Re: Pastoral Authority....where did it come from?
 

That argument isn't logical - There are many who follow false doctrine ignorantly and really believe they are doing the right thing - how do you think God looks at that - "Oh well - it's ok they think they are doing the right thing" - I don't think so :)

Re: Pastoral Authority....where did it come from?
 

Here we go again.

Re: Pastoral Authority....where did it come from?
 

Surely you know, though, that a lot of the behavior is learned, and cultural, and many pastors are just emulating what they have learned from other men in ministry, without really knowing how to lead in a better way?

It's wrong to assume that every overbearing man is deliberately manipulative or abusive. I recognize the behaviors, but a lot of it is just ignorance--not pure evil. The damage may be just the same, no doubt. But God will have to deal with men according to what is in their hearts, and we can't always judge that part very well.

Re: Pastoral Authority....where did it come from?
 

Actually, MOADQ, I DO respect people who are sincere in their walk with God, even if they are sincerely WRONG.

My arguments are usually very logical. :D

So, if you get mad and yell at your kids unnecessarily, are you from the pits of hell? Ever done that?

Re: Pastoral Authority....where did it come from?
 

It makes life interesting and makes a boring day at work go by faster :)

Re: Pastoral Authority....where did it come from?
 

Yes - I have done that and it is from the pits of hell - the times I have done it I have asked told my daughter I was sorry and that Jesus was not happy with me when I behaved that way.

Re: Pastoral Authority....where did it come from?
 

Yikes! LOL!!!!! I don't go to extremes that way. I don't think people are of the devil when they act human. They're just people. Sometimes they're evil, sometimes they're just ignorant.

Our flesh needs to be in submission to God, but if I get up one morning and I'm grumpy with my husband, it's a character issue--not a salvational issue. My older sister always says that "It's not a sin to be annoying." We should strive to be like Christ, but I'm not going to put myself in hell if I have a weak moment! :blink I would live in constant condemnation if I did!

Some folks just have personality conflicts, and it's not anymore complicated than that.

Re: Pastoral Authority....where did it come from?
 

Miss B,

I agree that they are either taught that or they are easily infuenced by others. One thing I want to add though is that the hearts of men are evil and sometimes they are so insecure, or overly confident that their way is the best way. Many times they think they are the voice of God when in fact they can be easily used by the devil without even realizing it when they rely on themselves instead of God.

I do not believe that we will be given brownie points for obeying a man who is not following Godly principles in his own life or trying to manipulate and control people in his church that are not his business to control. Even Paul told the people in the churches he visited with to "follow me as I follow Christ." There is a great difference from following a pastor's scriptural teaching and allowing him to influence you in things that are not his responsibility.

I am at work so I don't have time to elaborate.

Blessings, Rhonda

Re: Pastoral Authority....where did it come from?
 

Yeah - I know it is not a salvational issue but when you see you have broken their little heart because you were a jerk you HAVE to do something to TRY to make it better :)

Re: Pastoral Authority....where did it come from?
 

Of course. :)

So, if its not a salvational issue, then it doesn't come from the "pits of hell." :D