**** Are the NCO and AWCF "raiding" the UPCI or providing a "safety net"? ****

[SDG]

Prior to the UPCI debating resolution 6 on the floor of General Conference, in Columbus, Ohio, in the fall of 2006 .... Kenneth Philips, Jonathon Suber and Wendell Hutchins began a partnership that resulted in the formation of a loose ministerial fellowship called the New Church Order. The NCO website was launched and called for an new era of post-denominationalism and end to exclusionary fellowship & organizational politics. The NCO also has be been advocating technology as an important tool to evangelizing the entire world.

By the winter’s end, they claimed close to 1000 members and had launched an internet-based television and webcasting venture called Acts 29 TV. The NCO has also effectively used email and blogs to communicate their agenda and group interactions.

Ministers nation-wide, from various organizations, and independents, have joined the NCO, including many UPCI ministers.
Some UPCI ministers who have not been shy about their cooperation w/ the NCO are Randy Hollis, Kentucky … Joe Hunt, CA … Anthony Langston, New Jersey … and Glenn Purvis, Georgia.

There are unconfirmed rumors that the NCO is aggressively recruiting present and former UPCI ministers behind the scenes. While some supporters of the NCO see the fellowship is providing a voice and viable option.

Meanwhile, the leaders of NCO have also joined an existing, more established, ministerial fellowship called the AWCF, a fellowship claiming a constituency of more than 180 organizations, 20,000 minister and 5 million believers world-wide.

In the fall of 2006, the AWCF and their presiding Bishop S. Smith welcomed Bishop Phillips, Suber, Hutchin and Tekelemarian with much fan-fare. These new members admission was splattered on the homepage of AWCF’s website, www.awcf.org.

One of the NCO leaders told this poster that the reason for his decision to join the AWCF was because he felt that ministerial accountability is vital.

Since then, there has been increased cooperation between Bishop Smith’s AWCF and the triumvirate leading the NCO. Smith has spoken at NCO events and the NCO leaders began speaking on the AWCF circuit. The AWCF’s bishop also partially funded Suber’s recent missions trip to Africa.

In May of this year, Suber, Huthins and Philips were featured keynote speakers at the AWCF’s 2007 World Congress. The 36th Annual World Congress was held May 2nd, 3rd & 4th, 2007 at the Centre in Evansville, Indiana USA .

Bishop Phillips stirring message to the AWCF Congress on Thursday, May 3rd, has apparently made him the new darling of the AWCF.

I encourage you to listen to the last ten minutes of his message here.
http://www.awcf.org/media-archives.html

During the last 10 minutes of Phillips message to the AWCF members he passionately and convincingly made arguments about how technology mediums are a God-ordained gift to this generation, as they were to the 1st century church, to spread the Gospel of Jesus Christ to the world.

He also said that in prayer God had revealed to him that he should join the AWCF. Phillips also stated that he had been waiting for over 30 years for a fellowship like the AWCF that was willing to embrace technology and is evangelism-focused.

He also publicly announced his submission to the authority of the AWCF’s presiding bishop and its other bishops. He asked them to instruct him as to what they wanted him to do.

[I will transcribe some of his remarks from Phillip's message later.]

Hutchins and Suber followed on Thursday. Suber, interestingly entitled his revival-style message “Welcome to the Revolution’, a popular mantra within the NCO. You can access both of their messages to the AWCF Congress here -
http://www.awcf.org/media-archives.html

Enter the summer of 2007.
[ *** we are only weeks away from the UPCI’s General Conference in which the “technology issue” is on everyone’s mind]

Recently, both the NCO and AWCF have published an article on their websites written by a UPCI minister called Randy Hollis entitled “The Emancipation of Issaac”.

You can read the article here. There is a thread discussing it's contents here.

The Hollis article is critical of what he describes as a “falling away” within the Apostolic movement which he attributes to the legalism of ultraconservative ministers. Hollis, on his website, randyhollis.com, has brought attention to the TV debate and his reservations about the present direction of his organization. He asserts that his fellowship's present decision making process is "rules-based' and not "principle-based".

Here are the questions I have:

1. Have the NCO and AWCF been opportunistic in taking advantage of the internal struggles within the UPCI. Are they “raiding” the org or are they providing a “safety net” for disgruntled moderate to liberal ministers within the org?

2. Why are these organizations posting such an article on their websites? Are they using the current state of discontent within the UPC to their favor? Isn't this a very aggressive move on their part?

3. Does anyone have information to corroborate the unconfirmed rumors that the NCO and or the AWCF are being aggressive in recruiting or in offering a safety net?

4. What if Bishop Phillips became the presiding Bishop of not only the NCO but the AWCF? What effects would this have on the Apostolic Oneness movement as a whole?

Haha...

Dan, you just WONT do.

[Nahum]

Wow!

I am still digesting this.

Daniel, are you suggesting the next AWCF leader may be Kenneth Phillips?

[SDG]

Originally Posted by Pastor Poster

Wow!

I am still digesting this.

Daniel, are you suggesting the next AWCF leader may be Kenneth Phillips?

I think it's a plausible theory considering the internal present going-ons and he is a man of God that garners a lot of respect.

I encourage folks to listen to the last 10 minutes of his message to the AWCF Congress.

[NLYP]

Originally Posted by Pastor Poster

Wow!

I am still digesting this.

Daniel, are you suggesting the next AWCF leader may be Kenneth Phillips?

Looks that way.....
quite possible.

[Praxeas]

Sounds like they have put together a good business model and are aggressively seeking new customers...good for them! Now hopefully they can go out and win some souls to the Lord too instead of trying to steal preachers away from other orgs

[CC1]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Sounds like they have put together a good business model and are aggressively seeking new customers...good for them! Now hopefully they can go out and win some souls to the Lord too instead of trying to steal preachers away from other orgs

KP is not big on organizations. If you knew him you would know your statement is hogwash. The end result of their efforts may be some men leaving their org. but that is not the goal.

Your statement is very insulting. You are accusing at least one good man (I don't personally know the other two) of stealing.

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by CC1

KP is not big on organizations. If you knew him you would know your statement is hogwash. The end result of their efforts may be some men leaving their org. but that is not the goal.

Your statement is very insulting. You are accusing at least one good man (I don't personally know the other two) of stealing.

You own a Honda, that would be "Rice Wash".

In JESUS NAME

Brother Benincasa

www.OnTimeJournal.com

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by CC1

KP is not big on organizations. If you knew him you would know your statement is hogwash. The end result of their efforts may be some men leaving their org. but that is not the goal.

Your statement is very insulting. You are accusing at least one good man (I don't personally know the other two) of stealing.

Im just going by the initial post that speaks of absorbing other members from other churches. I never mentioned KP specifically

[Amos]

These words from Ricky Saulters...

My heartbeat is to reach out and find another minister in the same stratus of confusion that I was in, and help them understand how the pieces do fit when joined in the process by spiritual Fathers, brothers and sons for the purpose and propagation of the Kingdom!

That sounds to me like he wants to do a little recruiting.