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Re: This Is Why Non-Christians Hate Us

Quote:

Originally Posted by DAII (Post 865206)

The devils are imperialism and govt corruption.

here is an article that talks about vodoo in haiti and govt corruption due to the drug trade.

http://www.americandaily.com/article/95

Re: This Is Why Non-Christians Hate Us

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeffrey (Post 865213)

Are you saying Ananias and Saphira were not a judgement of God?
Is He not the same yesterday, today and forever?
Is he still involved in the affairs of men? Do you have something that says God won't judge mankind in the NT?

Only asking...

You said "God judged nations" in the New Testament. The death of Ananias and Saphira wasn't a judgement of a nation I don't believe.

Re: This Is Why Non-Christians Hate Us

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dedicated Mind (Post 865201)

Well I agree this is a tragedy and I support our country's effort in responding. But why is Hati and Africa, for that matter, so poor?

Does anyone know anymore details about this pact with the devil?

It's hearsay, at best.

The following is from: http://www.blackandchristian.com/art...in-10-05.shtml

Quote:

"The satanic pact allegedly took place at Bois-Caïman near Cap-Haïtien on August 14, 1791 during a meeting organized by several slave leaders, under [Dutty] Boukman’s leadership, before launching what would become Haiti’s Independence War. This brutal period lasted 13 years until the last survivors of the French expeditionary forces, dispatched to Saint-Domingue with the sole purpose to re-establish slavery, were allowed by Dessalines to leave the island and return to Napoleon. Those who made it safely to France wrote and reported about the utmost bravery and supreme courage of Haiti’s indigenous army. ...

"Exploring the religious argument
I was born and raised in Haiti, and I am a graduate of the State University in Port-au-Prince. I am also a believer in the Lord Jesus-Christ in accordance with the Bible. In all of my studies of Haitian history, however, I have yet to find a good evidence of even the idea of Satan’s assistance in the Independence War, let alone a satanic pact.

For quite some time now, several articles on the Internet have mentioned the existence of an iron pig statue in Port-au-Prince as a monument to commemorate Haiti’s so-called pact with the devil through Vodou. The statue would be in remembrance of a pig that was killed during the gathering by the African slaves. In an effort to know more about that rumor, I contacted several authors about the exact location of the pig statue that’s incidentally nowhere to be found in the country. Their answer was complete silence, a simple apology, or just the removal of the reference from their texts.

One writer was grateful to me for pointing out the inaccuracy of her article, and she made the necessary adjustment. But I am sure that the same allusion can be found somewhere in other published pieces of writing and documents. The worst part of the whole picture is that the story is believed by many sincere Christians in America and around the world; and not only do they believe it, they also spread it as fact. The tragedy of our age is that repeated lies are often mistaken for the truth, especially when repeated long enough. That’s particularly the case in religious circles where faith on the part of the audience is generally expected, but that should never be so for those who believe in the Bible.
Maybe, believers need to return to biblical texts like 1 Thessalonians 5:21, “Test everything. Hold on to the good”."

The words of one man of Haitian extraction who attempted to authenticate the story.

Jean-Jacques Dessalines was the first ruler of the newly independent state of Haiti. He unfortunately took a turn toward autocracy and proclaimed himself "emperor." There wasn't much good that really came from the immediate turmoil of the French Revolution and Haitian history should be considered in that light. Whatever faults he may have had, there is no record of Dessalines making a "pact with the devil" to overcome the French. It was the "utmost bravery and supreme courage of Haiti’s indigenous army..." that drove the French out.

Also, Pat Robertson seems to have confused Napoleon III with Napoleon Bonaparte himself when he says, "They were under the heel of the French, you know Napoleon the third and whatever. And they got together and swore a pact to the devil."

"They got together..." The entire nation of Haiti "got together" and made a "pact with the devil?" Most of Haiti's civil problems stem from the fact that "They" have never really gotten together since they broke their chains. 1804 was before Napoleon the Third was even born.

Re: This Is Why Non-Christians Hate Us

Hmmm... And America was punished on 9/11 for their Godlessness, corruption, and so forth, too, right?
http://www.defraudingamerica.com/dru...ion_right.html

(TIC)

Re: This Is Why Non-Christians Hate Us

Quote:

Originally Posted by missourimary (Post 865223)

Not only does a statement like that turn off non-Christians, it often turns the stomachs of Christians as well. The supposed pact with the devil took place in 1711, almost 300 years ago. I could venture to guess that none of the people involved in any such pact (if it actually took place) were still alive in 2010.

But Prax is right in stating that we realize Robertson doesn't speak for all Christians, or even most.

I remember our first Search for Truth bible study and hearing about Ham's sin against his father Noah being the reason the black "race" has experienced the problems they have.

Re: This Is Why Non-Christians Hate Us

The island of Hispaniola was the footstool of Catholic Spain and the seat of the Viceroyalty of New Spain under its first governor Christopher Columbus and then his son Diego. I have visited the fortress that Diego inhabited.

The Spanish later ceded control to Catholic France.

In the 1790's, Under the direction of a fervent catholic, General Toussaint Louverture played a key role in what was the first successful attempt by a slave population in the Americas and the world to throw off the yoke of European colonialism. He defeated armies of three imperial powers: Spain, France, and Great Britain who had control of various areas on the island. Under his direction, Catholicism was declared the only state religion of a freed Haiti.

Re: This Is Why Non-Christians Hate Us

I do not perceive Pat Robertson as a true Prophet. But some who speak so strongly against him for being so evil should consider:

The 700 Club has been helping the poor in many nations for many years. Food, medical supplies, schools, you name it. His ministry has always been compassionate. He has through his ministry done far more for the poor than almost any Christian or other type relief agency organization ever.

Re: This Is Why Non-Christians Hate Us

In the Bible, last I checked, God generally made a point of warning people or giving them an opportunity to repent before killing them. Also, their deaths were immediately and obviously shown as from God for specific deeds, and many times God's people were told ahead of time that the judgment would take place.

It is easy to say that someone else's bad situation is their fault or the wrath of God. It is quite another matter when it happens to us.

Re: This Is Why Non-Christians Hate Us

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeffrey (Post 865210)

Fallwell has passed on. So easy now.
Robertson and Dobson should not be in the same sentence. Dobson is using his influence in the civic area -- not my passion, and not really the Missio Deo, but more power to him. His ministry at FOTF has been ENORMOUSLY helpful for Christians worldwide.

700 Club. Well, people know the things he's saying. I'm sad they keep funding him too.

Robertson and Dobson should not be in the same sentence......to you. Maybe even me. But "They" don't see it that way. They lump in all these guys together. When the "separatist", "We're-better-than-you" tone is trumpeted, all these guys are lumped in together.

Dobson did a lot of good for a long time. But in his latter years he has started to say some very unfortunate things, in my opinion, that have hurt "the cause."

His boycott Christmas shopping list is one thing. Another is his questioning of Barak Obama's Christianity. Not good. Not good at all.

Re: This Is Why Non-Christians Hate Us

Quote:

Originally Posted by RandyWayne (Post 865240)

I remember our first Search for Truth bible study and hearing about Ham's sin against his father Noah being the reason the black "race" has experienced the problems they have.

And I think that is a very sad (and even sick) statement too. Ever seen a picture of Ham? Yes, I've heard the theory. They each settled in different areas and therefore they must have fathered each race. Three sons. Asian, European, and African. What about the native Americans, then? How did this one man father three races? And how is it that we are so sure of their races, over 4000 years later?