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-   Deep Waters (https://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com/forumdisplay.php?f=4)
-   -   Does The Soul Sleep ? (https://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com/showthread.php?t=24349)

easter 06-20-2009 08:02 AM
Re: Does The Soul Sleep ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Scott Hutchinson (Post 762613)
I did not start this thread to gender strife,I do believe that to be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord,Yet there is a final resurrection,do I understand everything about this subject no I don't.
However I do believe that is appointed unto man once to die and then after this the judgement.
Heavens no!
I mean no strife just very closed minded on the subject of soul sleep.I do enjoy discussing bible topics and usally not so narrow minded in the scripture.I will tell you I use to think that the dead in Christ rose and we who are alive and remain were caught up with them in the air to meet the Lord.After all that is scripture.
You know I believe that is when they recieve their glorified bodies.You know I had to ask myself if the dead rise then,Who are the saints that come back with Jesus?:thumbsup

mfblume 06-20-2009 12:56 PM
Re: Does The Soul Sleep ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by easter (Post 762626)
Heavens no!
I mean no strife just very closed minded on the subject of soul sleep.I do enjoy discussing bible topics and usally not so narrow minded in the scripture.I will tell you I use to think that the dead in Christ rose and we who are alive and remain were caught up with them in the air to meet the Lord.After all that is scripture.
You know I believe that is when they recieve their glorified bodies.You know I had to ask myself if the dead rise then,Who are the saints that come back with Jesus?:thumbsup
Who? Angels!

Deuteronomy 33:2 KJV And he said, The LORD came from Sinai, and rose up from Seir unto them; he shined forth from mount Paran, and he came with ten thousands of saints: from his right hand went a fiery law for them.

This occurred long before the New testament, and can only refer to angles.

mfblume 06-20-2009 01:01 PM
Re: Does The Soul Sleep ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lafon (Post 762524)
To whom was Paul referring when he penned the words of 2 Corinthians 5:8? Was he speaking of all of the saints of God in general, or himself only?
Himself.

Philippians 1:23-24 KJV (23) For I am in a strait betwixt two, having a desire to depart, and to be with Christ; which is far better: (24) Nevertheless to abide in the flesh is more needful for you.

And he could not say this for himself if it was not possible for everyone.

Quote:
Was he not writing about himself and the rest of the apostles only? Where is it to be found within the context of the things written anywhere between 2 Corinthians 2:1 and 5:8 which would give one cause to believe that Paul was referring to any other than himself and the rest of the apostles only? As for me, I find none!
Paul is speaking in 2 Cor 5 about the resurrection body which is for everyone and is a house/body from heaven in contrast to the mortal tabernacle we now possess. And there is no experience an apostle would have in this regard that is not for the entire church body members. Where does the bible say otherwise?

easter 06-20-2009 02:40 PM
Re: Does The Soul Sleep ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mfblume (Post 762708)
Who? Angels!

Deuteronomy 33:2 KJV And he said, The LORD came from Sinai, and rose up from Seir unto them; he shined forth from mount Paran, and he came with ten thousands of saints: from his right hand went a fiery law for them.

This occurred long before the New testament, and can only refer to angles.
No not Angels.
read 1 THESSALONIANS 4:13,14
also 1 Corinthians 15:12-33

easter 06-20-2009 03:04 PM
Re: Does The Soul Sleep ?
 
1 Thessalonians 4:13-18( But I would not have you ignorant,brethren,concerning them which are asleep,that ye sorrow not,even as others which have no hope.14;For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again,even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.(K.J.V)

Them which are asleep.The scripture speak about those who are asleep in Jesus.At death they fell asleep.Does this mean that the dead in Christ are not conscious?The statement that they are asleep has primary reference to the body,which lies in the grave to await the resurrection morning.The spirit is separated from the body at death and goes to be with Jesus.The spirit is alive and awaits the reunion of itself with a resurrected body.There are some who teach what is called soul-sleep_i.e.,those who die are as though they were asleep at night.They do not know anything and are at peace.The scriptures support the views that the dead in Christ are present,in spirit,with Christ in glory as soon as they die.:yahoo:clap:yahoo

mfblume 06-20-2009 04:32 PM
Re: Does The Soul Sleep ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by easter (Post 762752)
No not Angels.
read 1 THESSALONIANS 4:13,14
also 1 Corinthians 15:12-33
Who are they in Deut then? Could only be angels. I believe in a future fulfillment of 1 Thess 4, but I am not sure the saints are the believers in the instance speaking of who returns with Him in His return.

Deuteronomy 33:2 KJV And he said, The LORD came from Sinai, and rose up from Seir unto them; he shined forth from mount Paran, and he came with ten thousands of saints: from his right hand went a fiery law for them.

easter 06-20-2009 05:33 PM
Re: Does The Soul Sleep ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mfblume (Post 762809)
Who are they in Deut then? Could only be angels. I believe in a future fulfillment of 1 Thess 4, but I am not sure the saints are the believers in the instance speaking of who returns with Him in His return.
Yes,1 Thess.4:13-14 is a future fulfillment.I don't know who they are in Deut.but that would have to be angels.I'll go research this and get back with you on this.:hunter

easter 06-20-2009 05:53 PM
Re: Does The Soul Sleep ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by easter (Post 762836)
Yes,1 Thess.4:13-14 is a future fulfillment.I don't know who they are in Deut.but that would have to be angels.I'll go research this and get back with you on this.:hunter
Yes your right! The saints spoken of in Deut. are angels.That is my mistake saying Jesus would come back with his saints in referencing (asleep in Christ)
I quote Bible from memory so pardon my mistake here.I still think it says something about Jesus coming back with the saints,meaning the catching away.For some reason I'm thinking this is somewhere also in the New Testament.

mfblume 06-20-2009 09:08 PM
Re: Does The Soul Sleep ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by easter (Post 762848)
Yes your right! The saints spoken of in Deut. are angels.That is my mistake saying Jesus would come back with his saints in referencing (asleep in Christ)
I quote Bible from memory so pardon my mistake here.I still think it says something about Jesus coming back with the saints,meaning the catching away.For some reason I'm thinking this is somewhere also in the New Testament.
Jude mentions a return of Christ with his saints. But it uses the exact same terms found in Deut in referring to angels. So the question cannot solidly be answered, really.

easter 06-21-2009 04:55 PM
Re: Does The Soul Sleep ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mfblume (Post 762912)
Jude mentions a return of Christ with his saints. But it uses the exact same terms found in Deut in referring to angels. So the question cannot solidly be answered, really.
Yes it can. If you will read (1 Thess.4:13-18).When you read this scripture it leaves no second guessing on who it is that comes back with the Lord.
The Bible speaks about the saints in the book of Revelation.In this instances saints are not the Angels or the dead in Christ,but rather the children of Israel.

1 Thessalonians 4:13-18


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