Just as I figured.

The cranky Men have arrived ...Run Run Run ! ! ! !

Now, just what did you figure, OP?

I am not getting frustrated you took it wrong. All these folks are very much alive the pain is fresh and I don't know who all is on thei forum and I have no desire to add misery to their wounds.

More New Bethel than the VotK for me.

Only been by the VotK.

Never been inside.

I figured that you really didn't know CM and that you were giving commentary based on someone else's view.

Maybe I'm wrong and your were his buddy.

If so I apologize.

Your apologize is accepted.

I knew Carol Martin quite well. I knew many of the preachers associated with him.

In fact, a notable UPC pastor here in Houston, from Biloxi, had a brother, now deceased who, with his family attended there. I knew several other of the saints that was there, most of their names are now long since forgotten.

Why did you think that I said that I was "his buddy?" Where did that come from? No! I was NEVER his buddy. Nor would I have wanted to be HIS BUDDY. Good grief! He was a good man though. He really loved the Lord and wanted to do the right thing.

When you say you knew the Bishop well, did you attend services while he pastored at New Bethel?

j/w

Yes I did.

I attended there in the 60s a number of times. I used to know everyone out there at one time. Goodness, that was 40 years ago or more.

btw, I added to my post a little above.

Thanks.

I too attended and preached at NB back in the late 60s when the Bishop was still pastoring there.

I knew "the notable UPC pastor from Houston" and his brothers also.

I didn't say you were his buddy, I said "Maybe I'm wrong and (maybe) your were his buddy".

You know, MAYBE you were his buddy.

Anyway...

Just one "cranky man" to another.

Hee heeeeeeeeee

There is more reality in Alice in Wonderland than the myth portrayed in this in this post. Keep believing most people think apostolics are God fearing people. Keep believing your televisions are moitors. Keep believing the internet is less harmful than television. Make up some hypothetical what ifs. It's what your movement prides itself on.

Just as I suspected.

Trash conservatives with faulty reasoning.


:laffatu

now, when you say "YOUR MOVEMENT", are you saying that you yourself are not also Apostolic ???

I differ with you if you are saying that most people believe apostolics are not God fearing, law abiding, loyal to our country etc .. type of people.
I do have a problem with those who say the internet is harmless. I work for a church and grew up in a pastor's home. seen Too too much to ever buy that

Just as I suspected. You can deflect the truth, but you can't handle the truth. THe dilusion of legalism has been around for over 2000 years. Can't explain the hit and run tactics. Keep making random statements without backing them up. At least my comments are rooted in reality.

Thad,
I'll save you time from extracting my views which are scattere all over the place. I would suggest if have time, please read the first post of this thread. It may explain the perception of apostolics to the general public and give you an idea of why the thread was started.

What that lady observed about apostolics is a common observation in the four corners of the earth.

The word apostolic is not defined in the Bible. THe only definitions we have are made man definitions based on personal perspective of that apostolic should mean.

Some labels that are clearly defined in the Bible are believers, disciples, christians and sinners.

As evident by this thread and others on similar topics labelling oneself as an apostolic only serves to gratify the ego. An apostolic identity doesn't mean anything to God.

Since apostolic is a self serving label with no biblical definition, I cannot in all good conciense say I am an apostolic. There is nothing in scripture that says this makes one apostolic.quote=Thad;122884]now, when you say "YOUR MOVEMENT", are you saying that you yourself are not also Apostolic ???

I differ with you if you are saying that most people believe apostolics are God fearing, law abiding , loyal to our country etc .. type of people.
I do have a problem with those who say the internet is harmless. I work for a church and gerw up in a pastor's homw. seen Too too much to ever buy that[/quote]

[/QUOTE]

Then you are NOT an Apostolic?????????????????????

I refuse to define my relationship with Christ with a self-serving subjective label. I'll save that for people who need the crutch of a label to carve out an identity.

What about the LDS groups who are polygamist . They look Apostolic/ Pentecostals, when we first moved to UT our neighbors thought we were apart of a LDS polygamist . When we sat down and talk to them they had no ideal what an Apostolic/ Pentecost looked like. So I rather not look or be mistaken as a LDS polygamist ~


http://media.canada.com/idl/ntnp/200...449-101056.jpg

mother and child near the polygamist colony

http://www.uncorrelated.com/images/polygamy2.jpg

We have Weslyean groups here that dress according to Biblical edicts but are NOT saved because that have not been born again and some look better than some Pentecostals in the area. However folks do know they profess Christ by their look even though they may not. So the polygamist look godly and are not everyone looked like that 75 years ago.

This is no doubt why Paul said "women are to learn in silence":happydance :woohoo :dancing :amen And we are NOT suprized either. So NO suprizes today there rarely are any suprizes on here.:heeheehee

This issue has been proven over and over but none are as blind as those who will NOT see. Emulate Tammy Faye & Jan and dispise saints have at it.

Steve~ As I have said in the past I really have no issues with you. No I do not agree with you, but your the only one who been honest enough to say, "Yes I believe and teach the dress issues is heaven or hell'! You don't twist or dance around when ask like many here do, and for that I respect you.

Thank you and yes I do believe what preach at home and abroad. Might not agree but never misunderstood.:bubble

Your very welcome Sir~I really do respect your honesty.

No one is suggesting anyone look like Tammy Faye & Jan. Relying on extremes to prove your point proves your point is shaky... at best.

Keep your eye on the ball.

When you STATE that I preach another Gospel you are indeed accusing me of heresy and therfore, according to scripture I would be accursed.

Perhaps going beyond a primary level of reasoning when you post would allow you to see how some statements lead to obvious conclusions?

BTW, it is unwise to judge what I preach when you have no idea what I preach. Which is exactly what you did. Of course I doubt you will see it that way.

There are a couple of conservative minded people that posted who understood the theme of this thread was not to bash standards but to bring to awareness of the dillusion of what we think an apostolic is and what the perception of an apostolic is. There is a huge gap between the two groups.

This should be a time for introspection anyone who wears an apostolic label. Unfortunately self-denial supercedes common sense. The perception the world has of apostolics is not because they are ignorant or in the dark. The world's perception of apostolic comes from years of observed behavior.

Okay. Wait a second. The world, on the one hand, does not know what Apostolic means but on the other hand they have observed years of behavior?

Which is it? They do know or they don't know?

And please do not take some of our answers as self-denial superceding common sense. The real common sense is knowing that subjects such as this never get a fair hearing around here. I learned long ago on FCF that to discuss specific standards was futile. Trying to discuss a subjective term such as "apostolic" is just as futile, IMO.

I'll repeat it again. The point of this thread is to say what the world sees as apostolic is different than what those who claim to be apostolic. I've stated from the beginning it is a matter of perception. There is no inconsistencies with my posts.

In my own opinion, apostolic is a subjective term thus no opinioin from me what apostolic is or isn't. I'm passing along what the world sees as an apostolic. What they see define as an apostolic is far diffierent than what apostolics define.

Refer to Jim Yohe's Believer's Bootcamp. He writes about a Wal-Mart Clerk brush with "apostolic" people in a day to day environment. If I have time later, I'll post some excerpts from the book.

"The world...."

"They...."

Who is "the world/they" that you speak of?

Is it folks you personaly know, other than the woman you mention in your original post, who is "the world/they"?

Is "the world/they" a cross section survey someone has done?

Just wondering, who in the world is "the world/they"?

The world you ask about is the world you are trying to convince of your spiritual superiority. Observations of apostolics are pretty much universal through out the four corners of the states.

You still are trying to attack the message with out adressing the problem it exposes. There are other posters who have admitted that people have told them the same thing I observed. Jim Yohe makes the same observation in his book Believer's Bootcamp.
[QUOTE]Would it suprise you to know that to the world at large, we may be known more for our hypocrisy than for our doctrine? For being ready to strain at their gnats while eagerly swallowing our own camels of inconsistency!... We must be aware that both God and the world are tuned into us even when we aren't tuned into them or Him![
-Jim Yohe's Believer's Bootcamp pg. 225 /QUOTE]

Are you ready to discuss the issue? Or would you rather keep barking with your head tucked between your legs like a little puppy whose been beaten for missing the newspaper?

I thought about posting more of the JY article about what wal-mart employees think of apostolics, but I don't think I could handle Old Paths scorching commentary on how stupid wal-mart employees are. Not my idea of an effective rebuttal, but it seems to be the only one he can come up with...

If you can't post with any credibility then just try to destroy the credibility of those who post contrary to your beliefs:lol Good observation TV1a:sing

Blessings, Rhoni

Thnx. It wasn't that difficult.

Carry on with your defense based entirely of what you say the world thinks.

Your arguement is subjective and so can not be proved or disproved.

Carry on.

PS

tv1a YOU said walmart employees were stupid, not me. :D

Whatever. To repeat Epley, "There is no one so blind as the one who will not see."

You didn't keep your eye on the ball.