Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

will is future tense...something that will happen hasn't happened.

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

On the day of Pentecost, the Apostle Peter stated, "whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved" (Acts 2:21). He was quoting from the prophet Yoel. Some years later, the Apostle Paul affirmed the same thing (Romans 10:8-13).

Peter told the crowd on the Day of Pentecost to follow up their faith and change of heart with a dip in one of the many Temple mikvehs in the name of the Lord (Acts 2:38). He also told them that the empowering of the Holy Spirit as they had seen poured out on people earlier that day was a promise of the Father to anyone that the Lord calls to Himself (Acts 2:38-39).

It is my opinion that we can expect people to follow up their conversion with water baptism, and we can exhort them to, but we cannot say they will not be saved if they don't.

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

So staysharp you are saying everytime you sin you need to get rebaptied? Cause you state that is what washes your sins away..

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

"shall" receive.
It is a promise.
It is up to them to "receive"
not up to God to give.

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

Staysharp, I am really wanting to keep the support of this doctrine to scripture only. Can you please provide scripture that supports the three-step doctrine?

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

If "work" is defined as anything you can do then repentance is a work. If repentance is not a work the the definition of "works" can't be anything you can do

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

I've heard it said that saving faith is APPLIED at repentance, baptism etc

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

I don't think that repentance is anything other than a change of heart. How can that be a work? No work is done. Only that my heart was once hardened and turned away from God and now it is toward God. Any works would happen because of my repentance.

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

I have heard the same thing.

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

delta where you on EC?

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

You mean everyone's connected? Yeah I was a long time ago. I thought it shut down.

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

I'm not a three-stepper, but I will give a "pro" IMO to the three-step doctrine. It seems that their converts are more committed then one-steppers

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

Honestly, I was hoping to have a more support for the three-step doctrine before we start getting off on tangents. I would like to summarize the support of the doctrine from a scripture viewpoint so that we can see where the common ground is.

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

It might seem that way. I don't know if this is true or not. We have mormons, JW, Catholics, and Baptist that are just as committed.

Thanks for the input.

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

no, one cannot be born again twice. after we are born again, God deals with us through the washing and regenerating of the word. we are his sons and those he loves he will correct.

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

Did you know SlickRick?

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

Nope, the only people I knew on their was personal friends. I didn't spend much time there.

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

1. I wouldn't classify the Baptist with the others. Baptists do believe in Jesus and His resurrection, they've just not accepted some of the other teachings of the Bible. However, in context to my opinion, they are very strong on repentance and baptism, so while they only may be a two-stepper you are right they are very committed.

2. The Mormons and JW are a whole different bowl of beans. They employ cultic practices of brain washing, will turn against you if you leave the religion, and are very works oriented. So although they are committed it is not the same as a true Christians commitment because they want Jesus as their Lord.

3. Catholics have a very small percentage of committed followers. While there a numerous Catholics and who proclaim Catholicism most do not attend Mass regularly, give to the church, or offer any real support of their belief. They only identify themselves as such.

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

True.

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

Sounds like another group I know which would be a type of three stepper

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jYhIB...eature=related

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

This is hirlarious! Baptists for the most part believe in baptism by immersion not that they are two steppers. LOL! They are 1 to no-steppers. Baptism for the vast majority is not essential to be saved. To say "baptists are committed is interesting as well as they have the worst consistent attendance numbers per those who are "saved". This per a report I saw several years back. Sounds like a bunch of personal opinion that is unfounded but simply who you have dealt with which is always skewed. To me forthe most part everyone deals with the same exact people. FLesh is flesh and the mentality of doctrine plays a huge whole in how one believes he has a relationship with God etc...

Also.... salvation is works oriented which is based upon a working relationship with God. He leads you follow to do otherwise is damnation!

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

Lets not get off subject. Luke, you are proponant of three-step doctrine so please give me the support you have. I am looking for the scriptures that are pro three-step.

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

Let's start with Acts 8 and Acts 19! :thumbsup :foottap

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

Not to get off subject but LUKE2447 the Baptist do not repent? I beleive they do...

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

I thought I posted this before but now I can't find it:

Some scriptures I've seen used by "three steppers"

1. Acts 2:38, there are three things mentioned here;
repentance, water baptism, receiving the gift of the Holy Ghost.

2. Acts 8, the folks had believed, received the Word, and had been water baptized but had not received a subsequent experience called receiving the Holy Spirit, the Spirit falling upon them, or the Spirit being given.

3. Acts 10, after the folks were saved and baptized in the Spirit Peter commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord

4. Acts 19, here again we see water water baptism and the Holy Spirit coming on them

5. John 3:5, "birth of water" is taught by Roman Catholics, Campbellites, some traditional Protestant denominations and some Apostolics to be water baptism. Birth of Spirit is taught to be what we now call the baptism in the Holy Spirit

6. 1 Cor 6:11, Paul tells the Corinthians they had been washed, sanctified, and justified in the name of the Lord Jesus and and by the Spirit of our God. Many three-steppers will tell you to stay away from the epistles to find salvation but some see a reference here to water and Spirit baptism.

7. Titus 3:5 speaks of God saving us "by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost." Again, even though this is in an epistle, some see the "washing of regeneration" as water baptism and "renewing of the Holy Ghost" as Holy Ghost Baptism.

8. Mark 16:16 is taken by some to be a "formula" for salvation.
Belief plus baptism equals salvation (birth of Spirit)

9. 1 Peter 3:21 says, "...baptism doth also now save us..."

10. Romans 6:17,18 says we used to be the servants of sin but we have "obeyed from the heart that form of doctrine..." and are now made free from sin and became servants of righteousness.

11. Romans 6 speaks of burial in baptism into death and baptism into Christ's death. It also speaks of our walking in newness of life. Some believe that the death of Christ is ineffective for us until we are baptized in water. Some also teach that just as we do not remain under the water we are to come up out of the water and that is when we receive the Holy Ghost baptism.

12. Colossians 2:11-13 is taken by some to say that water baptism is spiritual circumcision which is not only the sign of the covenant but it also cuts away our sin.

13. Gal 3:26-29 is understood by some to say that water baptism puts us into Christ

14. I Cor 12:13 is understood by some to say that the Holy Ghost Baptism places us into the Body of Christ

15. Hebrews 5:9 (another epistle scripture so avoided by some) says that God is the author of salvation unto all that obey Him

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

I was a Baptist for a while.
I invited Jesus Christ to come into my heart on a Monday night on March 28 1955. I believe He did come in because He changed me radically. I became a new creature. A few months later I was baptized in water in a nearby lake and became a member of the local Baptist Church. My language and behavior (smoking and drinking among other things) were noticeably changed. So much so that 50 years later at our class reunion some even mentioned the "old" me.

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

Wow,again wrong. Most believe repentance is not what you do but God forces upon you when you get down to it. You need to understand the doctrine of total depravity and it's lesser spin off doctines than even Arminians follow under.

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

You must have been home-schooled.:ursofunny

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

God gives the gift of repentance. This is supported by scripture but a totally different topic.

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

Not going to get into how and what that means. It is used incorrectly and to the point of man can do absolutely nothing and there is no free will. Since you are a Baptist you would understand this.

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

???

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

Luke,

What can you do to save yourself?


One night I was reading my Bible and I read about how GOD hardened Pharoah's heart.

It was that night that I received a deeper appreciation for the Grace of GOD!

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

How's that?

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

With the exception of Atheists and the Carlton Pearson crowd, everyone's doctrine puts someone in hell

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

Repentance is something you do. That is why we are commanded to repent.

Mat 3:2 "Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand."

to think differently or afterwards, that is, reconsider (morally to feel compunction): - repent.

2 things we are supposed to do...repent and believe
Mar 1:15 and saying, "The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand; repent and believe in the gospel."


Act 3:19 Repent therefore, and turn again, that your sins may be blotted out,

Act 8:22 Repent, therefore, of this wickedness of yours, and pray to the Lord that, if possible, the intent of your heart may be forgiven you.

Repentance is something we do.

If works means "anything you can do" then repentance is a work.

How do you define "work"?

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

Jesus said believing is a work.

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

Well if God hardened my heart, I would simply be unable to believe.

But by the Grace of God, I have lead to repentance.

Without His Grace, there is no repentance.

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

Ah, I see. Do you feel bad for Pharaoh? ;)

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

Sorry for taking so long to get back to this...

While it is true that demons believe, yet are damned, and zillions of folks the world over believe, yet are unsubmitted...IMHO, it is equally true that belief will denote an action, even if that action is rejection.

But those who put feet to their belief do so in repentance.

Re: Pros/Cons of the Three-step doctrine
 

Anyone that thinks repentance is not a work is saying so because their theology makes them come to a unbiblical position and alter the whole of what the Bible says. You must repent or everything else means nothing. Not God doing all the work in the relationship. He brought forth the provision the rest is up to you!