guy who claims in a prophetic utterance that something will happen but doesnt?
Yes, where I am going with this, (been awhile since I posted I hope I remember) is/was that some hold a prophet as hearing from God so he can't be allowed to miss, but it is just as important when a preacher gets behind the pulpit speaking to a mass of people that he hear from God and not miss either.
Who knows if someone in the congregration it could be their last opportunity to hear the truth. Is that not more important?
Joelel
03-20-2007, 12:05 PM
How about prophecies made about your ministry or the direction of your life??? Do you think of them as road-signs "silently" guiding your life or milemarkers "confirming" what had been previously said?
I, of course, believe that prophecies are still for today.... and could be right or wrong depending on who said them.... what are some guidelines that you use in deciding whether to write them off or not....
Hi Malvaro,When someone tells you about direction of your life is the gift of knowledge it is not prophecy.,prophecy is to preach or teach or fortell.Prophecy has a three fold meaning.If someone gives direction by gift of knowledge it may come to pass if you obey but prophecy(fortell) will come to pass if it's not head realm prophecy.
Sabellius1
03-27-2007, 09:44 PM
Shalom Shalom
Prophecy can be towards and Individual or group.It can be towards a Nation or Ethnic or upon the Righteous or UnRighteous.Upon Males or Females.Prophecy can come as Punishment or Blessings.It is as GOD chooses and he is the one that actually doing the spiritual work not ourselves.
Angels have been seen in this day and age,Prophecy also has been done in this day and age.Even when the world as it is.As it says ALL Good Gifts come from God,unto whome HE WILLS IT.As he Performs and doeth the GOOD WORK
Sabellius1
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