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Branhamism Discussion of distinctive doctrines of William M. Branham.


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  #71  
Old 06-24-2020, 05:41 PM
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mfblume mfblume is offline
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Re: Any Message Believers Here?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nicodemus1968 View Post
I firmly believe its all about relationship.

Matthew 7:15-23
[15] Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.
[16] Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?
[17] Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit.
[18] A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit.
[19] Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
[20] Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
[21] Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
[22] Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
[23] And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.


Jesus said I never knew you. That word is used as when a man has intimate relations with a women. For example, “Adam knew his wife, and she conceived.”

They understood the power, they understood the authority of the name, yet they had no intimate relationship with the Lord. To them (scripture quoted) it was about the works the Lord did through them. That was salvational in their mind, yet its not.

There is a deeper place in the spirit for those that have that intimate relationship with Jesus. Look at Peter, Paul, James mightily used dont get me wrong. Yet, look at John the one who had his head upon the breast of Jesus. Look how he was used, look and see what he was able to see and partake in, I believe the Lord used him because the relationship they had with each other.

The Lord can use anyone that makes themselves available, yet that doesn’t mean there in a intimate relationship with the Lord. This is a well documented story of Billy Graham Sr. He went to Marylin Monroe and told her about the Lord, he said he felt the Lord told him to go, she rejected what he had to say, 1 week later she was dead. Did the Lord speak to him, I would say yes! Was Billy Graham saved, as far as I understand no he was not.
Amen. I would say they were not carrying their crosses and following Jesus.
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  #72  
Old 06-25-2020, 08:01 AM
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Esaias Esaias is offline
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Re: Any Message Believers Here?

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Originally Posted by mfblume View Post
amen, and notice that Jesus didn't say that God was not actually performing that power through those people. But they were still false prophet.
The thing is, Jesus said false prophets are identifiable by the fruit they produce. Branham produced a cult of personality where faith in Branham is the determiner of salvation, where man shall live by every word that proceeded out of Branham's mouth, etc. The fact he might claim to have performed miracles in Jesus' name is no defense, Jesus says He not only didn't recognise the false prophets but NEVER KNEW THEM. They, according to Jesus, NEVER WERE WITH HIM.

Side note: it doesn't say these people DID miracles, it only says they CLAIMED to have done such...
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  #73  
Old 06-30-2020, 05:12 AM
loran adkins loran adkins is offline
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Re: Any Message Believers Here?

[QUOTE=mfblume;1589162]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nicodemus1968 View Post

Jyde 11 Woe unto them! for they have gone in the way of Cain, and ran greedily after the error of Balaam for reward, and perished in the gainsaying of Core.


All tree of these men are listed together, and we know twp of the three, Cain and Koreh, were right with God at one point but drifted away. Why not Balaam?

But that does not Address the point to whether or not God was using him through his life. As I said, and you seem to agree, that we can be not right with God but still used of God in a gift. We can even use a gift for the wrong purposes like calling fire down whicj James and John tried to do.
I have to question whether these men were right with God ever? You can be in the church or even around people of God and still not be right with God. All these men had something in their hearts that was not right, from the very beginning.
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  #74  
Old 07-01-2020, 11:21 AM
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mfblume mfblume is offline
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Re: Any Message Believers Here?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Esaias View Post
The thing is, Jesus said false prophets are identifiable by the fruit they produce. Branham produced a cult of personality where faith in Branham is the determiner of salvation, where man shall live by every word that proceeded out of Branham's mouth, etc. The fact he might claim to have performed miracles in Jesus' name is no defense, Jesus says He not only didn't recognise the false prophets but NEVER KNEW THEM. They, according to Jesus, NEVER WERE WITH HIM.

Side note: it doesn't say these people DID miracles, it only says they CLAIMED to have done such...
The discussion that I have been involved with is the question of whether or not Branham was used by God, not whether or not he is saved or not a false prophet.

And asserting that they CLAIMED to do miracles, as though their claim might be false, is not valid.

First of all Jesus said many will say LORD LORD when they address Jesus. That's noted before he outlines these works of false prophets.

Matthew 7:21.. Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

When we look to 1 Cor., where people were genuinely used of God in the miraculous, Paul stated that no one can call Jesus Lord but by the Holy Ghost.

1 Corinthians 12:3.. Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.

This is so interesting because 1 Cor 12 is ABOUT THE GIFTS.

So, false prophets can be used of God in the supernatural. The SPIRIT OF GOD actually showed them Christ's lordship. They are like Peter, to whom the Father genuinely revealed Christ. But, faithful to Matt 7 and 1 Cor 12:3, Peter had the need to afterward live by the word and carry his cross in self-denial. Jesus spoke to him about the cross, and Peter balked and was called satan, after Jesus saw his genuine revelation from God about Christ's identity.

Peter would have been in danger of Branham's state of being had he not learned to carry his cross. Peter knew who Jesus was, by the Holy Ghost, as per Jesus words:

Matthew 16:16-17.. And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God. ..(17).. And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

Likewise, the Corinthians were genuinely used of God in gifts. They came behind in NONE.

1 Corinthians 1:7.. So that ye come behind in no gift; waiting for the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ:

But these same people did things that disallow people entrance into the kingdom, just as Jesus said those who say LORD LORD shall not necessarily enter the kingdom!

Compare:

1 Corinthians 3:3.. For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?

With...

Galatians 5:19-21.. Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, ..(20).. Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, ..(21).. Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.

Compare with:

Matthew 7:21.. Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

THE WILL of the Father is not just knowing the Son's identity. THE WILL is to HEAR THE SON and then, as a result, CARRY YOUR CROSS.

Matthew 17:5.. While he yet spake, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them: and behold a voice out of the cloud, which said, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased...

The Father again IDENTIFIED the Son to Peter.

"....; hear ye him."

And the Father's will for Peter was to HEAR THE SON AND DO WHAT TEH SON SAID... cling to the CROSS!

THen Jesus spoke of the cross again.

Matthew 17:9.. And as they came down from the mountain, Jesus charged them, saying, Tell the vision to no man, until the Son of man be risen again from the dead.





The words to the Corinthians are AMAZINGLY parallel to Christ's words in Matt 7 about false prophets.

And Peter heard from the Father, by refused to hear the words of the SON about the cross.

Matthew 16:21-23.. From that time forth began Jesus to shew unto his disciples, how that he must go unto Jerusalem, and suffer many things of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and be raised again the third day. ..(22).. Then Peter took him, and began to rebuke him, saying, Be it far from thee, Lord: this shall not be unto thee. ..(23).. But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men.

So, the problem with false prophets, is that they do not know they are false in many cases.

And Jesus DID NOT imply that the "Lord, Lord" criers who performed wonders in His name were not genuinely used of God in those gifts. In fact, quite the opposite. THEY WERE genuinely used of God.

Branham's problem was not the power of God absent in his gifts, but failure to carry his cross.

Jesus said that the gift-workers in Matt 7 were not hearing his words and doing them, which put them on mere sand for a foundation. Peter, likewise, genuinely heard from the Father, but when Jesus said NOW I SAY UNTO YOU, Jesus was speaking about the cross which Peter rejected So the revelation from the FATHER is the identity of Jesus, and that qualifies one to be used of God in the gifts! But the SECOND REVELATION FROM THE SON
determines whether one is SAVED OR NOT. And that second revelation is about self-denial and carrying the cross, which, when understood in light of Matt 7, keeps us safe from the storms by placing us on a rock foundation so that we are not those whom He would say, "I never knew you, you workers of INIQUITY". The self-denial of the CROSS being carried is the WORD from the SON that keeps us from working the iniquity that makes one a false prophet.

Also, the gifts of God are without repentance. A man can genuinely be gifted of God BEFORE entering into error, and, after entering into error, will not move God's power to stop using him in the gift, as though God were sorry he gave the person a gift. God will never be sorry that he gave a gift to a person, because GIFTS do not determine salvation. Carrying the cross determines salvation.

God used William Branham, but that says nothing about his state of salvation at the moment of his death.
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Last edited by mfblume; 07-01-2020 at 11:27 AM.
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