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03-25-2011, 01:36 PM
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Freedom@apostolicidentity .com
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Join Date: Dec 2009
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Re: Bishop Wright's Shame Seminar Rides Into TX
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chateau d'If
There are two perfectly normal responses which emanate from a person who realizes they have displeased God; guilt, and shame.
So I am not sure shame is necessarily bad.
I do find it odd that an Apostolic preacher would destroy a control tool that produces such wonderful results. Shame has been used to silence critics, marginalize defectors and deter inquisitive-minded individuals from asking the tough questions.
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I think if we are paralyzed and wallow in it ... it most definitely can affect our behaviors and choices .. yet even here the focus is self .... from the Pharisee to the suicide victim ... to all of us in between ... an unhealthy focus on self will have negative consequences and even lead a victim to engage in sin against God... that said, it's part of a cycle ... the root is sin.
It has been used in this movement in many ways to ensure conformity.
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03-25-2011, 01:33 PM
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Forever Loved Admin
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Texas
Posts: 26,537
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Re: Bishop Wright's Shame Seminar Rides Into TX
shame: a negative emotion that combines feelings of dishonor, unworthiness, and embarrassment.
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If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.
2 Chronicles 7:14 KJV
He hath shewed thee, O man, what is good; and what doth the LORD require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God? Micah 6:8 KJV
Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. 1 John 3:2 KJV
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03-25-2011, 01:35 PM
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Forever Loved Admin
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Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Texas
Posts: 26,537
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Re: Bishop Wright's Shame Seminar Rides Into TX
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cindy
shame: a negative emotion that combines feelings of dishonor, unworthiness, and embarrassment.
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guilt: an awareness of having done wrong or committed a crime, accompanied by feelings of shame and regret.
__________________
If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.
2 Chronicles 7:14 KJV
He hath shewed thee, O man, what is good; and what doth the LORD require of thee, but to do justly, and to love mercy, and to walk humbly with thy God? Micah 6:8 KJV
Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. 1 John 3:2 KJV
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03-25-2011, 01:36 PM
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Follower of Jesus
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: California
Posts: 3,275
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Re: Bishop Wright's Shame Seminar Rides Into TX
I like Chester Wright, I do agree that Shame is an issue, but the cure is a understanding of our identity in Christ.
The UPCI has historically struggled with the whole finished work of Calvary Concept and having an identity and lifestyle rooted in that work.
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Please pray for India
My personal mission is to BRING people into a right relationship with God, GROW them up to maturity and SEND them back into the world to minister.
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03-26-2011, 09:18 AM
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Not riding the train
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Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 48,544
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Re: Bishop Wright's Shame Seminar Rides Into TX
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pastor Keith
I like Chester Wright, I do agree that Shame is an issue, but the cure is a understanding of our identity in Christ.
The UPCI has historically struggled with the whole finished work of Calvary Concept and having an identity and lifestyle rooted in that work.
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Could you elaborate on this thought?
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03-27-2011, 11:25 PM
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Administrator
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 16,848
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Re: Bishop Wright's Shame Seminar Rides Into TX
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pastor Keith
I like Chester Wright, I do agree that Shame is an issue, but the cure is a understanding of our identity in Christ.
The UPCI has historically struggled with the whole finished work of Calvary Concept and having an identity and lifestyle rooted in that work.
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The finished work of Calvary is minimized because of the emphasis on human "works".
__________________
"I think some people love spiritual bondage just the way some people love physical bondage. It makes them feel secure. In the end though it is not healthy for the one who is lost over it or the one who is lives under the oppression even if by their own choice"
Titus2woman on AFF
"We did not wear uniforms. The lady workers dressed in the current fashions of the day, ...silks...satins...jewels or whatever they happened to possess. They were very smartly turned out, so that they made an impressive appearance on the streets where a large part of our work was conducted in the early years.
"It was not until long after, when former Holiness preachers had become part of us, that strict plainness of dress began to be taught.
"Although Entire Sanctification was preached at the beginning of the Movement, it was from a Wesleyan viewpoint, and had in it very little of the later Holiness Movement characteristics. Nothing was ever said about apparel, for everyone was so taken up with the Lord that mode of dress seemingly never occurred to any of us."
Quote from Ethel Goss (widow of 1st UPC Gen Supt. Howard Goss) book "The Winds of God"
Last edited by CC1; 03-27-2011 at 11:27 PM.
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03-25-2011, 01:55 PM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Maryland
Posts: 449
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Re: Bishop Wright's Shame Seminar Rides Into TX
I am on clip 5, and for the most part I like it. I know Bishop Wright very well, and have known him for about 15+ years. This man loves souls.
The only part so far that made me scratch my head was the part about God not loving us, because we won't accept His love. That one got me a little, although I do understand why he said it and were he was going with it.
He is one of my favorite teachers, I'm not saying he is infallible, but he is very good, in my opinion.
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03-25-2011, 02:06 PM
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Banned
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Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 4,280
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Re: Bishop Wright's Shame Seminar Rides Into TX
Self-focused or cross-focused?
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03-25-2011, 03:05 PM
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Freedom@apostolicidentity .com
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Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 4,597
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Re: Bishop Wright's Shame Seminar Rides Into TX
Quote:
Originally Posted by Socialite
Self-focused or cross-focused?
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__________________
VISIT US @ WWW.THE316.COM
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03-25-2011, 05:58 PM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,085
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Re: Bishop Wright's Shame Seminar Rides Into TX
Quote:
Originally Posted by Socialite
Self-focused or cross-focused?
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The entire subject can be succinctly summed up in your statement. Sin is who we are, the cross provides forgiveness. There is no teaching in UPC on the finished work of the cross and the redemptive value it affords. God deals with us through forgiveness and expects us to do the same with ourselves and others.
Because forgiveness is not taught and grace is greasy...shame, guilt, etc will continue to plaque the religious and in some ways that spirit enjoys keeping the congregants in bondage to the leader...
Here in lies the answer to the sin issue..."love your neighbor as yourself."
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