Apostolic Minister/State Rep. voted for AZ bill - Page 6

MissBrattified · #1 05-12-2010, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

Daniel,
No one is going to turn in a good illegal. It's the dishonest ones committing crimes that are the cause for this uproar and rightly so!

My father employed illegals the whole time I was growing up. He fed them, clothed them, paid them, gave them beer (lol), etc. He even allowed them to stay at one of our ranches in Pearsall, TX, when they came through Eagle Pass. They were hard workers.

If the churches are taking them in, they need to act like Harriet Beecher Stowe and her family during the post-Civil War era. Harriett and her family started schools in the south to educate them so that they could assimilate into society and have a better quality of life.

Good post--and it seems like the actual application of this bill is being obfuscated so that the pastor can be crucified (needlessly). It has to do with checking the status of someone who has already committed a crime of some sort. Technically, this happens to average Americans all the time--when you're stopped for speeding, what does the officer do? He checks your plates to make sure your car isn't stolen, and checks the validity of your Driver's License! AND they check for warrants. Guess what? If you have an outstanding warrant, YOU GO TO JAIL! This is NO different!

Is it possible that the pastor is trying to stem the flow of illegal behavior in his congregation? Perhaps he thinks it could affect their salvation to consistently disregard the laws of the land?

I'm just saying. And frankly, I'm surprised at the vitriol pointed in this man's direction; I suppose I shouldn't be.

Again--he did not vote on a bill that says "round up all the illegals and send them home." He voted on a bill that says, "if a CRIMINAL is here illegally, send him back home."

Pressing-On · #2 05-12-2010, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

Good post--and it seems like the actual application of this bill is being obfuscated so that the pastor can be crucified (needlessly). It has to do with checking the status of someone who has already committed a crime of some sort. Technically, this happens to average Americans all the time--when you're stopped for speeding, what does the officer do? He checks your plates to make sure your car isn't stolen, and checks the validity of your Driver's License! AND they check for warrants. Guess what? If you have an outstanding warrant, YOU GO TO JAIL! This is NO different!

Is it possible that the pastor is trying to stem the flow of illegal behavior in his congregation? Perhaps he thinks it could affect their salvation to consistently disregard the laws of the land?

I'm just saying. And frankly, I'm surprised at the vitriol pointed in this man's direction; I suppose I shouldn't be.

Again--he did not vote on a bill that says "round up all the illegals and send them home." He voted on a bill that says, "if a CRIMINAL is here illegally, send him back home."

Yes, that is what he did - voted for a bill because of the high crime. It has to be stopped. If these men and women are getting saved, the congregation needs to pray and seek funds to make a way for the illegals to get papers, etc. That is the honest thing for any Christian to do - obey the law.

If they leave an oppressed place out of desperation, I would help them get on their feet. I know the Word is true - He will never leave us or forsake us.

I don't know any illegal stories from any of the Spanish works around here, but I know one of our Spanish pastors and his family very well and he is honest as the day is long.

What we don't want is the illegals coming here and bringing their flag - leave it in Mexico! Lord, that infuriates me to no end!!!!

Jeffrey · #3 05-12-2010, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

Good post--and it seems like the actual application of this bill is being obfuscated so that the pastor can be crucified (needlessly). It has to do with checking the status of someone who has already committed a crime of some sort.

MB, not sure that's fully true. I'm no expert in law, I've read over the bill. There's some controversy by what "lawful contact" means. Then later in the bill, it's reasserted what happens to those who provide shelter for illegal aliens, etc... Much more broad than "ID please. No ID on you then you are being detained until we can clear this up, or if you are illegal you are getting kicked out."

It's a type of mass deportation. Not a fan.

MissBrattified · #4 05-12-2010, 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeffrey

MB, not sure that's fully true. I'm no expert in law, I've read over the bill. There's some controversy by what "lawful contact" means. Then later in the bill, it's reasserted what happens to those who provide shelter for illegal aliens, etc... Much more broad than "ID please. No ID on you then you are being detained until we can clear this up, or if you are illegal you are getting kicked out."

It's a type of mass deportation. Not a fan.

You're right--it is more broad than I thought. I don't have time to finish reading it right now--be back after class!

Jeffrey · #5 05-12-2010, 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pressing-On

Daniel,
No one is going to turn in a good illegal. It's the dishonest ones committing crimes that are the cause for this uproar and rightly so!

My father employed illegals the whole time I was growing up. He fed them, clothed them, paid them, gave them beer (lol), etc. He even allowed them to stay at one of our ranches in Pearsall, TX, when they came through Eagle Pass. They were hard workers.

If the churches are taking them in, they need to act like Harriet Beecher Stowe and her family during the post-Civil War era. Harriett and her family started schools in the south to educate them so that they could assimilate into society and have a better quality of life.

They have a responsibility to the law to turn in ALL illegals. It's the Christian thing to do. Obedient to the law. And if not, by law, one could be implicated.

PO, I actually like what you're saying here. Can you believe it?

Pressing-On · #6 05-12-2010, 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeffrey

They have a responsibility to the law to turn in ALL illegals. It's the Christian thing to do. Obedient to the law. And if not, by law, one could be implicated.

Probably so, but a good helpless person wanting better? I couldn't turn them in.

Quote:

PO, I actually like what you're saying here. Can you believe it?

Yes, totally shocked. LOL!

MissBrattified · #7 05-12-2010, 05:05 PM

What on EARTH does this man's vote have to do with tithes and offering in the church??????

Let's review:

1. He pastors a church that no doubt contains illegal immigrants, at least according to comments on this thread.

2. He's involved in politics, and voted on a bill that allows law enforcement officers to check to immigration status of people who have committed crimes.

3. This somehow makes him hypocritical, and in order to be consistent, he needs to boot all the illegals out of his church and return any tithes or offering they've paid in?

I would say that consistency would only require him to boot out illegals who are involved in criminal activity other than their simple illegal status, and return any money THEY have given him. Otherwise, I can't even connect the dots.

Pressing-On · #8 05-12-2010, 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

What on EARTH does this man's vote have to do with tithes and offering in the church??????

Let's review:

1. He pastors a church that no doubt contains illegal immigrants, at least according to comments on this thread.

2. He's involved in politics, and voted on a bill that allows law enforcement officers to check to immigration status of people who have committed crimes.

3. This somehow makes him hypocritical, and in order to be consistent, he needs to boot all the illegals out of his church and return any tithes or offering they've paid in?

I would say that consistency would only require him to boot out illegals who are involved in criminal activity other than their simple illegal status, and return any money THEY have given him. Otherwise, I can't even connect the dots.

If he believes that tithes and offerings are what the Bible teaches - then every person that is a member of the church is going to follow that teaching - whether illegal or not. "There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus." (Galatians 3:28)

DAII · #9 05-12-2010, 05:18 PM

But by definition being illegal is criminal activity.

It becomes circular

Quote:

Originally Posted by MissBrattified

What on EARTH does this man's vote have to do with tithes and offering in the church??????

Let's review:

1. He pastors a church that no doubt contains illegal immigrants, at least according to comments on this thread.

2. He's involved in politics, and voted on a bill that allows law enforcement officers to check to immigration status of people who have committed crimes.

3. This somehow makes him hypocritical, and in order to be consistent, he needs to boot all the illegals out of his church and return any tithes or offering they've paid in?

I would say that consistency would only require him to boot out illegals who are involved in criminal activity other than their simple illegal status, and return any money THEY have given him. Otherwise, I can't even connect the dots.

DAII · #10 05-12-2010, 05:26 PM

Hermana Rodriguez (the illegal criminal), can you swing by the church after you finish with your second job and make some tamales to sell this Sunday. We want to make sure Pastor is able to take that cruise this summer. He works so hard.

Yes, you can bring the kids but make sure they stay glued to their seats so they don't destroy anything.