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-   Fellowship Hall (https://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=7)
-   -   The Name (https://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com/showthread.php?t=1627)

Michael The Disciple 03-26-2007 11:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tbpew (Post 52771)
Micheal,
I am wanting to know a similar answer to what Dan asked in his last post.

I can not consider anything that AB said (or Steve) was diminishing the validity of the Hebrew-speaking faithful expressing God's name from the tongue of their understanding.

What comes around in these discussions is whether the efficacy of the spoken name is lessened or non-existent when the tongue that speaks it is something other than Hebrew or Aramaic or whatever!

I personally see an application here of the principle that God is no respector of persons.

Please consider continuing your participation in this thread (a topic that seems to be one in which you are very passionate), and plainly share if you believe in that speaking the English word JESUS has less, or the same, efficacy in the realm of spiritual dominions and authorities then the Hebraic utterence/sounding of the same name?

thanks.
What Steve and AB are promoting is that I or "we" only use the name Jesus. So should the Jews ONLY use Yeshua? Should they be reproved if they would like to at times call Yeshua Jesus?

I do not make threads to try to pressure anyone to use Yeshua. But to me it is a wonderful thing to know the original name that Gabriel brought down from Heaven and commanded Mary to name her Son.

To me this is part of the Spirit guiding us into all truth.

SDG 03-26-2007 11:05 AM
Quote:
To me this is part of the Spirit guiding us into all truth.


Does this mean .... that those that don't use it ... have less truth?

tbpew 03-26-2007 11:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea (Post 52777)
Anyone agree or disagree w/ this?
for now, please count me in the disagree column.

I can not reconcile that position "freeatlast" puts forth with the delimena the seven sons of a chief priest had when they proclaimed a concept without knowing same.

sceva's son spoke....
"We adjure you by Jesus whom Paul preacheth."

this attempt at simple verbatim repetition brought seven sons in contact with one "unimpressed" evil spirit and the vessel he was hanging out in leaving them naked and wounded and fleeing from the encounter.

Quote:
And the man in whom the evil spirit was leaped on them, and overcame them, and prevailed against them, so that they fled out of that house naked and wounded.

SDG 03-26-2007 11:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by tbpew (Post 52781)
for now, please count me in the disagree column.

I can not reconcile that position "freeatlast" puts forth with the delimena the seven sons of a chief priest had when they proclaimed a concept without knowing same.

sceva's son spoke....
"We adjure you by Jesus whom Paul preacheth."

this attempt at simple verbatim repetition brought seven sons in contact with one "unimpressed" evil spirit and the vessel he was hanging out in leaving them naked and wounded and fleeing from the encounter.
Are you suggesting that because they didn't use the right phraseology ... ie. in the "name of Jesus" ..... the demon did not submit ????

Was the demon unimpressed by the recitation or that they did not have the power and authority of Jesus?

Digging4Truth 03-26-2007 11:11 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea (Post 52783)
Are you suggesting that because they didn't use the right phraseology ... ie. in the "name of Jesus" ..... the demon did not submit ????

Was the demon unimpressed by the recantation or that they did not have the power and authority of Jesus?
My vote is that he meant the latter.

Repeating the name out of rote with no relationship to back it up doesn't seem to hold much water with the demon folk.

SDG 03-26-2007 11:15 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Digging4Truth (Post 52785)
My vote is that he meant the latter.

Repeating the name out of rote with no relationship to back it up doesn't seem to hold much water with the demon folk.
So if the Spirit-filled person then baptizes someone reciting "in the name of the Father, Son and the Holy Ghost"... they do not have the power and authority of Jesus?

Simply asking about the power of our phraseology?, if any... as I believe that the apostles did obey Jesus by baptizing in the name of Jesus Christ, in the name of the Lord, in the name of Jesus etc.

I prefer "in the name of Jesus Christ" myself and believe that it should be carried out in this way.

SDG 03-26-2007 11:17 AM
Second ... what say ye of those who believe that unless the baptizer does not recite the right phraseology ... the blood of Jesus is not applied in the waters of baptism and remission does not take place? I have heard this used? What say ye?

Digging4Truth 03-26-2007 11:35 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea (Post 52786)
So if the Spirit-filled person then baptizes someone reciting "in the name of the Father, Son and the Holy Ghost"... they do not have the power and authority of Jesus?

Simply asking about the power of our phraseology?, if any... as I believe that the apostles did obey Jesus by baptizing in the name of Jesus Christ, in the name of the Lord, in the name of Jesus etc.

I prefer "in the name of Jesus Christ" myself and believe that it should be carried out in this way.
Okay... well that wasn't my point but I am going to assume you knew that and are just asking another question.

I have always been taught that it was necessary to baptize in the name of Jesus (Jesus Christ, Lord Jesus Christ etc)

That is how I was baptized.
That is how I would baptize someone.

Are the titles enough? I have always been taught that they are not. I do not know... I do know the name is enough... so I don't go to a place I am unsure when I have a sure place to stand.

I hope that answered your question

Digging4Truth 03-26-2007 11:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea (Post 52788)
Second ... what say ye of those who believe that unless the baptizer does not recite the right phraseology ... the blood of Jesus is not applied in the waters of baptism and remission does not take place? I have heard this use? What say ye?
In the issue of titles versus name.. this is what I have been taught.

This is not something I am sure of but all that I do I must do of faith and I would have doubt if I called the titles.

I have faith when I call on the name.

Michael The Disciple 03-26-2007 11:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Daniel Alicea (Post 52780)

Does this mean .... that those that don't use it ... have less truth?
When Gabriel came down and spoke to Mary how to name her Son did he tell her an English name? Did the Apostles call him by an English name? Obviously not.

After I had been a Christian for a couple of years and it was pointed out to me that Jesus was not the original name of the Messiah I was frankly surprised. I had not considered such a thing. But I felt like I had gained more knowledge of him than I had before.


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