No Jesus Name Invoked, No Valid Baptism? - Page 5

Originalist · #41 03-31-2018, 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aquila

Guys, just be baptized, and baptize, in Jesus name.

I don't get the problem.

I think it is healthy for Apostolics to revisit this issue to examine if we've really been faithful ro biblical intention.

Evang.Benincasa · #42 03-31-2018, 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Originalist

Amazing that you cannot see how you come across on this forum. Incredibly amazing.

Am I doing that with you? I can count on one hand those who I bump heads with. is that what is happening with you?

consapente89 · #43 03-31-2018, 07:13 PM

Ok wait. Originalist confirms Tyrones erroneous beliefs that he doesn't actually need to be baptized in Jesus name. Proceeding then to encourage him to go ahead and get baptized so that he can at least appease the Apostolics and those he may baptize in the future. Sounds like something a poser would say.

Tyrone, you need to get baptized in Jesus name so that your sins can be remitted. I encourage you NOT to get baptized until you understand and believe that.

Steve Epley · #44 03-31-2018, 07:17 PM

Only baptism in Jesus Name are sins remitted since Pentecost.

consapente89 · #45 03-31-2018, 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve Epley

Only baptism in Jesus Name are sins remitted since Pentecost.

Amen

RachelRose · #46 03-31-2018, 07:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aquila

The Trinity is a pagan notion adopted by really Hellenized scholars.

I think so.

I am presently reading a book that talks about this at length. One of the places I normally take people I witness to is Acts 19. You may want to consider being re-baptized. Paul thought it was important enough to get those follows re-baptized.

think about it.

TyronePalmer · #47 03-31-2018, 07:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

Here we go again! Round and round the mulberry bush the monkey chased the weasel?

Bro, everyone can prove that Jesus was called over the neophyte. It is New Testament understanding that a baptizer is required to fulfill all righteousness. That the same as we casting out devils with the name of Jesus invoked and healings performed with the name of Jesus invoked, the same goes for baptism.

Tyrone please you need to be baptized in Jesus name, re-baptized with the name of Jesus spoken over you. If you refuse it will only be due to your stubborn and prideful heart. You knew you were on a forum where everyone baptizes in Jesus name with the name of Jesus Christ being invoked over the baptized.

If you say you are now in shock and awe over this than you are a dishonest liar. Therefore you will be unable to be dealt with by any means. Jesus' name was invoked over the baptized. You had to believe with all your mind that Jesus is the Christ, and then be baptized by a minister who would then invoke the name of Jesus over you.

Wow all this from a man who calls himself an Evangelist. I wonder if Philip spoke to his brother's in Christ like that?

Where is the Love? Jesus did say the love of many would grow cold didn't He?

Jesus is my judge sir and if He thought I needed to be re-baptized in water just to have the name Jesus explicitly said and invoked over me, He would have told me and compelled me to do so when He baptized me with the Holy Spirit, which was eleven years ago, I haven't heard a word from Him about it, however He has spoken to me many other times in the last decade.

So what happens if a minister forgets to invoke the name of Jesus over a believer? Then he/she needs to be re-baptized until the minister get's it right?

For the record I do know the truth now and I have baptized a few souls invoking the name of Jesus over the believer, but I truly believe like with the Ethiopian Eunuch, it matters more what the convert believes and their confession of Jesus Christ than the baptizer invoking the name of Jesus over them.

So if I'm not re-baptized having the name of Jesus invoked over me, will I lose my salvation? Will God reject me and send my soul to Hell when I die?

Evang.Benincasa · #48 03-31-2018, 07:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Originalist

Here we go again. You shame yourself. I've never disputed that the name Jesus was used somehow by the one baptizing.

Now, you are caught in pyschological projection. Because you are you state that Jesus never gave such command to either formula. Therefore you are hard to logically follow. Teachers are supposed to make things clear, the tongues of angels. Which means to take spiritual truths and make them plain, tongues of men. If you can't do one you can't do the other. You end up confusing the student. The Bible therefore becomes a book of a cryptic mystery religion. Where we all would have to have YOU as our pastor. Let , me go further, to understand clearly what I am saying is that a child shouldn't be able to be in error and that as a teacher you would make things plain. If you cannot prove to us your case simply, then we must look for another. If you have something which can only be explained by YOU, then you instead of the scriptures are our guide. You run from stem to stern, and one minute you actually state that it doesn't matter to what is said over us, and then you say you do believe that something is said over us. Bro, it must also be a consistent teaching in order for it to be bulletproof. If you are going to replace something with something supposedly to be truth, then it has to be better than what we already know. It must also be able to withstand scrutiny no matter how stupid YOU may think we are.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Originalist

A baptizer's invocation does not impart righteousness. Really, Jesus' baptism, John's baptism are apples and oranges comparisons to NT baptisms.

Ok, do you see what you are doing here? You aren't saying anything. What you are doing is not teaching, not even refuting. You are in short just saying I'm wrong, without clarifying explanation. How is it apples and oranges? How does it compare to New Testament baptism? How does it not? Bro, you aren't helping me to understand you in the least. Jesus' words to John is that John NEEDED to baptize Jesus to complete all righteousness. Period. Those are Jesus' statements on the matter, because Jesus would be the firstborn of many brethren and therefore He set out and took His men to also baptize. Did I say anything about imparting righteous? Does the scripture verse mention an impartation of righteousness? No, the only thing mentioned is a fulfillment of righteousness. Righteousness is completed with the baptizer baptizing the Christ.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Originalist

Yes, the demon had to understand by whose authority he was being commanded to leave. But he feared the authority (the one who gave it), not the word "J-E-S-U-S". The name Jesus did not function as pepper spray or insect repellent against demons.

Bro, that isn't what we see in the scripture, because in Mark 9:38 the disciples forbid a man from casting out devils who was using the name of Jesus. The man wasn't in Jesus' authority, because obviously Jesus didn't know the man. In the judgement Jesus solidifies this fact by telling the man and others that He NEVER knew them Matthew 7:22-23. Just like the devils didn't KNOW the sons of Sceva who are Biblically documented as using the name of Jesus accompanied by the name of the Apostle Paul Acts 19:13.

Now yes or no, in Acts 19:13 do the audibly say the words "we adjure you in THE NAME OF JESUS, whom Paul preaches?" Yes, or NO?

Evang.Benincasa · #49 03-31-2018, 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Originalist

The authority to heal miraculously was given to the 12 in the upper room at Pentecost. I believe it as literally at their disposal in a way not commonly distributed to any saint. When they healed, they used that authority. Saying the name of the one who gave them the authority was incidental and to bring him glory, just as it is in baptism.

Let me ask you a question, have you ever cast out a devil, or prayed over anyone saying the name of Jesus and witnessed a healing?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Originalist

Tyrone, I encourage you to be rebaptized NOT because you remain unforgiven (you re forgiven), or because God rejected your first baptism (he didn't). Do it so you can say you have experienced what you may be administering to others.

Does that actually make sense to you? Because logically it makes no sense to me.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Originalist

That part is incidental to the forgiveness of sins. The Amplified Bible is the only version to mention baptism in his verse. Don't hang your hat on that one. [/COLOR]

The only reason why the Amplified writes it out that way is one) because it is amplifying the verse, and two) because that IS WHAT IT ACTUALLY SAYS IN THE GREEK!!!

Show me any Greek text which doesn't say that name which was called upon you. I'll wait while you look. Also, have you happened to come across that verse you spoke of that said God calls the name upon us? I'll wait for that also.

Evang.Benincasa · #50 03-31-2018, 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TyronePalmer

Wow all this from a man who calls himself an Evangelist. I wonder if Philip spoke to his brother's in Christ like that?

Where is the Love? Jesus did say the love of many would grow cold didn't He?

Jesus is my judge sir and if He thought I needed to be re-baptized in water just to have the name Jesus explicitly said and invoked over me, He would have told me and compelled me to do so when He baptized me with the Holy Spirit, which was eleven years ago, I haven't heard a word from Him about it, however He has spoken to me many other times in the last decade.

So what happens if a minister forgets to invoke the name of Jesus over a believer? Then he/she needs to be re-baptized until the minister get's it right?

For the record I do know the truth now and I have baptized a few souls invoking the name of Jesus over the believer, but I truly believe like with the Ethiopian Eunuch, it matters more what the convert believes and their confession of Jesus Christ than the baptizer invoking the name of Jesus over them.

So if I'm not re-baptized having the name of Jesus invoked over me, will I lose my salvation? Will God reject me and send my soul to Hell when I die?

Your not a child, I believe I'm speaking to an adult. Jesus is the judge? Then I suggest you listen to the judge and get baptized in His name. This isn't an argument, this is simple. What if the baptizer didn't say the name? You see, you aren't even serious about this, so why are you here? Are you looking to convert some of us to what you believe?