Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1395806)

Loren, I am trying to tell you that the passage is covering the entire church age, into the Millienial.

Do you actually think that the world is everlastingly righteous?("and to bring in everlasting righteousness")

Loren, it is not even "hypothetically" righteous.

If you think that the Lord is simply, slowly but surely working on it, then He is slow as molasses.(2000 years of less righteousness)

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1395858)

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer (Post 1395988)

Sean Sean, Sean, where does it say the world would be righteous?


Right here....when He comes in His kingdom.....

31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:

32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:

33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.

34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:

37 Then shall the righteous answer him, saying,....

According to this passage, the world will be purged of unrighteousness when Jesus comes, Right?




Are you righteous? Does the spirit of God make one righteous? Did the cross and the work of the cross give you access to be right in the eyes of God? Is not the promise of salvation for all time?


Yes, to a few of us, but we are talking about a particular time that the whole world will be subjected to the Righteous ONE!

Try not to confuse the events, Loren.


I guess then you don't think Christ was the king of righteousness and he did not come. I am beginning to think that If you lived in the time of Christ you would have been a Pharisee and taken part in putting Christ on the cross. Because the same scriptures you attempt to use for a second coming were the same scriptures they used to justify crucifying the Christ.

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer (Post 1396025)

an 9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.
Dan 9:25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.


I don't know Sean, I guess you cannot count, or something. The prophecy, was that all six of the points in verse 24 would be fulfilled within the 70 week time period. The prophecy was then so specific as to set the starting point for the 70 weeks. "Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks". We can trace the time line from the command to restore Jerusalem to the time of the baptism of Christ to be exactly 69 weeks. Leaving the last week for Christ to complete and fulfill the six points of verse 24.

And since you seem to be hung up on the everlasting righteousness, look at these verses.
Rom_3:21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;
Rom_3:22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

2Co_5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

2Co_9:9 (As it is written, He hath dispersed abroad; he hath given to the poor: his righteousness remaineth for ever.

Christ brought righteousness into the world, and his righteousness is forever. It that not everlasting righteousness?

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1396070)

The whole world will be FORCED into righteousness, when Jesus Christ returns.

Originally Posted by shazeep (Post 1396093)

yikes

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer (Post 1396025)

an 9:24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.
Dan 9:25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.


I don't know Sean, I guess you cannot count, or something. The prophecy, was that all six of the points in verse 24 would be fulfilled within the 70 week time period. The prophecy was then so specific as to set the starting point for the 70 weeks. "Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks". We can trace the time line from the command to restore Jerusalem to the time of the baptism of Christ to be exactly 69 weeks. Leaving the last week for Christ to complete and fulfill the six points of verse 24.

And since you seem to be hung up on the everlasting righteousness, look at these verses.
Rom_3:21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;
Rom_3:22 Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference:

2Co_5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

2Co_9:9 (As it is written, He hath dispersed abroad; he hath given to the poor: his righteousness remaineth for ever.

Christ brought righteousness into the world, and his righteousness is forever. It that not everlasting righteousness?

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1395961)

Okay, you asked for it....

Ezekiel 38King James Version (KJV)

38 And the word of the Lord came unto me, saying,

2 Son of man, set thy face against Gog, the land of Magog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal, and prophesy against him,

3 And say, Thus saith the Lord God; Behold, I am against thee, O Gog, the chief prince of Meshech and Tubal:

4 And I will turn thee back, and put hooks into thy jaws, and I will bring thee forth, and all thine army, horses and horsemen, all of them clothed with all sorts of armour, even a great company with bucklers and shields, all of them handling swords:

5 Persia, Ethiopia, and Libya with them; all of them with shield and helmet:

6 Gomer, and all his bands; the house of Togarmah of the north quarters, and all his bands: and many people with thee.

7 Be thou prepared, and prepare for thyself, thou, and all thy company that are assembled unto thee, and be thou a guard unto them.

8 After many days thou shalt be visited: in the latter years thou shalt come into the land that is brought back from the sword, and is gathered out of many people, against the mountains of Israel, which have been always waste: but it is brought forth out of the nations, and they shall dwell safely all of them.

9 Thou shalt ascend and come like a storm, thou shalt be like a cloud to cover the land, thou, and all thy bands, and many people with thee.

10 Thus saith the Lord God; It shall also come to pass, that at the same time shall things come into thy mind, and thou shalt think an evil thought:

11 And thou shalt say, I will go up to the land of unwalled villages; I will go to them that are at rest, that dwell safely, all of them dwelling without walls, and having neither bars nor gates,

12 To take a spoil, and to take a prey; to turn thine hand upon the desolate places that are now inhabited, and upon the people that are gathered out of the nations, which have gotten cattle and goods, that dwell in the midst of the land.

13 Sheba, and Dedan, and the merchants of Tarshish, with all the young lions thereof, shall say unto thee, Art thou come to take a spoil? hast thou gathered thy company to take a prey? to carry away silver and gold, to take away cattle and goods, to take a great spoil?

14 Therefore, son of man, prophesy and say unto Gog, Thus saith the Lord God; In that day when my people of Israel dwelleth safely, shalt thou not know it?

15 And thou shalt come from thy place out of the north parts, thou, and many people with thee, all of them riding upon horses, a great company, and a mighty army:

16 And thou shalt come up against my people of Israel, as a cloud to cover the land; it shall be in the latter days, and I will bring thee against my land, that the heathen may know me, when I shall be sanctified in thee, O Gog, before their eyes.

17 Thus saith the Lord God; Art thou he of whom I have spoken in old time by my servants the prophets of Israel, which prophesied in those days many years that I would bring thee against them?

18 And it shall come to pass at the same time when Gog shall come against the land of Israel, saith the Lord God, that my fury shall come up in my face.

19 For in my jealousy and in the fire of my wrath have I spoken, Surely in that day there shall be a great shaking in the land of Israel;

20 So that the fishes of the sea, and the fowls of the heaven, and the beasts of the field, and all creeping things that creep upon the earth, and all the men that are upon the face of the earth, shall shake at my presence, and the mountains shall be thrown down, and the steep places shall fall, and every wall shall fall to the ground.

21 And I will call for a sword against him throughout all my mountains, saith the Lord God: every man's sword shall be against his brother.

22 And I will plead against him with pestilence and with blood; and I will rain upon him, and upon his bands, and upon the many people that are with him, an overflowing rain, and great hailstones, fire, and brimstone.

23 Thus will I magnify myself, and sanctify myself; and I will be known in the eyes of many nations, and they shall know that I am the Lord.





Looks a little bit physical to me!!!!




Want more?

Originally Posted by mfblume (Post 1396096)

It's not about the cross in dispensationalism.

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer (Post 1396127)

Yes I know Mike, according to disp. the cross really does not have any meaning it is just a little blip in time, because according to the way the perceive things the cross only established a gap in time so that a few Gentiles could find God. Then God is going to go back to temple sacrifices and deal with only the Jews.

But my bible tells me that God sent his son into the world that the WORLD might be saved. To me that includes the Jews and Gentiles.

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1396070)

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1396128)

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1396132)

Oh yes he DOES, Loren!.....

31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:

32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:

33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.

34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:

35 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me in:

36 Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison, and ye came unto me.

37 Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink?

38 When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee?

39 Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee?

40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.

41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1396133)

If you were faced with the choice, I am sure you would accept His kingdom offer beforehand!

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1396070)

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1396112)

6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.

Howbout that?

If Jesus is not physically reigning, then neither are WE!

Want more?

Originally Posted by mfblume (Post 1396193)

Oh how you read things into verses that aren't there, and then demand us to show the exact words "dual nature" in the bible.

Nothing you showed says Jesus rules when physically on earth. The truth is he already rules over every name there is from his place in heaven at the right hand. If he has all power now over this world he already rules and there's nothing left remaining for him to rule over.

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer (Post 1396136)

What ever Sean, your going to believe what you want in your small pharisaical world, while the kingdom of God marches on without you. As Christ said to Paul, "it must be hard fighting against the pricks" and that is just what you are doing, fighting against the expansion of the kingdom of God, and like the Pharisee of old, you don't know that you are doing. While publicans and harlots are coming into the kingdom in droves, you sit on you self made throne beating your breast declaring, "look at me a Christian".

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa (Post 1396195)

John 18:36

Jesus answered, "MY KINGDOM IS NOT OF THIS WORLD; if it were, My servants would fight to prevent My arrest by the Jews. But now, My kingdom is NOT OF THIS REALM."

Luke 17:20-21

Now having been questioned by the Pharisees as to when the kingdom of God was coming, He answered them and said, "The kingdom of God is not coming with signs to be observed; nor will they say, 'Look, here it is!' or, 'There it is!' For behold, the kingdom of God IS IN YOUR MIDST."

Romans 14:17

For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, and joy IN THE HOLY GHOST.

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa (Post 1396195)

John 18:36

Jesus answered, "MY KINGDOM IS NOT OF THIS WORLD; if it were, My servants would fight to prevent My arrest by the Jews. But now, My kingdom is NOT OF THIS REALM."

Luke 17:20-21

Now having been questioned by the Pharisees as to when the kingdom of God was coming, He answered them and said, "The kingdom of God is not coming with signs to be observed; nor will they say, 'Look, here it is!' or, 'There it is!' For behold, the kingdom of God IS IN YOUR MIDST."

Romans 14:17

For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, and joy IN THE HOLY GHOST.

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1396378)

:dogpat:nod

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1396456)

Sure, the Kingdom of God is going to expand to ALL the living when Jesus returns!! Easy as pie!

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa (Post 1396477)

Interesting, so since it is found within as spiritual (as the scriptures attest) does it expand within the believer some time in the future?

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1396531)

As a matter of fact, yes!

8 Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.

9 For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.

10 But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.

11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.

12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.


When Jesus raptures us and returns with His saints, the "partial" gifts we operate in will cease and we are going to see Him face to face!!!

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1396551)

Oh, you mean the passage you think says, that the Gifts cease when we "mature"?

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1396551)

Oh, you mean the passage you think says, that the Gifts cease when we "mature"?......LOLOLOLOL



Benincasa says......


8 Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.

9 For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.

10 But when maturity in Christ is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.

11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.(Benincasa says maturity "puts away childish things" as in the "partial" Gifts here.)

12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.




LOLOLOL

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1396609)

You picked the wrong passage to "preterize", fella!

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1396551)

Oh, you mean the passage you think says, that the Gifts cease when we "mature"?......LOLOLOLOL



Benincasa says......


8 Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.

9 For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.

10 But when maturity in Christ is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.

11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.(Benincasa:dogkiss says maturity in Christ "puts away childish things" as in the "partial" Gifts mentioned here.)

12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.




LOLOLOL

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1396551)

Oh, you mean the passage you think says, that the Gifts cease when we "mature"?......LOLOLOLOL

Benincasa says......

8 Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.

9 For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.

10 But when maturity in Christ is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.

11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.(Benincasa says maturity "puts away childish things" as in the "partial" Gifts here.)

12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.

LOLOLOL

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1396786)

[/COLOR]

LOLOLOL:nod

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer (Post 1397231)

Actually he is closer to the true understanding of this passage then you are!
I wonder just how you read sometimes. Or if you can read. Oh I know you can read words, but when they are put into sentences longer than "see Jane run" you mind must go in to hyper drive.

You laugh at the thought that maturity puts away childish things? But that is just what Paul states in the verse 11. When I became a man, I put away childish things.
Another thing you might not grasp is that nowhere does it say tongues will cease not prophecy, nor knowledge. Paul is comparing these to Charity, saying that Charity will never fail.
Paul wraps the whole thing up by saying, three things abide forever, Faith, hope and Charity, and the greatest of these is Charity.

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer (Post 1397232)

And what in the world does LOLOLOL mean?

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1397236)

Loren, do you believe like Benincasa on this passage too?

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1397237)

Laugh alot.

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer (Post 1397245)

If you have to ask that question you did not read my post.



You cannot even get a acronym right, that would be LAL
LOL = laugh out loud
to which I am ROTFL