Thread: 09-09-09
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Old 09-11-2009, 01:17 AM
Walks_in_islam Walks_in_islam is offline
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Re: 09-09-09

We are intended to put it all together and realize some accounts mentioned some of the people there and others mentioned others. The truth is, all the people mentioned in all accounts were there.

You are? Where is this idea of what you are intended to do spelled out again? You are now "the one who determines what the truth is" now? I thought the truth was spelled out in the words. What the words say and what you say appear to be different.

By the way, why does the Koran teach men to beat their wives?

Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because Allah has given the one more (strength) than the other, and because they support them from their means. Therefore the righteous women are devoutly obedient, and guard in (the husband's) absence what Allah would have them guard. As to those women on whose part ye fear disloyalty and ill-conduct, admonish them (first), (Next), refuse to share their beds, (And last) beat them (lightly); but if they return to obedience, seek not against them Means (of annoyance): For Allah is Most High, great (above you all)."
Qur’an 4:34

By the way, why does the bible teach Christians to beat their children?

He who spares the rod hates his son

Withhold not correction from the child: for if thou beatest him with the rod, he shall not die

BUT: The good news is "Outdated language used to justify corporal punishment of children is set to be removed from new translations of the Christian Bible in Norway". What's a jot or tittle here and there? It has already been removed hasn't it? LOL

Your example:

"If any of your women are guilty of lewdness, Take the evidence of four (Reliable) witnesses from amongst you against them; and if they testify, confine them to houses until death do claim them, or Allah ordain for them some (other) way."
Qur’an 4:15


You left out this part:

"And those who launch a charge against chaste women, and produce not four witnesses (to support their allegations),- flog them with eighty stripes; and reject their evidence ever after: for such men are wicked transgressors"


What is nice about this Surah is that unless (4) independent witnesses are found, the word of the woman is taken over the accusations of the accuser and the requirement is for the accuser to be flogged.

BUT: It could be worse for them. They could be under the laws spelled out in the bible:

And the man that commits adultery with another man's wife, even he that commits adultery with his neighbor's wife, the adulterer and the adulteress shall surely be put to death. Lev 20:10

OH even worse - if a new husband accuses his wife of not being a virgin (bible):

But if this thing be true, and the tokens of virginity be not found for the damsel:
Then they shall bring out the damsel to the door of her father's house, and the men of her city shall stone her with stones that she die

Or she could be a rape victim under the terms of the bible:

If a damsel that is a virgin be betrothed unto an husband, and a man find her in the city, and lie with her;
Then ye shall bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with stones that they die; the damsel, because she cried not, being in the city; and the man, because he hath humbled his neighbour's wife: so thou shalt put away evil from among you. Being a rape victim gets you the death penalty?


You were saying what again about the Quran?

Why does the Koran promote hatred of Christians?

The Quran does not promote hatred of Christians. It promotes intolerance of those who have the words in front of them and then choose to not follow them.

What the Quran says about Christians:

Also from those who said, "We are Christian," we took their covenant. But they disregarded some of the commandments given to them.

If only they would uphold the Torah and the Gospel, and what is sent down to them herein from their Lord, they would be showered with blessings from above them and from beneath their feet. Some of them are righteous, but many of them are evildoers.
Say, "O people of the scripture, you have no basis until you uphold the Torah, and the Gospel, and what is sent down to you herein from your Lord." For sure, these revelations from your Lord will cause many of them to plunge deeper into transgression and disbelief. Therefore, do not feel sorry for the disbelieving people
Surely, those who believe, those who are Jewish, the converts, and the Christians; any of them who (1) believe in GOD and (2) believe in the Last Day, and (3) lead a righteous life, have nothing to fear, nor will they grieve.
Say, "O people of the scripture, do not transgress the limits of your religion beyond the truth, and do not follow the opinions of people who have gone astray, and have misled multitudes of people; they are far astray from the right path."
Condemned are those who disbelieved among the Children of Israel, by the tongue of David and Jesus, the son of Mary. This is because they disobeyed and transgressed.
They did not enjoin one another from committing evil. Miserable indeed is what they did.
You would see many of them allying themselves with those who disbelieve. Miserable indeed is what their hands have sent forth on behalf of their souls. GOD is angry with them and, consequently, they will abide forever in retribution.
And you will find that the closest people in friendship to the believers are those who say, "We are Christian."


Does not sound like this is teaching hatred to me. Perhaps you are "re-interpreting" like you did earlier with the bible.

"Why should we not believe in GOD, and in the truth that has come to us, and hope that our Lord may admit us with the righteous people?"
GOD has rewarded them for saying this; He will admit them into gardens with flowing streams. They abide therein forever. Such is the reward for the righteous.


Does not sound like hatred to me

Your example:

"O ye who believe! take not the Jews and the Christians for your friends and protectors: They are but friends and protectors to each other. And he amongst you that turns to them (for friendship) is of them. Verily Allah guideth not a people unjust." Qur’an 5:51

Alas How many times has this been shown to be true?

"O ye who believe! take not for friends and protectors those who take your religion for a mockery or sport,- whether among those who received the Scripture before you, or among those who reject Faith; but fear ye Allah, if ye have faith (indeed)."
Qur’an 5:57

Judging from your e-tone of mockery while dodging the discrepencies that were brough up I take it we won't become the best of friends LOL

"Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued."
Qur’an 9:29

"Those who reject (Truth), among the People of the Book and among the Polytheists, will be in Hell-Fire, to dwell therein (for aye). They are the worst of creatures."
Qur’an 98:6

Last but not least, to true Christians - the Quran teaches:

Those who believe (in the Qur'an), and those who follow the Jewish (scriptures), and the Christians and the Sabians,- any who believe in Allah and the Last Day, and work righteousness, shall have their reward with their Lord; on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve


Does not sound like hatred to me. Maybe you "interpret" hatred like you "interpret" that you are "intended to put different versions of stories from the bible together"
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