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-   -   Divorce and remarriage (http://www.apostolicfriendsforum.com/showthread.php?t=53175)

callednchosen1 03-02-2019 09:13 PM

Divorce and remarriage
 
Marriage in the church

One spouse was unfaithful through (online) pornography (wonder what else although claims made there was nothing else with anyone - the spouse spent time traveling/visiting several times annually with old friends from the world)

Other spouse stayed faithful for 19 yrs though the disintegration came within the first year, and later years the offending spouse stated that God would have to send them to hell about the pornography because they would never give it up!

Marriage continued to disintegrate to separation (lots of emotional/verbal abuse, aggression toward children, disregard in the marriage bed for consideration of dislikes), and backsliding to alcohol and over-buying things in spite of marriage friction on it

Separation for four years, continued abuse, and was never reconstructed to a marriage

Divorce filed by spouse who had been using pornography

That spouse remarried (since the other party was not willing to reconcile)

Is the spouse left unmarried able to marry <<< this spouse was not unfaithful?

callednchosen1 03-02-2019 09:14 PM

Re: Divorce and remarriage
 
Bit more info:

Spouse that went and remarried has rededicated (maybe) and continues to preach the apostolic message elsewhere

(FYI: Kids are devastated and have problems believing to salvation and none walk with God now. Please pray - thank you!)

Esaias 03-02-2019 09:22 PM

Re: Divorce and remarriage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by callednchosen1 (Post 1559189)
Bit more info:

Spouse that went and remarried has rededicated (maybe) and continues to preach the apostolic message elsewhere

(FYI: Kids are devastated and have problems believing to salvation and none walk with God now. Please pray - thank you!)

What do you mean continues to preach? Is this a preacher, elder, overseer, minister, evangelist, "prophet", etc? Or do you mean that this person just witnesses everywhere they go?

jediwill83 03-03-2019 05:56 AM

Re: Divorce and remarriage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by callednchosen1 (Post 1559188)
Marriage in the church

One spouse was unfaithful through (online) pornography (wonder what else although claims made there was nothing else with anyone - the spouse spent time traveling/visiting several times annually with old friends from the world)

Other spouse stayed faithful for 19 yrs though the disintegration came within the first year, and later years the offending spouse stated that God would have to send them to hell about the pornography because they would never give it up!

Marriage continued to disintegrate to separation (lots of emotional/verbal abuse, aggression toward children, disregard in the marriage bed for consideration of dislikes), and backsliding to alcohol and over-buying things in spite of marriage friction on it

Separation for four years, continued abuse, and was never reconstructed to a marriage

Divorce filed by spouse who had been using pornography

That spouse remarried (since the other party was not willing to reconcile)

Is the spouse left unmarried able to marry <<< this spouse was not unfaithful?


Love keeps no record of wrongs.


Lets start with that.


You're trying to go on a forum and condense nigh near 20 years of a dysfunctional sounding relationship with many complications and hanging it all on the question of whether the "innocent" spouse can marry.


This kind of thing...its never just about one persons porn addiction.


There are always deeper issues at work.



God is not taking sides in this other than a desire that those that are in sin and bondage be reconciled back to Him.

Michael The Disciple 03-03-2019 03:59 PM

Re: Divorce and remarriage
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by callednchosen1 (Post 1559188)
Marriage in the church

One spouse was unfaithful through (online) pornography (wonder what else although claims made there was nothing else with anyone - the spouse spent time traveling/visiting several times annually with old friends from the world)

Other spouse stayed faithful for 19 yrs though the disintegration came within the first year, and later years the offending spouse stated that God would have to send them to hell about the pornography because they would never give it up!

Marriage continued to disintegrate to separation (lots of emotional/verbal abuse, aggression toward children, disregard in the marriage bed for consideration of dislikes), and backsliding to alcohol and over-buying things in spite of marriage friction on it

Separation for four years, continued abuse, and was never reconstructed to a marriage

Divorce filed by spouse who had been using pornography

That spouse remarried (since the other party was not willing to reconcile)

Is the spouse left unmarried able to marry <<< this spouse was not unfaithful?

Clear cut case according to Jesus:

Matt 19:9

9And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.

The innocent party can marry again. The guilty party may not.

Steven Avery 03-04-2019 12:47 AM

covenent spouses, "divorce" leading to "remarriage
 
We have discussed this before, and it is hard to have edifying discussion.

The fornication "exception clause" is specifically not adultery, thus the strong case is made that it has a more specific reference involving unmarried / betrothals, similar to the questions around Joseph and Mary.

Overall, I suggest seeking out "marriage permanence" teaching. The real stuff. Old time Mennonite, and Holiness. Then compare with the more common, liberal, "your ok if you are not the guilty party, it is dissolved, move on, find a newbie" teaching of convenience, which can depart from the teaching of Jesus.

(Rule of thumb: the other side is the guilty party, or you can find ways to allow both sides to start with their new spouses.)

My belief is that the adulteration of the marriage covenant has led to a weakening of faith and the move of the Holy Spirit, and churches going downhill. Even the community I was involved in decided to "ok" a remarriage or two of an elder who had, before God, a living spouse, "divorced" only in the eyes of men. Awkward.

If you do not have a conviction, try to make sure you have gotten the best presentations from opposite sides. Be cautious about facile answers.

Then prayerfully reflect and consider.

Steven

coksiw 03-18-2019 07:52 PM

Re: Divorce and remarriage
 
OP,
There are different views about this topic. It is very difficult. I feel so sorry for those people and the consequences on those kids. Pretty devastating.
I don’t think a forum is an appropriate place to talk about this issue. There are a lot of variables involved. In this case, it may be best to look for counseling from the Pastor or an apostolic marriage counselor. Looking for God’s direction is the best.

Steven Avery 03-18-2019 10:13 PM

pastors and marriage counselors?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by coksiw (Post 1560158)
OP,
There are different views about this topic. It is very difficult. I feel so sorry for those people and the consequences on those kids. Pretty devastating.
I donít think a forum is an appropriate place to talk about this issue. There are a lot of variables involved. In this case, it may be best to look for counseling from the Pastor or an apostolic marriage counselor. Looking for Godís direction is the best.

Pastors and marriage counselors in these years are generally excuse-minded, in terms of the issue of the marriage permanence doctrinal consistency idea. They often have an underlying current of not wanting to offend members and potential members with a hard word.

And I do agree that we should be ultra-cautious about saying:
"Brother A, Sister B, you should do do this."

It is unlikely that we even have all the information accurately. We may not even have the right information as to who is the person's covenant spouse (ie. those in the marriage permanence movement who believe there is one covenant spouse.)

coksiw 03-19-2019 12:10 PM

Re: pastors and marriage counselors?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Steven Avery (Post 1560162)
Pastors and marriage counselors in these years are generally excuse-minded, in terms of the issue of the marriage permanence doctrinal consistency idea. They often have an underlying current of not wanting to offend members and potential members with a hard word.

And I do agree that we should be ultra-cautious about saying:
"Brother A, Sister B, you should do do this."

It is unlikely that we even have all the information accurately. We may not even have the right information as to who is the person's covenant spouse (ie. those in the marriage permanence movement who believe there is one covenant spouse.)

There are two camps regarding the "put away" and "divorce"and "divorce writ" what it actually meant in the context of the original listener. They both have plenty of arguments to defend their position. I think in situations like this which are already hard emotionally the best is to look for local counseling, and prayer. I'm 100% sure if you look for God's guidance in prayer he won't let you down.

Steven Avery 03-19-2019 01:32 PM

Re: pastors and marriage counselors?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by coksiw (Post 1560181)
look for local counseling, and prayer. I'm 100% sure if you look for God's guidance in prayer he won't let you down.

God's guidance will not let you down.

Local counseling often will.


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