The creation Mandate

[votivesoul]

Regarding the "Creation Mandate" that started this thread, it is important to keep something in mind:

Demographics, specifically population replacement.

If you take a look at Japan, for instance, they are coming up way short in the population replacement department. So much so, that many fear for the future of Japan, or, at least, for an all "Japanese" Japan.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...-births-deaths

Christians should be very concerned with replacing the population of believers year in, year out, every generation. Especially with the continual prospect of a declining religiosity and a growing secularization leading to atheism and neo-paganism.

Muslims, for example, are going to eclipse Christians in total population in Europe, not by proselytization, but by procreation, and perhaps not just in Europe:

https://www.pewresearch.org/religion...ous-landscape/

[Amanah]

Originally Posted by votivesoul

Agreed.

But we also have to realize our new identity in Christ.

No one would go around saying, if he or she had any sense, "I'm a lying, thieving, drug-addicted, hard-drinking, blaspheming Christian", and expect to be taken seriously by any believer anywhere.

How then, does one say, "I'm a homosexual Christian", and expect anyone to take them seriously? The terms by definition are mutually exclusive.

One can say, "I'm a Christian, and I experience same sex attraction and temptation to lust", just as one can say, "I'm a Christian, and I experience opposite sex attraction and temptation to lust".

And those are not the same as the above.

I agree

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by votivesoul

Regarding the "Creation Mandate" that started this thread, it is important to keep something in mind:

Demographics, specifically population replacement.

If you take a look at Japan, for instance, they are coming up way short in the population replacement department. So much so, that many fear for the future of Japan, or, at least, for an all "Japanese" Japan.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...-births-deaths

Christians should be very concerned with replacing the population of believers year in, year out, every generation. Especially with the continual prospect of a declining religiosity and a growing secularization leading to atheism and neo-paganism.

Muslims, for example, are going to eclipse Christians in total population in Europe, not by proselytization, but by procreation, and perhaps not just in Europe:

https://www.pewresearch.org/religion...ous-landscape/

The thing is, conservative Christian homeschooling "quiverfull" types tend to have 5+ kids. So the godless aren't procreating nor are mainstream Christians, but one group is. In 50 years it will be conservative Muslim vs conservative Christian as the two main demographics in Western society.

Meanwhile Roman Catholics are still the largest single group on earth and non catholic Christianity is exploding in the 3rd world. The era of godless humanism has just about run its course.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by votivesoul

Agreed.

But we also have to realize our new identity in Christ.

No one would go around saying, if he or she had any sense, "I'm a lying, thieving, drug-addicted, hard-drinking, blaspheming Christian", and expect to be taken seriously by any believer anywhere.

How then, does one say, "I'm a homosexual Christian", and expect anyone to take them seriously? The terms by definition are mutually exclusive.

One can say, "I'm a Christian, and I experience same sex attraction and temptation to lust", just as one can say, "I'm a Christian, and I experience opposite sex attraction and temptation to lust".

And those are not the same as the above.

Interesting how the Bible doesn't recognize "homosexuality" per se as an identity, but instead speaks of inordinate affections and unnatural and unlawful behaviours.

Almost like the modern discussion has been intentionally framed from a secular non Biblical point of view. Control definitions and terms, and you control discussion and ideas. Same thing with "alcoholic", "addict", and pretty much everything else in the psychiatric DSM.

[diakonos]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Interesting how the Bible doesn't recognize "homosexuality" per se as an identity, but instead speaks of inordinate affections and unnatural and unlawful behaviours.

Almost like the modern discussion has been intentionally framed from a secular non Biblical point of view. Control definitions and terms, and you control discussion and ideas. Same thing with "alcoholic", "addict", and pretty much everything else in the psychiatric DSM.

Good point

[votivesoul]

Originally Posted by Esaias

The thing is, conservative Christian homeschooling "quiverfull" types tend to have 5+ kids. So the godless aren't procreating nor are mainstream Christians, but one group is. In 50 years it will be conservative Muslim vs conservative Christian as the two main demographics in Western society.

Meanwhile Roman Catholics are still the largest single group on earth and non catholic Christianity is exploding in the 3rd world. The era of godless humanism has just about run its course.

However, I think it prudent to state that the "conservative Christian homeschooling "quiverfull" types" are in the minority of Christian subsets. Generally speaking, I think it's most likely Muslims will easily outpace them going forward.

[votivesoul]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Interesting how the Bible doesn't recognize "homosexuality" per se as an identity, but instead speaks of inordinate affections and unnatural and unlawful behaviours.

Almost like the modern discussion has been intentionally framed from a secular non Biblical point of view. Control definitions and terms, and you control discussion and ideas. Same thing with "alcoholic", "addict", and pretty much everything else in the psychiatric DSM.

Paul mentions sodomites and catamites in 1 Corinthians 6:9.

1 Corinthians 6:9 (ESV),

9 Or do you not know that the unrighteous[a] will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality,[b]

a. Or wrongdoers
b.The two Greek terms translated by this phrase refer to the passive and active partners in consensual homosexual acts

"men who practice homosexuality" translates the following two terms:

1.) μαλακοὶ - malakoi
2.) ἀρσενοκοῖται - arsenokoitai

See: https://biblehub.com/interlinear/1_corinthians/6-9.htm

The first refers to the following:

Someone who is soft, i.e. someone who is delicate and effeminate, specifically speaking of a catamite, or the receiving partner in sodomite acts.

See: https://biblehub.com/greek/3120.htm

The second refers to man who lies in bed with another man, i.e. a homosexual sodomite.

See: https://biblehub.com/greek/733.htm