Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1395023)

How then does someone go from a literal flood to a spiritual fire?

Metaphors my friend, metaphors......LOL

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer (Post 1395035)

10/7/2015
2 Peter 3:10
2Pe 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
Many take this passage and try to imply that the earth, this planet, and all that goes with it will be destroyed. That it will be dissolved by fire. And then God will create a new planet that is perfect, without sin. There are several things wrong with this thinking, and I wonder how they reconcile several things written in this passage. But I will only deal with this one verse, for in this verse there are still several issues that seem to be over looked.
First the issue of the day of the Lord. What is the day of the Lord? I have in my life heard several teachings on the meaning of the day of the Lord. The first one is the teaching that the day of the Lord is the rapture. A term I might add that is not found in scripture, nor with careful study is only found in the imagination of the minds that teach this.
But let us not just leave this idea with regards to my way of thinking. According to these teachers Christ is going to return to earth, and resurrect all the dead in Christ and rapture all those that are living and take them to a place they perceive as heaven. Now here is the problem with this thinking. In regards to the rapture, they take the part of this passage in verse 10, “the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night” and apply it to the rapture. There is a big problem with this for the day of the Lord is a coming in judgment. They try to get around this by splitting the coming of the Lord into at least two comings, with a period of tribulation in between. Of course this poses another problem, they cannot agree if the supposed rapture happens before this tribulation, in the middle or at the end. Yet the biggest problem with all of this is that they teach that at the end of this tribulation, Christ returns and set up a 1000 year reign on the earth, and still the earth is not destroyed until after the 1000 years.
All of this in the face of Peter writing that the day of the Lord comes as a thief in the night, and the heavens and earth pass away with a fervent heat. How can all this happen in the short period of time implied by Peter in this passage? It cannot.
Instead of defending a theology that has so many holes in it, why not go back to scripture and rethink your theology?

Originally Posted by J.A. Perez (Post 1395041)

I wasn't poking holes like you were doing. I was just sincerely asking how do you explain it?

You're not explaining your stand by mocking someone else's. You're just making haphazard statements.

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1394977)

That is the dumbest thing you have ever brought to the open Benincasa.

Even David Bernard teaches the verse is about the 2nd coming.

You think that mature Christians gravitate from the Gifts, according to the context of the passage......


LOLOLOL


This is your idiotic doctrine....

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1394977)

8 Charity never faileth: but whether there be prophecies, they shall fail; whether there be tongues, they shall cease; whether there be knowledge, it shall vanish away.

9 For we know in part, and we prophesy in part.

10 But when that which is perfect (maturity in Christ) is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.

11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.

12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.


The only reason you would come to the conclusion that this is the way you believe is the belief you have in preterism.

It shakes your doctrine, when you think of the ending of the gifts, when and only when Jesus returns

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1395023)

How then does someone go from a literal flood to a spiritual fire?



Metaphors my friend, metaphors......LOL

Originally Posted by J.A. Perez (Post 1395041)

I wasn't poking holes like you were doing. I was just sincerely asking how do you explain it?

You're not explaining your stand by mocking someone else's. You're just making haphazard statements.

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer (Post 1395055)

Sorry if you think all I was doing was poking holes, sometimes poking holes is the first step before explaining things.

I have not had as much interaction with you as with Sean so not too sure where you are coming from yet.
Here is part of the thing for me, I have taught and explained things is the past but if the person being taught is set in their mind they will like Sean not even consider or study that which disagrees with their theology.

Wait a minute Loren.....What do I have to study?....A bunch of COMMENTARY?
That is exactly what preterism is loren....COMMENTARY.
It does not allow someone to think for themselves as they see a verse clearly tell them something, but intruduces 2nd and 3rd meanings to half of the Bible!

Study that????



The other thing is most people get their beliefs by indoctrination, rather that personal study. They were taught their beliefs over and over then began to teach those beliefs the same way to others. If one does not have reason to question those doctrines, they will continue to believe and teach them as God inspired. Thirty five years ago while I was pasturing a church, someone questioned two standards of holiness, that caused me to take another look. Although I thought I had studied them many times before, this time I looked at many outside resources outside the church. Also I began to study history and the context before and after the passages used to teach those standards. For me I could not reconcile the teachings taught by my organization. I also found that there were others in my organization that also agreed with the same understanding I was coming to.

Loren, I am indoctrinated by the Bible I own. It clearly teaches me my doctrines to believe. The last thing I need is someone telling me it means something else, other than what I am reading........Capeesh?


The point to this is I now try to stay away from trying to persuade others to my way of thinking by giving my understanding. Because in doing so, all I am doing is indoctrinating others to my way of thinking rather they them finding it on their own. Therefore I will poke holes in doctrines, in the hope that it will cause others to question what they have been taught, and dig deeper in study.

I believe truth is truth and when someone studies to find truth with an open heart, truth will prevail. Paul told Timothy to study to show himself approved, he did not say go to the elders of the church to get your doctrine. The bible has always been and always will be my go to book for answers to life's problems, and it also holds the answers to the questions to prophecy, but one must study.

My last thought is don't look to other to teach you truth, study for yourself to find truth, truth will prevail. If there is one question, one contradiction in your mind then it cannot be truth.

Originally Posted by Godsdrummer (Post 1395038)

And Sean before you use big words you don't understand get out your dictionary.

Metaphor
MET'APHOR, n. [Gr. to transfer, over, to carry.] A short similitude; a similitude reduced to a single word; or a word expressing similitude without the signs of comparison. Thus "that man is a fox," is a metaphor; but "that man is like a fox," is a similitude or comparison. So when I say, "the soldiers fought like lions," I use a similitude. In metaphor, the similitude is contained in the name; a man is a fox, means, a man is as crafty as a fox. So we say, a man bridles his anger, that is, restrains it as a bridle restrains a horse. Beauty awakens love or tender passions; opposition fires courage.

Originally Posted by Sean (Post 1395082)