Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

Don't knock it till you have tried it! I like Armor Bearers. They do carry firearms because they have to protect the Man of God and they take the offering from the church to the Limo to the jet and assist the Man of God in carrying his briefcase, phone and water bottle.
What in the world could be wrong with that? There were servants in the Bible!

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

The day Eddie thinks he has to have someone to carry his stuff (if he's physically able) is the day I will be visiting the church down the street.:nah

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

Well, We all know the bigger you get...the more stuff you have. Look at Brother Benny! Now HE has a lot of stuff but I am sure that his load will be a little lighter when Suzanne gets finished with him! ;-)

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

LOL! When we go to Africa, the men all come running out to the van to carry all of our stuff for us. But it makes me really uncomfortable. I don't ever want to give the impression that we think we're somebody special.

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

Apparently many of our ministers are clueless when it comes to training young ministers.


On another forum, which shall remain nameless, a general consensus was to take them, and teach them humility, wash the pastor’s car, mow his lawn, be at his beck and call.

The problem with that is it is the antithesis of what I read a minister to be. You want to teach them how to be a pastor? Wash their car, mow their lawn. A true pastor is first of all a servant.

The River of Life Church only runs a little over a hundred but in the last couple years has raised seven home grown ministers who preach out on a regular basis.

They meet monthly with an associate pastor where they are taught ministerial ethics, and how to construct a sermon. Quarterly we have a special Sunday night service where they are given 5-15 minutes depending on experience level.

Then I help find them local churches to preach out at.

Within a couple years they are better qualified to preach than many Bible school graduates.

For example the youth pastor has only been in church PERIOD for three years. Before he got in the church he was a street teen and his main source of income was selling drugs. But he has already grown to the point he will be doing a youth crusade in Belize at the end of this month.

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

:snapout

Somehow, I am not surprised at this response. Atlanta Bishop, I don't think you are serious in the things you say.

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

I don't know if this is about training ministers. It is about creating servants for the pastor and his wife.

Although I have heard people say the best training is to make them humble by making them serve, but there is something wrong with that thinking as well.

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

This sounds like a better way to train ministers.

The other stuff is just all about making yourself seem above the others - - don't like it at all. Sorry AB.

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

I like this....

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

Many people are clueless what type person Jesus really was...I know a group in Brazil that teaches that ministers are far above the people...so the people do not visit their homes unless invited...If Jesus perhaps walked in their services with his unlearned fishermen, women disciples and of course the children that he was so kind to...Jesus and his band would not be welcome … and of course they were all in sandals ...so...you go figure...

(now please do not think I am saying men should come in sandals...I am only using an example of how far removed the church is today from the early church...

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

In fact I know some the pastor does not even come off the pulpit to shake hands with the people...lol...where in the world do people get it that they are so important?????

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

We are just servants to take care of God's precious lambs...not to skin them and beat them to death but to love them, guide them and even correct them with love...

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

I had rather cook and do for them than vise versa....

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

Girl you carry that briefcase and all those concordance books for Eddie or you will be in serious trouble with the mission board....Don't forget to carry at least 3 or 4 different Bibles so he can compare his scriptures while giving the Bible studies...How do you think those poor people will ever be saved if you don't help Eddie get his books and things to the church each service...:thumbsup

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

Therein is the difference, Sherri...it's in the heart and mindset of the individual giving and receiving.

If someone has enough respect to want to serve in this capacity, that is one thing.

When it is demanded and expected, that is another.

I always like to remember the story of Elisha and Elijah...

A servant was trying to describe who Elisha was. With all of the great things God did through him, what stood out in the mind of the servant was this...

That Elisha poured water for the man of God...:thumbsup

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

Good post, Barb. :thumbsup

A servant's heart will serve at every opportunity, and there is nothing wrong with that. However, when someone demands servitude, or even the appearance of it--that's wrong.

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

Humility is a strange thing, because once we think we have it, we've lost it.

Having said that, I think humble people beget humble people. I know in the church I attend, it is so.

The founding pastor was a man of great humility, and the pastors who have followed are the same. They would rather serve than be served.

Gotta go...time to leave for work...

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

Lessons could be learned on humilty and false pride.

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May the Lord give us all a willing heart to serve...

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

He's a big boy; he can carry his own things! LOL! Have you forgotten that I am laden down with jewelry and heavy makeup?????

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

LOL! Sherri can I carry your Bible for you Sunday and wipe your brow should you glisten?

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

Sometimes I do glisten; I may have to take you up on that offer. Sometimes I need a kleenex to blow my nose and then someone to carry that kleenex to the trash. Are you still in??? Just how submitted are you?

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

I've got your back (and your nose)!

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

So what sort of flunky are you?

"Yes Boss!"
http://static.tvfanatic.com/images/g...mcgee-ncis.png

Or......

"Ya boss!"
http://www.filmdope.com/Gallery/ActorsK/9669-15942.gif

Or.......

Hop Sing
http://pushpull.files.wordpress.com/.../hop-sing1.jpg

Or.......

"Yes Master Wayne...."
http://adamwest.tripod.com/alfred.jpg

Or.......

Mr French
http://www.bearotic.com/img/2008/05/french003.jpg

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

That really makes me uncomfortable; especially when I see these same guys joking around about "following the evangelist back to his hotel room..." and "hugging" one another "below the waist."

There really seems to be an unconscious desire to unnaturally dominate the lives and even the person of others.

Disturbing.

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

:crazy

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

I've heard of/seen this and it makes me VERY uncomfortable. I think someone even posted on here about one of these pastors that has "body guards" to surround him and keep people away from him when he leaves the platform???? Good grief!

I was raised with a dad who, while being the pastor, if he arrived at the church before everyone else (read; always) and the sidewalk needed to be swept, would sweep it. And he would do that to this day.

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

I just read through most of the thread and I'm amazed by the overwhelming opinion that's been written. I didn't expect that. I'm surprised and impressed.

But here's the problem...I've been around this concept a few times and I can say that, without exception, the pastors who have either liked this idea or who implemented it, would have had NO CLUE, whatsoever, that people would ever feel this way. Without exception, they would expect a reaction from someone such as "Wow, I'm so lucky to be an armor bearer.

I think, in general, there's frequently a gulfing disconnect between those that are deeply imbedded into the "Hierarchy of ministry" and the "Real world."

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

What ever would make you think that JKJK :) I totally agree!

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

Usually attempts to implement things like this involve the potentates "judging" and "trying" the spirits of those whose labor they are seeking to employ. Thus, if you refuse to be involved you are judged to "have a bad spirit."

Not only are the potentates "better" than you and I and deserving of this luxury, but they also have the ability to dispense the judgment of God. The fact that you and I have trouble understanding this is just more evidence that we don't really belong in those lofty positions. And, the fact that they do understand this merely fixes their position more securely - in their own mind at least.

I'm actually thinking of direct personal experiences that bring these issues a little too close to home. Have you ever had someone screaming at you and demanding that you accept the notion that God has sent a "spirit of anger" upon them and that's why they are screaming? Not only have you "disappointed" them, but you have angered God! How terrible your fate must be.

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

Not to offend you because I'm sure you said it in all seriousness, but the fact that someone did what you said in that last part is actually pretty hilarious!!! At least at first. It's kind of sad that someone could ever think that but in a way it is still kind of funny too.

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

The Lord works in mysterious ways.

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

rofl. Nah, maybe he just wasn't careful enough in creating the computer program of reality. I'm sure every mysterious thing we see can be explained by a few off by one errors and maybe an occasional division by zero. I'm not saying God made errors... it was probably just some dumb angel that he delegated the coding of a few lines to that couldn't handle the pressure of the job...

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

No offense. And it is funny. It's like a line from some tormented comedy routine mocking fundy believers.

But there I was... my whole life and career was in their hands. How pathetic of me. How stunned I was. I had hoped that I was actually working for something much larger and much higher than such petty human emotions and angst.

It really was one of those illuminating "Vanity of vanities..." moments for me. A real eye opener. I was so naive and at times just plain stupid.

Re: Armor Bearer vs Flunky
 

That could explain a lot!