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Originally Posted by Jason
can I get chapter and verse on that? How are sound systems "meat in mine house?"
There is nothing wrong with supporting ministry-but I for one am unimpressed with the argument of those "who labor among us". In my area many oneness pastors have never held a real job. I can't help but wonder who has the welfare mentality. I preach often, yet I work a full time job, and in addition, don't ask wages for preaching. If I can get paid from the secular world, why burden the church? Let someone who is in need get that money.
Have you ever read the parable of the righteous Pharisee and the humble sinner?
The church I attend teaches against tithes, yet somehow we make it just fine without all of the dire straights you name. I don't even know the recipe for peanut brittle, and have never seen a church garage sale (except at a tithing church  ). Furthermore, other groups who don't tithe-such as the Churches of Christ, JW's, etc. seem to be making it okay.
change "tithe" to "give", AMEN.
Most people I have spoken to tell me how they struggle to even pay tithes. And I used to believe "tithes or HELL" myself, and belong to a church with that mindset. But many admitted to struggling just to pay them. I was even told by the minister that for a while He was putting tithes on his credit card because he was so broke.
Based on your post, I doubt you have ever truly studied out tithes according to the Bible, just sounds like alot of pot shots. |
Your statement regarding Lights, Sound Systems, ect., is mindless dribble. In case you haven't noticed, these are a part of Church dynamics today in this Country. We use these modern day formats to accomplish many things; tape/CD ministry, Lights so we can have church at night, ect. When you eat at a resturaunt, the bill you pay helps to sustain the whole opperation, not just the food in the freezer.
I've pastored for the last 13 years, working a secular job most of the time. I'm currently self employed, running my own Insurance Agency for the last five years. This has enabled us to pay off our building and land early. We came to this city 11 years ago and started a church from nothing, having services in our home. If you haven't been invovled with this type of work, you will never understand the sacrafice and committment needed to really do God's work.
The amount of the Tithe has nothing to do with my post. The "Tithe" is what matters. You can be a theif if it's 10 cents, or 10 dollars. When the bill comes to the table after eating, that's what you owe. If you eat and don't pay or just pay part of the bill, you are a theif.
Tithe and offering are different. No rocket science here. Giving is a part of both. They both must come from a willing heart. All requirements of God must be done with a willing heart.
I never said "Tithe or Hell". And, your referall to amount has nothing to do with Tithing. It's not how much, it's are you Tithing. Anyone who puts Tithes on a credit card has a problem with money, most likely. Americans don't budget correctly, over-extending themselves.
As far as studying out the issue, you are the one who shows much ignorance. You, and others, have still not addressed what Jesus said about rendering unto God what is God's. What is God's?? There has to be an amount. Jesus compared what was Ceasers, to what was God's; a percentage prevailed here.
Furthermore, I'll say this. People in this Country have complained about Illegal Immigration. The number one reason for this is, this group of people has "drained" our system, bringing states like California to the brink of Bankruptcy. I am from California and lived there 34 years. I watched many changes take place because people were unwilliing to abide by the law of paying income tax, or use the medical system that they never contributed to, or live in public housing that was funded by government programs.
We can deny this all we want to, but the Church is a system, requiring financial proceeds. Tithing in this Country is on the down-turn, people becoming "Illegal Aliens", sucking from the system, and not appreciating what they have. They want to call the police, but not fund the police department. They want the protection of our Military, but don't want to pay those who are in harms way. They want the Pastor to run to their every need, but the Tithe, forget that, that's MY MONEY!!
And, it bugs me to no end, that the laity sometimes thinks the Pastor has to live like a paulper, while they drive a nice car and have a nice home. Our culture is different here, and we abound in ways because many Americans work very hard. I didn't ask to be born here, and my prosperity has come through getting off of the couch and embracing the field of hard work.