***Exclusive: ALJC GS EXPECTING BOOM FROM UPCI TV FALLOUT? ***
 

A reliable source at GC has just reported the ALJC GS, Robert Martin, is expecting a boom in potential liberal/mod UPCI pastors if the TV resolution fails. Apparently, a contingent of pro-resolution pastors have been in talks w/ the ALJC.

They will leave their fellowship and join the ALJC if the resolution fails, or if it is so watered down, via amendments, that it would be virtually ineffective [i.e. Headquarter commercials only].

Has anyone heard this?

I just did...........

:crazyDan I did hear this today from a Pastor who is considering doing this....

The ALJC is hurting and needs some new ministers. I had an ALJC Dist. Supt tell me that in the last 5 years (something like that) the ALJC has lost close to or more than 800 ministers. Several have joined the UPC, which is kind of funny. We can just trade preachers

What a goat rope!

We will soon see if the TV issue will pay dividends for the ALJC. If the liberal/ mod/TV mantra holds water then it shouldn't be long before they surpass the UPCi in numbers...seeing that it is the answer and all. ;)

I have heard rumors lastyear when the resolution came up. Though it is not for sure. I would not be shocked if it happens, but I think that if it does not pass there may be a bad taste left in the mouths of some people to the degree that many may go independent. We will see.

BOOMM is not turing tail no matter what the title says.

:aaa

LOL...I thought it was about you too. I was going to send an egreeting to wish you well. Or was that get well soon? I can't remember. :sos

I'm still independent ,the budget fees are cheaper.

hmmm....I would have to go back and review the recording I made of our district conference a week or so back with bro. Martin speaking. If memory serves me correctly (and it has failed a time or two)... He did mention that we as an organization are going to do our best to grow, by home missions and by ministers/churches joining us. But it has been clear to us from my first encounters with the ALJC, that we welcome fellowship regardless of your denominal membership as long as you are apostolic.

IF people want to leave the UPC and come to the ALJC, as long as they leave on good standing we welcome them- no problems...if people want to leave the ALJC to go to the UPC or other groups, We let them go with the understanding we don't want to lose the friendship....

Yes we want to grow numerically as an organization, but we also know we are just one of many groups working to futher the Kingdom of God. We rather work together with all.

(NOTE: I don't speak for the ALJC, I am an licensed minister of them-, yes....but I speak my own opinions and observations.)

... About that, Bother Scott. I haven't received a check from you yet. How about getting up off that couch and sending my your dues. Suddenly I need a new DVD burner- and (for the UC's) no, I don't burn movies. Never burned a movie, ever.

Savonarola would have... and he was the classic ultra-con. :)

I have good friends in the ALJC and honestly I thought they only had about 1000 preachers? So losing 800 seems off to me. I know some of their larger churches they lost like Memphis-Cincinatti-Akron area.

Estimating 15 names per page, I have counted about 765 or so ministers listed in the directory currently. I think there is more, but that is a rough estimate.

If I send my dues to you and help you get a CD burner could you burn me a copy of the grapes of wrath ? or the rise and fall of the roman empire ?

I have never really gotten a clear answer as to why the ALJC has been going down in recent years.

Some have speculated that they are so similar to the UPC that the advantages of being part of a larger fellowship have caused some to leave for the UPC.

I have always found it interesting that UPC preachers wanting to use TV or have TV have not switched to the ALJC from the UPC. Especially those who are still bonafide three steppers and pretty conservative regarding standards.

The few ALJC congregations I have seen out at restaurants, etc all look exactly like UPC ones.

Other than their licensned ministers not having to hide TV's in therir homes or call them "monitors" and their ability to advertise or preach on TV I see no difference.

It's obviously made all the difference. Anytime now the ALJC should see worldwide revival for their efforts.

The truth is Theo that there are only a hnadful of ALJC churches with a TV ministry. But the ones that have one are in the tops in members. There are a few small churches, less than 200 members, that do a tv thing, but that is if they are in a somewhat rural areas. The major ones I know of that have a sucessful tv ministry 400+.

Great..then it is the answer then. Whew, glad that is settled. No need to put it off for further study..we have the successful example of the ALJC then as exhibit A.

Yet, in CC1's earlier post- he was saying that from the holiness standards side of things, the ALJC doesn't appear to be much different than the UPC.

Can we conclude that television has not, and does not cause the loss of standards that some in the UPC fear?

In which case, why ban television?

Maybe I'm incorrect but does the ALJC have state presbyters ?I understand that affliated ALJC churches are autonomous than affliated UPCI churches.

I am just giving you an example that it can work. The churches I know do not use this as the only form of outreach. It is just a part of the outreaches these churches do. I am not nor have I ever said that tv is the end all of door knocking, meeting in the market place, etc. It is just another type of outreach.

IMHO the reason ALJC constituents have seen little change from the allowance of TV, is because it has not been an issue for so long that they have learned to live "normally" without the constraints.

A personal example, my wife grew up in a home with TV, and I grew up in a home without one. My wife is not effected by TV at all. She can work, sleep, study, etc with a TV blaring constantly and it doesn't effect her, nor distract her. I, on the other hand, could not be in the same room with one without being glued to the thing.

As human beings, it is our nature to push the limits, but the limits/boundaries keep us from going over the edge. When the limits/boundaries are removed, very few people have the internal fortitude to keep from going too far. Thus, because the TV boundary has been in place for so long within the framework of the UPCI, many will see it as a removal of boundaries beyond TV alone.

Excellent thoughts.

I have a copy of the Ministerial Directory and Church Directory for the ALJC for 1978. That's the last year I had license with them. I went through and counted the ministers and came up with the number 378.

I know of some churches who used to be ALJC but are now UPC.
One would be the church in Michigan which used to be pastored by Bishop Parent. Another is the church in Barberton, OH pastored by Bro. Pamer. Another is the church in Cincinnati which was pastored by Bro. Sizemore until his death. The new pastor is UPC so the church is now considered UPC. These are some that I know of.

The 1978 directory listed 161 churches.