Quote:
Originally Posted by Praxeas
The discussion in John 17 is contextually a different one from John 10 and Jesus puts himself grammatically before believers in that context too, using you logic that would mean Jesus was claiming to be us |
That’s impossible, for the plural verb forms imply that Christ isn’t God the Father at
John 10:30 and that neither he nor the Father are the apostles at
John 17:21-23. If Christ had wished to claim to be the Father, then he would have instead have used the verb to be in the first person singular; ‘I am the Father.’ Yet Christ never said this, proving that he’s not God the Father at all.
Putting your name before that of somebody else doesn’t mean that you are that person, and so I never made that claim, its simply a claim to equality or superiority in Greek and in most other languages for that matter. When referring to another person, in polite conversation we’d say even in English; ‘Praxes and I’ but never; ‘I and Praxeas,’ and certainly not ‘I and God,’ for being inferior to God you always put his name first to signify yoru subordination to him. So hey whan Christ put his name first; 'I and My Father' he's saying that he's equal to the Father - to God himself.