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03-07-2007, 10:38 PM
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His word burns in my heart like a fire...Fire Fall Down
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,853
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stmatthew
Just my opinion.
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Fair enough, my brother!
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03-07-2007, 10:37 PM
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Step By Step - Day By Day
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 6,648
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J-Roc
What does this prove? That you are accepted by God and that until then you are in salvation limbo? 
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You're in the birth canal I think.
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Smiles & Blessings....
~Felicity Welsh~
(surname courtesy of Jim Yohe)
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03-07-2007, 10:53 PM
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His word burns in my heart like a fire...Fire Fall Down
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,853
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Anyway, I just wish these matters could always be discussed in a civil manner as we three have tonight...and spread love to one another...I love you Matt!!!
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03-07-2007, 10:56 PM
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Smiles everyone...Smiles!!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Sparta, TN
Posts: 2,399
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Quote:
Originally Posted by J-Roc
Anyway, I just wish these matters could always be discussed in a civil manner as we three have tonight...and spread love to one another...I love you Matt!!!
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Hey I love you all too. I even love Daniel, even if he does get me stirred up at times.
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03-07-2007, 10:54 PM
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Step By Step - Day By Day
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 6,648
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God certainly works in people's lives before they receive the baptism of the Spirit. They're spiritually reborn, set free from all kinds of addiction, forgiven, cleansed, sometimes healed both physically and emotionally.
Lots of good things happens to a person before he ever speaks in tongues that demonstrates God has already done a work in their life by His Spirit.
How can the natural man and mind receive the things of the Spirit? It's impossible according to the Scripture.
How can the natural unregenerate man's heart be turned toward God, His Word, desiring to do God's will and receive all that God has for him if he's still in a carnal regenerate state? It's impossible. It doesn't even make sense.
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Smiles & Blessings....
~Felicity Welsh~
(surname courtesy of Jim Yohe)
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03-07-2007, 11:20 PM
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Step By Step - Day By Day
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 6,648
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Anyhow...... I'm taking a popcorn break  and a break from this.
God bless you Matt. You are appreciated.
__________________
Smiles & Blessings....
~Felicity Welsh~
(surname courtesy of Jim Yohe)
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03-07-2007, 11:25 PM
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Smiles everyone...Smiles!!
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Sparta, TN
Posts: 2,399
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Felicity
Anyhow...... I'm taking a popcorn break  and a break from this.
God bless you Matt. You are appreciated.
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Bless you too Sis. It is about my bedtime here. It is 12:25am
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03-08-2007, 02:12 AM
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Banned
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Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Tx.
Posts: 2,222
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Quote:
Originally Posted by samp
Are there any Pentecostals who do not believe that speaking in tongues is the inititial physical evidence of the baptism in the Holy Spirit?
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[B][There are two kind of gifts of tongues as Paul wrote,)1Cor.13[1] Though I speak with the tongues of men and of angels, and have not charity, I am become as sounding brass, or a tinkling cymbal.(They spoke in tongues of men on the day of Pentecost when filled with the Holy Ghost,Tongues of angels is when you speak to God)
./B]On the day of Pentecost they were prophesying in tongues and it was being interpreted in 17 different tongues from the mouths of the speakers to the ears of the hearers because the writers said this.THIS IS THAT,this is that what you now hear.God said they would prophecy,not speak in tongues when filled with the Holy Ghost.Acts.2:16: But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel.17: And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams.
(Ways tongues is interpreted,)1 Cor.14: 6. Now, brethren, if I come unto you speaking with tongues, what shall I profit you, except I shall speak to you either by revelation, or by knowledge, or by prophesying, or by doctrine?
(On the day of Pentecost it was interpreted because all the hearers understood in their own language.So there was the gift of tongues and the interpretation of tongues and prophecy.Three gifts on the day of Pentecost.)Acts2:[8] And how hear we every man in our own tongue, wherein we were born?
This is what's going on in the church today,1 Cor.14:23: If therefore the whole church be come together into one place, and all speak with tongues, and there come in those that are unlearned, or unbelievers, will they not say that ye are mad?(crazy)
This is what should be taking place in the church,1 Cor.14:24: But if all prophesy, and there come in one that believeth not, or one unlearned, he is convinced of all, he is judged of all:25: And thus are the secrets of his heart made manifest; and so falling down on his face he will worship God, and report that God is in you of a truth
On the day of pentecost when they spoke in tongues it was understood. Today when people speaks in tongues 99% of the time it is not understood.
On the day of Pentecost tongues was understood.What did Paul say about tongues that were not understood?Paul wrote in Cor. 14: 1: Follow after charity, and desire spiritual gifts, but rather that ye may prophesy.
2: For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue (tongues of angels)speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.3: But he that prophesieth speaketh unto men to edification, and exhortation, and comfort
3: But he that prophesieth speaketh unto men to edification, and exhortation, and comfort.4: He that speaketh in an unknown tongue edifieth himself; but he that prophesieth edifieth the church.5: I would that ye all spake with tongues, but rather that ye prophesied: for greater is he that prophesieth than he that speaketh with tongues, except he interpret, that the church may receive edifying
18: I thank my God, I speak with tongues more than ye all:19: Yet in the church I had rather speak five words with my understanding, that by my voice I might teach others also, than ten thousand words in an unknown tongue.20: Brethren, be not children in understanding: howbeit in malice be ye children, but in understanding be men
Most will agree what Isa.wrote was talking about the pouring out of the Holy Ghost.Isa.28:11: For with stammering lips and another tongue will he speak to this people.12: To whom he said, This is the rest wherewith ye may cause the weary to rest; and this is the refreshing: yet they would not hear.
Then Paul writting about the gift of tongues referred to Isa.1 Cor. 14:21:In the law it is written, With men of other tongues and other lips will I speak unto this people; and yet for all that will they not hear me, saith the Lord.22: Wherefore tongues are for a sign, not to them that believe, but to them that believe not: but prophesying serveth not for them that believe not, but for them which believe.
Paul said here very clearly, with the lips of believers who speak other tongues God will speak to unbelievers and it is a sign to the unbeliever and after all of that they still will not hear God, says the Lord. This is what took place on the Day of Pentecost. Therefore the tongues they spoke in on the day of Pentecost was the gift of tongues
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03-08-2007, 04:51 AM
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Registered Member
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,169
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I have made this point before. The Bible does not say that tongues is the evidence, it says it is a sign. The evidence is the fruit of a Spirit filled life. This is why I have a problem with the idea that only when someone speaks with other tongues do they have the Spirit's presence. I see the fruit of the Spirit in their lives even though they never spoke with tongues.
Another thought to consider; Peter told the multitude on the Day of Pentecost that they needed to repent and be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remisssion of sins and "ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost"
So, if a person repents and is baptized in the name of Jesus Christ then according to Peter they shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. If speaking in tongues is the initial sign and having done what they were commanded to do, why is God withholding this gift from them? He's not doing what He promised to do. Why isn't the person coming up out of the water speaking in tongues?
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03-08-2007, 07:26 AM
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the ultracon
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Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: smack dab in da middle
Posts: 4,443
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Truly Blessed
I have made this point before. The Bible does not say that tongues is the evidence, it says it is a sign. The evidence is the fruit of a Spirit filled life. This is why I have a problem with the idea that only when someone speaks with other tongues do they have the Spirit's presence. I see the fruit of the Spirit in their lives even though they never spoke with tongues.
Another thought to consider; Peter told the multitude on the Day of Pentecost that they needed to repent and be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the remisssion of sins and "ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost"
So, if a person repents and is baptized in the name of Jesus Christ then according to Peter they shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. If speaking in tongues is the initial sign and having done what they were commanded to do, why is God withholding this gift from them? He's not doing what He promised to do. Why isn't the person coming up out of the water speaking in tongues?
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Eggzactly TB...only one reason..they are not good enough for God yet !!
Do we make God and Peter a liar when we recite the words of Acts 2:38 and when folks come up NOT speaking in tongues, even after we wiggle their chin and do all the stuff we do to wet people in a tank.
We tell them, hey you almost got the Holy Ghost.
That IS NOT what the word says in ACTS 2:38 It says YOU WILL recieve the
gift of the Holy Ghost.
It does not say YOU MIGHT or ALMOST WILL GET IT
Everyone we baptize that believes and has repented recieves the spirit of Christ, the Holy Ghost into their life. Sometimes they even are blessed with the gift of tongues.
I am glad for the ones God gives other manifestions to, as Paul said He would in 1 Cor. 12:8
I'm especially glad for those he manifests thru with the word of knowledge and word of wisdom. And prophecy is a blessed manifestion of God's spirit to see working in people.
verse 39 say's it's a promise. I am standing on tha promise.
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God has lavished his love upon me.
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