Born Gay? Or God's Call?
 

One of Satan's most dangerous lies you'll ever have to deal with is that the homosexual is "born gay, it's in his/her genes." The purpose of this lie is to instill hopelessness! But I am here to tell you that if you are gay, it it NOT in your genes! And if I were to tell you that it is, I would be telling you that you are a hopeless case. If you were to be born gay, and it is part of your biology, change would be impossible. For example, I was born with hazel eyes. Today, over forty years later I still have hazel eyes. There were many times in my youth when I yearned to have blue eyes, but the mirror always failed me. When I was born, my genes said I would be five-foot-ten, and sure enough----it happened just that way, even though there were times I felt awfully tall and gangly!

This "born gay" lie has been repeated so many times that it appears to be scientific. It appears to be reasonable. If you are looking for an excuse to continue in your sin, it is an easy lie to believe. You don't feel so guilty. And if you help spread the lie, others won't think you're so guilty, either.

But if you are looking for an escape from this behavior. it is good news to learn that homosexuality is sin, not genetic. Because that means you can change, you are not stuck in this mode! We are stuck with our genes----but not with our sins. Hallelujah!

It's so simple; please try to see it. Repent, turn and walk away from it. Go the other way. I did no say it is easy. Nothing good is ever really easy. I said it was simple. Only Satan and his public relations department have complicated it and muddied the waters. There is great hope to be found in a gracious God.

But, for the sake of argument, just say----even if that were true----even if you were "born gay"----you need to remember this: celibacy is a gift. For His own reasons, God calls some people to celibacy. I believe this is a very special, precious call, because even our Lord Jesus chose that life for Himself while on earth. We each have a different call and a different path to walk with God. We have some awesome men and women of God today who are single, and are doing a tremendous work for the Lord. I know men and women evangelists who would enjoy it so much if the Lord sent them a spouse----but since He has not, they have devoted their lives and service to the Kingdom of God. Look at the apostle Paul. "But I would that all men were even as I myself. But every man hath his proper gift of God, one after this manner, and another after that" (I Corinthians 7:7).

Have you ever considered that perhaps God is calling you or your loved one----not into homosexuality----but to a deeper kind of consecration, set apart unto Him? But that call could be interpreted, on a subconscious level, as an aversion to the opposite sex, thus homosexuality? Does what I'm saying make sense?

Satan says otherwise: he would try to convince you that you just can't help it: it is all beyond you, and that you're so weak and frail you simply must indulge in this lifestyle. But stop and think about it: I could be writing these same words to the college co-ed seeking an opposite-sex mate, because you see, it makes no difference----we can live a pure and celibate life----with God's help. Paul tells us,"...he that is unmarried careth for the things that belong to the Lord, how he may please the Lord" (I Corinthians 7:32). The point is, no one has to have a sexual life! Heterosexual or homosexual. Sex is a gift to a man and woman who have joined in holy matrimony. Any other use of it----homosexual or heterosexual----is sin, and is not the will of God. Sex is a powerful drive, but not one that has to be served at all costs.

What are your thoughts on this subject?

dude!!

chosenbyone,

It is good to see you articulate a clear stand regarding homosexuality. I am also glad you are putting your trust in God for your future, both earthly and eternal.

Berk,

Have you denounce homosexuality as sin and are you prepared to put your trust and hope in the Lord for your future? I'm a bit puzzled by some of your statements, which could be interpreted as double-minded? You know what the word says about a double-minded man?

I'm praying for you, Berk. I was wondering if you had a chance to read my post on your thread today? God has a plan for you and I pray that you would find His perfect will for your life.

Blessings to you...

sorry.. that's what I told mom when I "outed" to her. I prolly shoulda said that, huh?

I have denounced it... I have asked for forgiveness.. I have been forgiven... I was refilled with the Holy Ghost... I'm complely through with it! Amen!

I read your post. Thank you. I'll respond to it soon.

CC1,

Thank you for writing what you did above. Not too long ago, I withdrew from the world and everyone in it: determined to live my last days in isolation and shame.

My life since has been filled with an abundance of God's love and grace that I would like to share with as many people as He would allow.

AFF was a very big part of my journey out of shame and back into the light of God's creation.

chosen

Berk ... once again I'm so happy for you ... our God is an awesome God!!!!!!!

Our sins ... have been cast into the sea of forgetfulness.

Amen!

Dan Scott really talked about in a sermon two important things I found interesting.

First he put forth the thought that while therpists and counselors are good at helping people come face to face with their issues only God can change the person.

Secondly he talked about how there comes a point in counseling when a person has to face the reality they don't want to face about themselves. Also the same situation with preachers and people that get revealed to be in gross sexual sins. He said that it is right after that horrible, miserable moment when all of their failures are brought to light that they actually feel the freeest. It is the first time in a long time they are no longer living a lie and trying to hide things. As painful as it is and embarressing as it is it gives them a point to have a new start from with all of their foibles and weaknesses exposed.

I'm glad to hear that you have sought forgiveness. You know, you don't have to go through his alone, Berk. Many people that have struggled with sexual sins have a longer journey of deliverance than someone struggling with other sins. That is not to say that God can't deliver someone on the spot from what has them bound; however, history has shown for whatever reason, it doesn't occur very often for homosexuality.

There is no condemnation if you are in Christ and you are leaning on him fully trusting in your complete deliverance. You have many friends and I hope that you will find a godly brother to help you with this journey.

You don't have to do go it alone, Berk. You are always welcomed to PM me.

Thanks,
chosen

It is very liberating.

PM incoming...

If I was a person who had a problem with adultery....I would not PM men because I would be very careful (and I only PM on a limited basis as it is). Likewise I think there should be some boundaries for those in this struggle. I think those who struggle with homosexuality should counsel with someone who has always been heterosexual or maybe in groups. My opinion.

CC1,

Not too long ago, this topic was so strongly avoided due to the stigma attached to the sin. The church has found itself in a place where it could no longer ignore what has been buried for so long.

Our churches have always had congregants who suffered in silence and many of those were lost to a world that welcomed them with open arms. I believe that we can longer keep this a secret, and hiding what the Lord is dong in these people's lives. These testimonies need to be shared. The more people standing up to testify to what the Lord has done, the more those who are struggling will start reaching out and receiving the help and the support that they desperately need from their pastors and from the church.

That is a very warranted concern. :)

Well, in some cases your statement would be true. My response to Berk was that he needs to build himself up in the Holy Ghost and take time to reestablish a relationship with Christ before even thinking about reaching homosexuals.

Sister, I'm an old shoe and I trust in God and not man for direction. Your post almost suggest that someone who was delivered from homosexuality couldn't counsel other people who need that example of God's grace in order to bring about their deliverance.

It's almost like you saying that a minister who was delivered from lying, adultery or alcoholism shouldn't counsel others that want to be set free from those sins. There is much that the body of Christ needs to learn about homosexuality.

I'm not saying that it can't be successfully done. I am saying that an adulterous woman should not counsel alone with a male pastor (this is practiced regularly in churches as a precaution even with non-adulterous women!) It just makes sense CBO...nothing personal is meant by it and I did not mean to offend you. It's just that I believe that certain boundaries are appropriate in certain situations. I think two former homosexual males would be wise not to counsel alone together but with another present or in groups. Even if nothing innappropriate is taking place, false accusations are something on top of everything else to be concerned about along with the other concerns in that situation.

I just wanted to clarify that there were many people that have left the church because they didn't feel that they could turn to their pastor (or other saints). I'm not bashing pastors in general, because I have a great pastor; however, I have seen pastors rail in the pulpit that homosexuals were bound for hell with no hope.

How could someone struggling with homosexuality who was exposed to that type of preaching feel comfortable going to those pastors for counseling? God will lead people who are desiring change to the right person to minister to them. God knows what He is doing and I for one won't stand in His way with my personal beliefs.

Thank you though for mentioning something that needed to be addressed this evening.

chosen

I agree with you ILG. I think part of it is dealing with "familiar spirits". They know how, when, and where to push our buttons to cause us to react a certain way to certain situations.

This was what I meant by the church needing to be educated regarding sin...homosexuality. The sin of adultery is a sexual sin just like homosexuality. Sexual sins are very difficult for some because that sin become en-grained in the very fiber of those individuals that struggle with those sins.

When you meet someone like Brother ******* in FL who was a drunkard....do you still see him and label him as a former drunkard or do you see him as a man of God? If we are ever going to see people set free from homosexuality we must see them through the cross of Calvary and through the eyes of Jesus.

Are my sins any different than yours if I've been forgiving and delivered? Would you feel comfortable if others in the church would gossip about your former life? It is fitting for me to give my testimony of deliverance for the Glory of God and give hope to others steeped in similar sins.

But to label me as a "former" would take away from the very act of redemption I found at Calvary. If Christ doesn't remember my sins what gives others permission to remember and not forget them too.

I do understand and share your concern about people with this struggle being unable to possibly talk to some pastors about this issue. I definately feel your pain in that, just as I felt the pain of people railing and laughing about alcoholics and such (or even Catholics) from the pulpit and pew and saying they also were bound for hell with no hope. This is my background. It is easy to laugh and make fun when you don't know anyone in those situations. It is easy to alienate those who struggle in your own pew. (On the flipside, I have come to understand the other side and am less sensitive to those types of jokes.)

I think those who are struggling should get help where they can....even if they have to break some rules to do it IF THAT IS THEIR ONLY HOPE. Generally though...those risks should not be taken unless there is no other alterntive. And then, if those risks are taken, they must be taken with great caution...knowing that it is the route for healing....knowing that there is a risk and temptation in the middle of it all.

I had some friends years ago that understood my pain, my ostracism, my alienation because they too felt it. BUt there was a danger in that. We could have gone off on some bandwagon of our own...an ungodly one....that would have come to no good in the end. That said, one's own salvation and love for God must come before anything....even healing of the soul. And if it does, I believe He will give us the desires of our hearts and give us healing in the long run. But those precautions can lead to the saving of the soul. No precautions could lose it.

We remember 'former' because it is important to understand the struggles and weaknesses of a person. I think this is true of all 'formers' not just homoseuxality. I think homosexuality along with other sexual sins is a bit different though in that it kind of creeps people out because folks don't want to be the object of any kind of wrong thoughts.

I'm very much informed about the subject of "familiar spirits." The homosexual is very much aware of something they call "gaydar." They recognize someone with a "familiar spirit" when that person is still involved in similar sins.

I'm I to believe that you feel that once a homosexual always a homosexual by what you wrote above? What we need as a body of believers is to seek the Lord and have him remove the preconceived ideas of people that have came out of lifestyles that we have no knowledge of...

If we don't walk in the knowledge of Christ the consequences could become very dire for many who need to be seen as children of God and not a hopeless case.

I don't think it's a matter of "once a homosexual, always a homosexual" but a matter of knowing what our weaknesses are and taking the appropriate actions to make sure we avoid putting ourselves in situations that could cause us to stumble. That goes for all of us no matter where we come from or what weaknesses we may have.

I wonder if I creep Jesus out? I would say that your statement above shocked me, but sadly I am not shocked at all.

God help us.

I am talking about ALL sexual sins, not just homosexuality. Adultery creeps people out too. And it should.

And sadly, you personalized what I said. I didn't say YOU creep people out, I said sexual sin does.

I think this conversation is going nowhere right now ... maybe we should put on ice.

Sister,

Don't you know that through our weaknesses He is made strong? You take away from the very essence of that passage and the power of the transformation from a life of sin to a life with Christ.

If you have scripture to substantiate your beliefs, please enlighten me. Otherwise, I don't feel the need to continue this debate with you.

chosen,

In Tamor's defense, I can vouch that she does not believe "once a homosexual always a homosexual."

Amen.

"In the multitude of counselors there is safety."

"Lead us not into temptation, but deliever us from evil."

I think it's sad, that you are picking apart what I say and making into something mean. I think it is you who is trying to make homosexuality something different from other sins because I have lumped it into the category of all sexual sins and said they should all be treated in the same way. You seem to want a special category where an adulterous woman does not counsel with a pastor alone, but homosexuals do counsel each other alone. I gave some good advice. You are right. This conversation should end. You are turning it into something that never was.

You assumed that I have weakness regarding homosexuality. I don't know how you came to that conclusion for only God can see my heart and know where my weaknesses are today. You mentioned a couple of your struggles with sin, so let me ask you if you consider them weaknesses today. I found that the Holy Ghost has empowered me to not have to fear what I've been set free from, namely homosexuality. I would never put myself in a situation if I didn't feel that God would go before me.

You mentioned that I want a special catagory for a woman struggling with adultery to not counsel with a man but a homosexual couseling another alone? I never said anything like that at all. Go back and the posts. What I'm hearing is that you are making false assumptions/accusations that many people throw out because of their lack of knowledge. I never turned anything that was written her around to be mean....I was just repeating what you were writing.

You assumed that because I WAS a homosexual that I couldn't counsel someone seeking deliverance from homosexuality for fear that I would be tempted. That is a very presumptous opinion. Let me explain that even when I was a homosexual, I wasn't tempted to give into any sexual desires with every man that crossed my path.

I would agree that a sister "struggling" with adultery shouldn't counsel with a man because she was still struggling with that sin. Now, if that sister were to be delivered and restored in God's sight, there shouldn't be any problem with her counseling with a man of God. Agreed?

CBO, I feel like you have twisted much of what I said.

I still hold to what I said, anyone struggling with sexual sins should use precautions in who they counsel with. Most pastors will not counsel alone with a woman, period, unless the door is open and a secretary nearby, etc. Homosexuality is not so different.

I agree...

Thanks, Berk.

This is what ILG wrote: "I think homosexuality along with other sexual sins is a bit different though in that it kind of creeps people out because folks don't want to be the object of any kind of wrong thoughts."

She didn't say she was creeped out and the point she was making was that people don't want to be the object of any kind of wrong thoughts coming from another. Meaning, people don't want others to look to them in a sexual manner that is wrong and THAT is why it creeps people out.

She said nothing personal toward you. However, in this you seem to be forgetting the other potential parties. Perhaps YOU may not be tempted, but ones yet struggling may well be. I agree with ILG's words of caution. There's no need to counsel if one is free and completely healed of a matter, is there? Otherwise, there is the difficulty of a potential problem by privately counseling with one of the same sex- whether it is homosexuality or adultery.

You've read things into her posts which were not spoken by her.

I totally agree with what you just wrote. I wasn't getting that from your earlier posts and if I read too much into what you were trying to relay, I apologize. At the time, I was busy receiving several PMs and switching back and forth between this thread and those PMs.

Your statement about being creeped out about people struggling with sexual sin could be damaging to someone lurking that may be looking for some compassion if there were caught in the grips of one of those sins.

Also, I don't even see myself as a sexual being. I couldn't make the connection of a heterosexual male minister counseling a adulterous woman with me counseling someone struggling with homosexuality. It may be hard for some to understand that I'm what many would consider asexual. I don't have any desires or thoughts of sex at all.

I tend to be somewhat sensitive to that type of language, because it does make it personal not to me at this stage of my life, but to others. Can you you understand?

Apology accepted.

As far as you being asexual, I think if you have a homosexual past I don't know that you could be considered asexual. A person who was asexual would be someone who has had no sexual feelings.

Language is an interesting thing. I think everyone should be creeped out by sexual sins. If they are not, I find that troublesome. I think it is more likely that they would be offended by what they THOUGHT I said rather than what I actually said. They would be assuming that I would be creeped out by they, themselves, when in effect, I said no such thing. I'm not sure I can take any responsibility for that. I think people involved in certain sins in the past sometimes read things into what people say. Sometimes people actually are nasty and militant, but unfortunately hurt and pain can cloud what people think other people say and they can be hurt by things that were never said in the first place.