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Re: Confess your sin, UPCI!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brother David (Post 875601)

I accept your testimony, Sam and I appreciate your viewpoint on this. I think when it comes to questions of salvation and even the Christian experience vis-à-vis "speaking in tongues" that we're pretty much in agreement.

Would you agree with my challenge for "Three Steppers" to produce real evidence of a recurrence of Acts 2:4-8, since they demand that this is the "evidence" of one's salvation?

A person's salvation is a point that really brings it to home, in my mind anyhow. If this is something that MUST happen every time a person is saved - then shouldn't we expect to actually see Acts 2:4-8, every time a person is saved?

Instead, they try a slight of hand act by diverting the conversation to what MIGHT have happened on an airplane many years ago, and what some missionary reported as happening on the foreign field, thousands of miles away. What about at THEIR church LAST Sunday? What happened? Did any get saved? Did they tell them, or did they expect Acts 2:4-8, to happen? Did it?

Well, y'all know me, the old greasy grace Bapticostal. I certainly don't believe that a person is not saved unless they speak with tongues, but I do believe speaking with tongues is a valid experience and I personally speak with tongues just about every day. But I don't think everything that happened at Pentecost is repeated every time the Holy Spirit is poured out. We don't read about the wind and fire afterward but just the speaking with tongues was enough for Peter to say that the Gentiles had received the same experience he and others had received.

Re: Confess your sin, UPCI!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brother David (Post 875602)

It was sort of the "hinterlands" of the Jerusalem area due to the fact that it was practically cut off from Jerusalem by the region of Samaria, but it was also home to the largest Jewish population at the time outside of Jerusalem itself.

I probably have something on that in my Logos package... somewhere! :foottap

It was called Galilee of the Gentiles and folks from there were considered rustic and not as religious as the Judean Jews. They also had their own regional accent.

Re: Confess your sin, UPCI!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brother David (Post 875602)

lol

Re: Confess your sin, UPCI!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sam (Post 875603)

There is a dichotomy here in our modern day experience and perhaps in the Bible days as well...

What we see manifest most often is usually called "unknown tongues." This appears to stem from the KJV's translation of "glossa" in 1 Corinthians 14, where the English word "unknown" (italicized) was added by the translators.

This is the ecstatic speech that was also seen in the ancient world among prophets (see the account of the Egyptian official Wen-Amen's trip to Byblos) and oracles. The Delphic oracle spoke in an "unknown tongue" or language which was "interpreted" by the priests of the Temple.

The ecstatic worshipers of Dionysus spoke in an "ecstatic speech" in their revelry which sometimes turned quite violent. The disciples from the Upper Room may have been seen as Bacchanalians by some in the crowd and this is why the accusation was made that they were "filled with new wine."

See for example beginning at page 219 (Glossolalia-Language of the Unconscious?) in this book: Psychology of the Bible.

But the experience of Acts 2:4-8, taken at face value seems to ask the reader to believe that a supernatural event was occurring wherein the speakers spoke in languages that they had never learned and the hearers clearly understood the language as their native speech. This a something else, other than the "speaking in tongues" typically observed in Pentecostal meetings where no one - not the speaker nor the hearer - understood what was being said.

Given the ambiguity and the confusion of the "Three Steppers" over this issue, I think that it is prudent to NOT demand something of people that is simply unreal or at the very least (or the very best?) uncertain.

Why not just be open to the possibilities of what God can do in our lives and not make demands of people based upon our own historically confused and jumbled theology on the matter?

Re: Confess your sin, UPCI!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hoovie (Post 875595)

Well, its a rhetorical question which was never answered. It's entirely possible they thought "most" were Galileans, or that they wrongly thought all of them were.

Possible I suppose, tho Im not convinced for a few reasons...

Oh well, it doesn't matter at all anyway, because the gentiles received the same gift of the Holyghost as whoever all did in the beginning anyway.

Acts 10:44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.
:45And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God.

And Peters explanation of such:

Acts 11:15 And as I began to speak, the Holy Ghost fell on them, as on us at the beginning. (no apostle laying on of hands either)

16Then remembered I the word of the Lord, how that he said, John indeed baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost.

17Forasmuch then as God gave them the like gift as he did unto us, who believed on the Lord Jesus Christ; what was I, that I could withstand God?

18When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life

and to all that are afar off....