I was hoping that MOW might have given a little more clarity to his statement. Either way, I am aware of this type of behavior in preachers of all colors and cultures. As a matter of fact the Catholic Church, in which this sort of behavior may be most prevalent, an overwhelming majority (almost to the point of exclusivity) have been white. I don't associate the behavior with their color. I'm just making an observation that is relevant to this discussion.
Haggard and some of the other notable preachers who have been involved in sex scandals come to mind. This sort of thing has unfortunately been uncovered in the UPC. Without saying any names, to the best of my recollection none were black.
I'm not trying to start an argument. This is just my reaction to what I read.
I was hoping that MOW might have given a little more clarity to his statement. Either way, I am aware of this type of behavior in preachers of all colors and cultures. As a matter of fact the Catholic Church, in which this sort of behavior may be most prevalent, an overwhelming majority (almost to the point of exclusivity) have been white. I don't associate the behavior with their color. I'm just making an observation that is relevant to this discussion.
Haggard and some of the other notable preachers who have been involved in sex scandals come to mind. This sort of thing has unfortunately been uncovered in the UPC. Without saying any names, to the best of my recollection none were black.
I'm not trying to start an argument. This is just my reaction to what I read.
Yes, I'd like to hear his clarify his statement....if it needs clarification. If he's saying this is a more common issue among black people, I'll be raising the roof calling for his resignation from the forum or at least an apology and an acknowledgment of error, and I would hope others would join me. I'm saying that, not necessarily at him, but at how out-of-line that concept is. Surely he didn't mean what it appears he meant.
Yes, I'd like to hear his clarify his statement....if it needs clarification. If he's saying this is a more common issue among black people, I'll be raising the roof calling for his resignation from the forum or at least an apology and an acknowledgment of error, and I would hope others would join me. I'm saying that, not necessarily at him, but at how out-of-line that concept is. Surely he didn't mean what it appears he meant.
I hesitated to say anything in response to this thread because I have no doubt that MOW is a great guy and pastor. I don't see him as some malicious racist at all. The statement itself just didn't make much sense to me. I would hesitate about really attacking him personally. I just wanted a bit more clarity.
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No, originally you said you know of this going on in the lives of several BLACK preachers. Here, you just say, "preachers". There was a clear racial distinction, and the implication was, this happens in the lives of black preachers and seemed to imply that it's not as common in the lives of preachers of other races. Did I understand that incorrectly? If so, I'll cease and desist. But if that's what you meant......wow. I see Eddie Long, here, as a human being who is a pastor. His race seems completely irrelevant.
Well, you're wrong. Here is my EXACT quote: "I am personally aware of this type of behavior among some black preachers." Then I said this: "I am not painting with a broad brush, I am only speaking from what I have knowledge of. I know this is a minority who engage is this behavior, but it is NOT behavior that his church folks are clueless about. Maybe clueless regarding him, but not the life style itself."
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Smith
Yes, I'd like to hear his clarify his statement....if it needs clarification. If he's saying this is a more common issue among black people, I'll be raising the roof calling for his resignation from the forum or at least an apology and an acknowledgment of error, and I would hope others would join me. I'm saying that, not necessarily at him, but at how out-of-line that concept is. Surely he didn't mean what it appears he meant.
I don't need to clarify anything. I said what I said and couldn't have been more clear in what I meant. I spoke from knowledge, not rumor. I did not categorize anything to anyone.
You can raise the roof all you want, but you don't pay the bills. There will be no apology for what I said, no acknowledgment of error. Sorry to disappoint you!
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Well, you're wrong. Here is my EXACT quote: "I am personally aware of this type of behavior among some black preachers." Then I said this: "I am not painting with a broad brush, I am only speaking from what I have knowledge of. I know this is a minority who engage is this behavior, but it is NOT behavior that his church folks are clueless about. Maybe clueless regarding him, but not the life style itself."
I don't need to clarify anything. I said what I said and couldn't have been more clear in what I meant. I spoke from knowledge, not rumor. I did not categorize anything to anyone.
You can raise the roof all you want, but you don't pay the bills. There will be no apology for what I said, no acknowledgment of error. Sorry to disappoint you!
So are you saying this is a more significant problem among blacks than whites?
I was hoping that MOW might have given a little more clarity to his statement. Either way, I am aware of this type of behavior in preachers of all colors and cultures. As a matter of fact the Catholic Church, in which this sort of behavior may be most prevalent, an overwhelming majority (almost to the point of exclusivity) have been white. I don't associate the behavior with their color. I'm just making an observation that is relevant to this discussion.
Haggard and some of the other notable preachers who have been involved in sex scandals come to mind. This sort of thing has unfortunately been uncovered in the UPC. Without saying any names, to the best of my recollection none were black.
I'm not trying to start an argument. This is just my reaction to what I read.
(1) The Bishop didn't say he was completely innocent at all. He said that he was not the man that they're saying he is. He did not categorically deny that any of this happened. I hope I'm wrong (seriously) but this just seems like he is leaving way too much wiggle room. I am personally aware of this type of behavior among some black preachers. This on the "down-low" behavior has affected far more than we'll ever know. I am not painting with a broad brush, I am only speaking from what I have knowledge of. I know this is a minority who engage is this behavior, but it is NOT behavior that his church folks are clueless about. Maybe clueless regarding him, but not the life style itself.
I truly hope he is innocent, but from everything I've seen so far, I predict that it will come out that the allegations are true. At least he didn't do the Ted Haggard, "I don't know this man" shuffle.
I say give 'em all lie detector tests and see how they come out. If it was me and I was accused of anything like this, I would be willing to do that and make it public if the accusers would as well. I am really saddened by all of this.
(1) I picked up on that too. His word choice was very calculated and I was saddened when I read his words.
(2) I know what you are talking about, but I ususually never give any credence to those kinds of rumors. However, I have heard rumors like that about several preachers-- only one was white and the rest have been black.
I am not hoping for bad. I am hoping that the allegations are not true.
However, his statements make me think that... man I am really saddened about this.
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(1) I picked up on that too. His word choice was very calculated and I was saddened when I read his words.
(2) I know what you are talking about, but I ususually never give any credence to those kinds of rumors. However, I have heard rumors like that about several preachers-- only one was white and the rest have been black.
I am not hoping for bad. I am hoping that the allegations are not true.
However, his statements make me think that... man I am really saddened about this.
You should watch the entire 21 minute video of Long's remarks that Hoovie posted. I thought Long's remarks were brilliant. Also, read my post of the possibilities of what his "I've never claimed to be a perfect man" could have meant. It seems natural that all of us who are not in a position to play a role in Long's situation would ONLY be rooting for the best possible outcome and ONLY be believing for the best possible outcome. It's boggling to my mind how anyone could hope for anything BUT that.
For sure, there's a chance to put this in the category of "Where there's smoke, there's fire". But there's also the chance to believe and hope for the best. No one has to like Long's style to be rooting for him in this case. Heck, I can't STAND the TBN prosperity stuff, but Long is a POWERFUL preacher and I have to, at least, respect that.
And quite honestly, if we want to make a racial comparison, moral issues have stricken white ministries much more often than otherwise. The list is VERY long. Even there in Atlanta just recently, the Earl Paulk situation. Even Charles Stanley was recently divorced after having lived separately from his wife for many years.
This is NOT a racial problem. This is a human problem.
The Bishop didn't say he was completely innocent at all. He said that he was not the man that they're saying he is. He did not categorically deny that any of this happened. I hope I'm wrong (seriously) but this just seems like he is leaving way too much wiggle room. I am personally aware of this type of behavior among some black preachers. This on the "down-low" behavior has affected far more than we'll ever know. I am not painting with a broad brush, I am only speaking from what I have knowledge of. I know this is a minority who engage is this behavior, but it is NOT behavior that his church folks are clueless about. Maybe clueless regarding him, but not the life style itself.
I truly hope he is innocent, but from everything I've seen so far, I predict that it will come out that the allegations are true. At least he didn't do the Ted Haggard, "I don't know this man" shuffle.
I say give 'em all lie detector tests and see how they come out. If it was me and I was accused of anything like this, I would be willing to do that and make it public if the accusers would as well. I am really saddened by all of this.
Yes, I noticed that.
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The Bishop didn't say he was completely innocent at all. He said that he was not the man that they're saying he is. He did not categorically deny that any of this happened. I hope I'm wrong (seriously) but this just seems like he is leaving way too much wiggle room. I am personally aware of this type of behavior among some black preachers. This on the "down-low" behavior has affected far more than we'll ever know. I am not painting with a broad brush, I am only speaking from what I have knowledge of. I know this is a minority who engage is this behavior, but it is NOT behavior that his church folks are clueless about. Maybe clueless regarding him, but not the life style itself.
I truly hope he is innocent, but from everything I've seen so far, I predict that it will come out that the allegations are true. At least he didn't do the Ted Haggard, "I don't know this man" shuffle.
I say give 'em all lie detector tests and see how they come out. If it was me and I was accused of anything like this, I would be willing to do that and make it public if the accusers would as well. I am really saddened by all of this.
This is what Ms Smith can't understand It sure is not a generalization.
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