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Deep Waters 'Deep Calleth Unto Deep ' -The place to go for Ministry discussions. Please keep it civil. Remember to discuss the issues, not each other.


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  #31  
Old 04-10-2013, 07:08 PM
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A.W. Bowman A.W. Bowman is offline
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Re: The Commands of Jesus

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Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple View Post
Yes we all should want to know the commands of Jesus. They communicate to us the will of God.

19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost: 20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo , I am with you alway , even unto the end of the world. Amen. Matt. 28:18-20

Altho teaching the commands of Yeshua is CENTRAL to the great commission I have noticed that the VERY MENTION of his commands sets modern "Christians" off. It makes them so angry.

Yeshua/Jesus and his teachings cannot be separated. The move among Churches today is to do precisely THAT.
There in lies one of the basic problems that has all but destroyed the credibility and effectiveness of the modern church. That coupled with unbelief, self justification, and ramped humanism the Western church has all but demolished its self. We hold to the trappings but have little to no substance.

But, I rant. .....
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It makes no difference whether you study in the holy language, or in Arabic, or Aramaic [or in Greek or even in English]; it matters only whether it is done with understanding. - Moshe Maimonides.
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  #32  
Old 04-11-2013, 02:44 PM
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Michael The Disciple Michael The Disciple is offline
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Re: The Commands of Jesus

A thread like this should be humming with interest. It shows how little hunger and thirst there is for righteousness.

Its far past time people move on from all the disgust for the standards of men. It is blocking them from seeing how important and crucial the commandments of Christ really are.

Whenever "holiness" or keeping commands are brought up they usually immediately equate it with the "Apostolic standards".

Come on guys and girls! What deceived ministers taught in the past must not keep us from the teachings of Jesus right now. We will be judged by his words so how then should we be ordering our lives?
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  #33  
Old 04-11-2013, 03:20 PM
bbyrd009 bbyrd009 is offline
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Re: The Commands of Jesus

Hmm, could be the frame...
Quote:
Originally Posted by A.W. Bowman View Post
There in lies one of the basic problems that has all but destroyed the credibility and effectiveness of the modern church. That coupled with unbelief, self justification, and ramped humanism the Western church has all but demolished its self. We hold to the trappings but have little to no substance.

But, I rant. .....
http://www.wikihow.com/Recognize-the...ristian-Models
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  #34  
Old 04-11-2013, 06:52 PM
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A.W. Bowman A.W. Bowman is offline
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Re: The Commands of Jesus

The thread has garnered just over 350 hits since it original posting on the afternoon of the 9th, but only a few comments. Perhaps it is because all of these folks are studying. I pray so.

But, as I have said, to study is to work, and that prospect drives many people away. Many are content with what they alrady think they know and do not desire to grow beyond their current condition. Willful ignorance. I wonder, how that will be judged?

Me? I know so little, but I do desire to learn more. Even so, the critical question for me is this: How well do I put into practice what I already know? More knowledge only increases the more things that I do not do, and there is a judgment for that. I think the scriptures say it something like this, be ye doers if the word and not hearers only. And again, for one who knows what is right and fails to do same, it is counted sin to him.

In His latest covenant with mankind, God gave His son. All He asked in return was what He as always asked for, obedience to His word. And I have failed. So, it is time I got back up and rejoined the race.

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It makes no difference whether you study in the holy language, or in Arabic, or Aramaic [or in Greek or even in English]; it matters only whether it is done with understanding. - Moshe Maimonides.
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  #35  
Old 04-11-2013, 08:11 PM
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KeptByTheWord KeptByTheWord is offline
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Re: The Commands of Jesus

I've been reading Luke 6, and can't seem to get past it. The words of Jesus are so plain. You can't help but stop in your tracks when you read them. However, I notice most sermons don't come from the Beatitudes, or other plain teachings of Jesus, or if they are, they pick and choose parts of the scripture and forget the rest of the text.

Bro. Bowman, I appreciate your desire to return to the commandments of our Lord Jesus, and your approach to encouraging personal study, instead of demanding every one follow your particular ideology.

MTD... I agree this thread should be "humming with interest" ... but of course, silly things are much easier discussed than deeper things of the word.

I know I am being deeply convicted of the words that Jesus spoke, and trying to follow Him and his commandments as much as is possible in my life. And like AWB... I readily admit being such a failure many, many times... but thanks be for His grace that keeps me going, and keeps pressing me forward.
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  #36  
Old 04-11-2013, 08:34 PM
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A.W. Bowman A.W. Bowman is offline
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Re: The Commands of Jesus

From Luke 6, a truly penetrating question and lesson posed by Jesus:

Verses 46-49
And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say? Whosoever cometh to me, and heareth my sayings, and doeth them, I will shew you to whom he is like: He is like a man which built an house, and digged deep, and laid the foundation on a rock: and when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently upon that house, and could not shake it: for it was founded upon a rock. But he that heareth, and doeth not, is like a man that without a foundation built an house upon the earth; against which the stream did beat vehemently, and immediately it fell; and the ruin of that house was great.

--------------------------
My pending series on the Law of God will be delayed a little. After reviewing it, I discovered that it requires a major editing (rewriting?). It is a mess! I got the first pass done today, will go through it again tomorrow.
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It makes no difference whether you study in the holy language, or in Arabic, or Aramaic [or in Greek or even in English]; it matters only whether it is done with understanding. - Moshe Maimonides.

Last edited by A.W. Bowman; 04-11-2013 at 08:46 PM.
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  #37  
Old 04-11-2013, 09:08 PM
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Re: The Commands of Jesus

Quote:
Originally Posted by A.W. Bowman View Post
From Luke 6, a truly penetrating question and lesson posed by Jesus:

Verses 46-49
And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say? Whosoever cometh to me, and heareth my sayings, and doeth them, I will shew you to whom he is like: He is like a man which built an house, and digged deep, and laid the foundation on a rock: and when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently upon that house, and could not shake it: for it was founded upon a rock. But he that heareth, and doeth not, is like a man that without a foundation built an house upon the earth; against which the stream did beat vehemently, and immediately it fell; and the ruin of that house was great.
Well, according to that logic, following the commandments of Jesus that he had just given in Luke 6 they are:
1. Love your enemies
2. Do good to them which hate you
3. Bless them that curse you
4. Pray for them which despitefully use you
5. To him that smiteth you on the cheek, turn to him the other one, and give him your coat also.
6. Give to every man that asketh of thee, and of him that taketh away thy goods, ask not for them back.
7. If you only love those who love you, how are you any better than the sinners who do likewise?
8. If you only do good to those who do good for you, how are you any better than the sinners who do likewise?
9. If you lend to someone, hoping to receive it back, how are you any better than the sinners who do likewise?
10. So love your enemies, do good, and lend not hoping to have it returned.
11. Be merciful even as your Father also is merciful.
12. Judge not that ye be not judged.
13. Condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned.
14. Forgive, and ye shall be forgiven.
15. Give and it shall be given back to you (now I have heard this one preached on many times)
16. Cast the beam out of your own eye before trying to cast out the mote in your brother's eye.
17. Bring forth fruit out of the abundance of your heart.
And then... after all these things, at least seventeen, (I'm sure more study could dig out a few more)... but just on the 17 commandments listed above.... where does that leave us?

Jesus said after teaching all these things:

Luke 6:46-49
And why call ye me, Lord, Lord, and do not the things which I say? Whosoever cometh to me, and heareth my sayings, and doeth them, I will shew you to whom he is like: He is like a man which built an house, and digged deep, and laid the foundation on a rock: and when the flood arose, the stream beat vehemently upon that house, and could not shake it: for it was founded upon a rock.

But he that heareth, and doeth not, is like a man that without a foundation built an house upon the earth; against which the stream did beat vehemently, and immediately it fell; and the ruin of that house was great.


In Sunday School as a young child, we sang a song about the wise man who built his house upon the rock, and the rains came tumbling down.... It was a wonderful song....

I wonder... Have I built my house upon the rock? Have I obeyed these commands of Jesus?

My answer sadly is no. I haven't. I have given to others, yet expected to receive in return. I haven't always loved my enemies, although the Lord has helped me in the past to do such a thing... Have I turned my cheek to someone who was intent upon hurting me, and offered him my coat too? Have I judged someone unfairly? Have I condemned someone unfairly?

These indeed are just a FEW of the commandments of Jesus... no doubt this thread should have all of us falling in repentance at the feet of Jesus, asking for His help to follow His commandments...

I would think all believers would want to build their house on the rock... but then because we are human... we are always looking for the shortcut, the easy way out... the "shifting sand of man's theology"... But that house won't stand in the Day of the Lord.

Only the house built on the commandments of the Lord Jesus will be the house that stands.

Are we willing to build our house on the rock of Jesus and his commandments, or are we choosing the house on the sand, convinced that our house will stand the test of the storm.... ??

Which house are you building? Which house am I building?

Thanks Bro. Bowman for opening up this discussion on the commandments of Jesus. May we all learn and grow deeper in our commitment to be His true disciple.
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  #38  
Old 04-11-2013, 10:04 PM
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A.W. Bowman A.W. Bowman is offline
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Re: The Commands of Jesus

Sadly, I think a good number of us have built on a few carefully selected proof texts and a lot of religious tradition.

Personally, I have been discarding the religious trappings, traditions, and putting the proof texts back in their original context. Then doing the really unthinkable: Actually studying those passages that are ignored in many of our churches today.

It really is hard to confront a favorite verse and discovering that it does not say/mean anything like how I understood it - or how I had been applying it. /sigh/ I admit that here, but that is a very dangerous path to take! When one starts to get serious about their relationship with Jesus, others around them start to get uncomfortable. The result is that most folks do not take kindly to having their warm fuzzes getting soaking wet. It gets all squishy, and it smells funny too!

What I discovered though, is that God doesn't really care about my little fuzzes. He actually said something like this, "Get a grip and grow up!" Do you have any idea what that means? No more little right/wrong games, no more spiritual one-upmanship games, No more self-justification, No more twisting scripture to suit my agendas, No more thinking more highly of myself than I aught, No more just living in the Spirit - but also having to walk in the Spirit. No more thinking that I can get into heaven without taking on that responsibility for myself. And, these few things are just the starters! There is a whole lot more!

Maturity requires giving up childish things. It requires work! So I think I'll just go over there and sit in the corner, suck my thumb, and whimper a little. I'll try growing up tomorrow.
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It makes no difference whether you study in the holy language, or in Arabic, or Aramaic [or in Greek or even in English]; it matters only whether it is done with understanding. - Moshe Maimonides.

Last edited by A.W. Bowman; 04-11-2013 at 10:06 PM.
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  #39  
Old 04-11-2013, 10:22 PM
TGBTG TGBTG is offline
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Re: The Commands of Jesus

Good stuff...
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  #40  
Old 04-12-2013, 05:56 AM
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Godsdrummer Godsdrummer is offline
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Re: The Commands of Jesus

Quote:
Originally Posted by A.W. Bowman View Post
Sadly, I think a good number of us have built on a few carefully selected proof texts and a lot of religious tradition.

Personally, I have been discarding the religious trappings, traditions, and putting the proof texts back in their original context. Then doing the really unthinkable: Actually studying those passages that are ignored in many of our churches today.

It really is hard to confront a favorite verse and discovering that it does not say/mean anything like how I understood it - or how I had been applying it. /sigh/ I admit that here, but that is a very dangerous path to take! When one starts to get serious about their relationship with Jesus, others around them start to get uncomfortable. The result is that most folks do not take kindly to having their warm fuzzes getting soaking wet. It gets all squishy, and it smells funny too!

What I discovered though, is that God doesn't really care about my little fuzzes. He actually said something like this, "Get a grip and grow up!" Do you have any idea what that means? No more little right/wrong games, no more spiritual one-upmanship games, No more self-justification, No more twisting scripture to suit my agendas, No more thinking more highly of myself than I aught, No more just living in the Spirit - but also having to walk in the Spirit. No more thinking that I can get into heaven without taking on that responsibility for myself. And, these few things are just the starters! There is a whole lot more!

Maturity requires giving up childish things. It requires work! So I think I'll just go over there and sit in the corner, suck my thumb, and whimper a little. I'll try growing up tomorrow.
Art
The thing about you and me, we are relearning God's word from proper prospective. regardless as to whether you and I see eye to eye on everything, is beside the point. What is important is that we first have a relationship with Christ and then we study. It has been my heart felt understanding, "that truth will prevail". Over the course of the last 10+ years I have seen this proven over and over. The fact that when some one studies the word with an open heart that truth is what is found, not false doctrine.

Of course to some it may seem as false doctrine as it doe not agree with the trappings of their religious doctrines, or should I say what the pastor/organization teaches.

What is sad and I thing the biggest tragity of Christianity, is we have students of the bigest name preachers rather than Christ. These are studied in the word of (add name) and seeminly know scripture from one point of view. But in fact they only know the teachings of their pastor. We have whole relgious organizations, that have been built and based on this. Jehovah Witnesses, Mormans, Luthuren, but I digress, carry on.
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