Gay apostolics?
 

Hey all, Jeff here. I know that I haven't posted a lot lately. As usual I've been busy with school, which I am thankful for. I do read the posts quite often and you all are a great bunch of people. I'm just not as opinionated as I used to be and don't post as often as I should I suppose.

I was curious about something. What do you all think about the gay apostolic movement that has been going on? There is the National Gay Pentecostal Alliance out of Michigan, the Reconciling Pentecostals of AZ and FL, and the New Life Community Church in Indiana run by an ex-UPC minister, Randy Duncan, who I understand is a great friend of the Manguns out of Alexandria, LA.

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

I think most here agree with the bible. What does light have to do with darkness?


Gay apostolic is an oxymoron.


you cannot be gay (active in the gay lifestyle) and saved. If a person is a practicing homosexual and wants to be saved, they need to repent, find a good church and stop sinning.


any other questions?

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

Very well said.

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

That sums it up rather nicely! :thumbsup

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

End of story! :thumbsup

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

I don't think that we should dismiss these people so readily.

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

Dismiss? What do you propose? That we accept them as fellow Christians?

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

Well I'm not sure because the Holy Ghost moves in areas where sometimes we are not willing to go ourselves. We in pentecost are quick to judge a person by labels not knowing the lives of the individuals. I'm certainly not here trying to stir the dust. I'm just trying to understand.

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

Practicing homosexuality is not a "label" used to judge anyone. It is an act, a sin, and one that is specifically discussed in the Bible. The act has already been judged in clear terms.

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

Gay apostolic now how can a gay apostolic get the holyghost and speak in tongues????????? This is going to be a real neat discussion

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

I don't believe that we should not reach out to all people, but I am a firm believer that we cannot afford for a minute to be unwilling to teach Bible.

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

I understand. I'm just wondering what do we do with the L W's in it all. We sing their songs in our churches, but we refuse to have them in our midst. Seems to me almost like a double standard (?).

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

Amen.

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

I would be the first to agree that we don't always know the lives of other people. I would completely agree that while I think that MissBratt (for instance) lives a life that is certainly a fine example of what a Christian should be, there still could be parts of her life that I am totally unaware of. Not saying that there is, just using her as an example. I hope that's ok, MissBratt.

The problem with applying that to THIS situation tho is that if a person has lined themselves up with the gay community or gay apostolic church, and said that they are a part of it because that is their lifestyle, then there is not much left to speculation. In that case, whatever else is right in their life, there is still this one very BIG thing that is clearly against Biblical teaching.

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

Well I'm wondering what do we do with the L W's ? We sing their songs in our churches, but we won't have them in our midst. Seems almost like a double standard (?).

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

Sorry about the repost. Got a little confused. Smiles

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

who is dismissing? most folk here will agree that a call to repentance is no dismissal.

Should we have a Frist Apostolic Church of practicing Adulterers? Liars? Thieves?

Should we get all excited about The Pentecostals Who Murder?

dismiss? A call to repentance is the opposite of dismissal. dismissal as you are using it mean EXCUSE the sin.

There is never an excuse for sin.

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

Same way as anyone else.

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

So god will let his spirit dwell in a gay person?

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

And I agree!!:ursofunny

We should show them love but not accept them as Apostolics until they repent and surrender to God.

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

I can't believe I'm going to say this, but..............

If you won't allow someone on the platform to sing because they trim their hair or wear a touch of make-up, why would it be ok to allow them on the platform when you know they are openly gay?

That doesn't mean they aren't welcome in your worship services. I can come to your services with my short hair and make-up and even in slacks. Most of you would welcome me with open arms. And then pray that God would get ahold of me and shake those things out of me. I can chuckle when I say that, but you know it's true. LOL. So if you can welcome someone else who does not live the lifestyle you believe in, surely you could also welcome someone who lives the gay lifestyle. That does NOT mean you would give them a position of authority - absolutely not. But surely you would welcome any sinner.

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

Holyghost filled gays that is awsome LOL....

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

Kind of makes you wonder if a person who professes to live in sin actually has the holy ghost and has been born again. Then again it makes me wonder if maybe their speaking in tongues and all that really isn't the holy ghost. I thought Acts 2:38 is how we are born again. How can a born again person willing live in sin?

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

I'm sorry, but I'm not willing to accept that a practicing sinner is a Christian, especially when instead of being repentant or even struggling against the sin, they accept it within themselves and propagate more of the same in others.

I do NOT hate homosexuals--but I do reject their behavior as sinful, and I do not believe it can coincide with Christianity.

Galatians 1:6-12
I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:

Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.

But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.

As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received, let him be accursed.

For do I now persuade men, or God? or do I seek to please men? for if I yet pleased men, I should not be the servant of Christ.

But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man.

For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

These are some very interesting replies. Makes me ponder.

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

Maybe you are talking about folks who struggle with the sin of homosexuality or have those tendencies but do not practice their homosexuality.

We all are flesh and struggle with various temptations.

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

Agreed. Well said. There is no way around it.

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

seriouly dude, what is there to ponder? Sin is sin. Sin is to be repented of, not flaunted and turned into a point of fellowship in the church!

What are you pondering?

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

I guess I get a little confused myself with threads like this.

Why is that gay people are to get some sort of special treatment than anyone else?

Are we to arrange our church services differently? I can understand perhaps having a recovery program in place for them.

But I think most churches try to reach out to everyone regardless of their backgrounds and struggles.

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

No such thing!

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

That's fine--I understand your point. My point is not that we all struggle from time to time with different things--I'm sure many do--I know I have my own struggles.

However, we're talking about people who are NOT struggling against or denouncing their sin, but accepting it, justifying it by twisting scripture, and passing on that bondage to others.

Again, the scripture I just quoted--

Galatians 6:10 "For do I now persuade men, or God? or do I seek to please men? for if I yet pleased men, I should not be the servant of Christ. "

Are we supposed to preach what men what to hear? If we only tell people what they want to hear, we aren't servants of Christ, but of men.

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

I would only add turning their sin into a point of fellowship

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

Did you ever hear about the pig that was clean returning to the mud puddle or the dog returning to its vomit?

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

Jeff, read the first book of Romans, you'll have a total understanding. Back around 1974 a young man came to our church wanting to be delivered from a practicing homosexual lifestyle. Tha evangelist, pastor and the young man's dad laid hands on him and he started callin on the name of the Lord and almost immediately he began vomiting violently and I was worshipping God while standing with my eyes closed, speaking in tongues and I actually heard the devil's stampede out of the church. Hard to grasp, huh? That's what I think about homosexual apostolics, there aint no such thing until they vomit up the devils and repent, then they can be called Apostolics, know what I mean. Aint never seen that quite like that since. That spirit is getting as bold as a lion

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

Makes you ponder what? Are you pondering scripture? Do you believe we should accept homosexuality as a Christian lifestyle?

Should we also accept it when a pastor has an illicit affair or when a single minister commits fornication?

Is it alright for a Christian to regularly steal from the local supermarket?

Should Christians accept lying as something people do because their flesh is inclined to it, and thus not name it as sin?

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

Having been in the pentecostal church all of my life, I've seen a lot of things and lived a lot in my short life. I've been a student of the Bible for most of my adult years and a graduate of bible college. It is always good to know the opinions of other pentecostals throughout the country about certain things. I'm sure this thread won't die so easily. You all are a great bunch.

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

I'll try to be brief & vague.:)

I know and have worshiped with some people who are gay. I cannot speak for all or everyone...the ones I was worshiping with were really worshiping God and they did speak with tongues...IMO...it was the "real" Holy Spirit.

this did mess with my theology alot....but so did the first time I saw a woman wearing pants pray for someone and they got healed...or many other examples I could give.

I AM NOT SAYING THAT SIN IS OK, ALRIGHT, OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT!!

Just sharing my experience.

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

I want to know how god will fill a gay person with the holyghost I believe he can but I know most on here will not accept it...If it is true it will defiently (sp) change things..

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

You're exactly right. To me, this would be like having churches based on the premise "Apostolic Liars", or "Stealing Saints." How about "Apostolic Porn Addicts Church", or "Apostolic Swingers?" "Apostolic Church of We Believe It's Okay To Murder Your Neighbors." ????????

It's ludicrous.

Re: Gay apostolics?
 

what does Paul's gospel have to do with being gay?