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Old 03-21-2018, 01:17 PM
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Esaias Esaias is offline
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Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Zion aka TEXAS
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Re: A Waldensian chimes in

Quote:
Originally Posted by Strict Baptist View Post
My, my, I am impressed! The Strict and Particular or Old Regular or Primitive Baptists, which was how almost all Baptists were at the foundation of the United States; we all we originally Strict coming from England. However, as most of our histories (Cramp, Armitage, Christian, Griggs, Bakkus, Daily et al) document, there arose beginning in the 1750s sects among us who brought in damnable heresies and unbiblical institutions. The prevailing issue became known as the Anti-Means, Anti-Missionary Baptists versus the Missionary, Means Baptists Spurgeon, Carrey, Sutcliffe, Ryland, Fuller ad nauseaum. Stanley Phillips documented well this whole sad affair in his book on hyper-Calvinism. The New School crowd, of which the defected SBC was once a part, now calling themselves one of the biggest oxymoronic misnomers, Reformed Baptist, desired to implement Raikes' sabbath schools, Bible societies, missions boards over church planting, but most alarmingly a modification of New Haven Theology and Amyraldism that is self-defeating. Some of the then-most imminent among we meek servants of Christ met for the Black Rock Address in 1832 stating our differences and unhappy separation from the Means crowd. Sadly with much violence to scripture, though we were as evangelical as that blessed George Whitefield, despite his Marrowism we deplore, we using the names we for once selected of Old School, Original and Primitive from Strict and Paticular, became bitter and lost that zeal until recently, though not all of us. These has been a concerted effort in soul-winning starting in the 1970s taking on since the 1990s not to regain the lost zeal from the New Schoolers and renamed General Baptists (most of the fundamentalists fall herein), but to obey our most blessed and only Potentate, King of Kings, Master of Masters. The term "Hardshell" is one used in derision of us but sometimes used. The original names came to designate our continuation in belief from our forefathers reaching back to the first century in predestination independently of the Protestants who we love in the truth; we did not raise our swords against them; with such names as Wycliff, the Welsh Baptists, Henricians who left Rome's evil churches bare, Bogomils, Peteobrussians, Albigensians, Novationists, Paulicians, Huss etcetera holding to the monergism Rome has ever loathed. "Strict" refers to strict communion; see JC Philpot's Strict Communion from gmchristianbooks.com, my publisher.

Here is an interesting tidbit-- had not Patrick Leeland, one of my predecessors, campaigned for Amendment I of the US Constitution, it likely never would have existed. I don't remember offhand if the Danbury association were some of us, but I think they were. I have a number of rare histories if you desire them, but am impressed a Oneness proponent knows who we are!

Kindly, can someone explain what the main Oneness groups are apart from the UPCI? It seems they get the preeminence, but they also seem to be compromising to please the dumbed-down evangelicals.
The modern Oneness pentecostal "movement" is composed of several organizations, the UPCI being one of the most visible. There are also numerous smaller fellowships and independent assemblies. The vast majority of people here on this forum in fact are not UPCI. There are groups such as the Pentecostal Assemblies of the World, the Church of Our Lord Jesus Christ, the Church of The Lord Jesus Christ, several Church of Jesus Christ fellowships, the World Pentecostal Fellowship, the Assemblies of the Lord Jesus Christ, the True Jesus Church, and various other international, Asian, African, European denominations (some of which are larger than the UPCI). Most of these groups tend to be ministerial organizations, meaning they are not so much associations of churches but associations of preachers and pastors.

There are also numerous other groups, including sabbatarian groups, Messianic groups, "Hebrew Roots" type groups, etc. The term Oneness Pentecostal is a very broad term, like "trinitararian charismatic" and just as there are wide ranging differences among trinitarian charismatics there are wide ranging differences among those who identify as oneness pentecostal. There are also non pentecostal Oneness groups out there.

The only thing unifying oneness Pentecostals doctrinally is a belief in the absolute deity of Jesus Christ, a belief in the availability of receiving the Spirit just as in the Bible, and a preference for baptism in the name of Jesus Christ instead of using the trinitarian formula. Beyond that, there is a wide variety of doctrine (just as there is among those claiming the Baptist label). There are in fact Oneness Pentecostal people and churches that do not even use the term Oneness Pentecostal. A lot of trinitarians, I have found, actually have a very Oneness view of God even though they use the term Trinity due to the traditions they have received.

The poster here named Steve Epley is one of the go to guys for history, he knows or knew everybody it seems and is a walking historical archive of American Pentecostal and Holiness church history. Steven Avery is another poster here with a broad knowledge of various currents in the oneness pentecostal scene. He's also a staunch defender of the Authorized Version and has done numerous articles in defense of the Word of God.

Me personally, I'm just a Christian doing my best to follow Jesus according to His Word, so labels don't mean too much to me. I believe all disciples must be APOSTOLIC, meaning we must follow the faith and practice of the apostles, otherwise we descend into heresy.
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