The Original Matthew 28:19 Restored

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by FlamingZword

No one has changed anything.

There are actually ancient variant readings of Matthew 28:19 that do not have the Trinitarian ending, those existed hundredths of years before any of use now were born, we have simply exchanged the traditional reading for one of those ancient readings.

No one can accuse us of changing anything, we have simply accepted another text.

Please list those variant manuscripts.

[Scott Pitta]

One Coptic manuscript has a variant reading. How many of the Coptic manuscripts do not have this variant reading?

The oldest manuscripts we have of Matthew are in Greek. None of those manuscripts have the variant reading.

If this variant reading is exclusive to Coptic manuscripts, and not all Coptic manuscripts contain it, it is a simple translators mistake.

[seguidordejesus]

Originally Posted by Scott Pitta

One Coptic manuscript has a variant reading. How many of the Coptic manuscripts do not have this variant reading?

The oldest manuscripts we have of Matthew are in Greek. None of those manuscripts have the variant reading.

If this variant reading is exclusive to Coptic manuscripts, and not all Coptic manuscripts contain it, it is a simple translators mistake.

[good samaritan]

Originally Posted by votivesoul

Why is the KJV your standard by which you measure other translations? If you don't know Greek or Hebrew well enough why take the KJV at face value? You could be basing your standard on a faulty translation, choosing to stick to something that shouldn't be held as the standard by which other translations are measured.

Give this a read:

https://bible.org/article/why-i-do-n...vailable-today

Before the internet, and all the multitudes of information available this discussion wasn't very prominent. Now with the use of the internet everyone is a biblical scholar, and they call everything into question; thus muddying the water for people to know what to believe. In my education background there is no way for me to prove or disprove someone else's Hebrew/Greek so I will stick with what I first came to know as the Bible.

I have other translations in my home that I revere as the scriptures, but by far do I have more confidence in the KJV being the most reliable. I can't prove nor disprove it, but it is a walk of my faith. In my walk with God I will continue to search for ways to be closer to Him and with an open mindedness in that path. I am not saying anyone is wrong about using other translations, but I think it is possible that there may be divisions created doctrinally if they each have different messages.

If I was a new believer this information overload would be hard to my faith. I am glad to have gotten a root system in God before ever getting the internet. The internet is an avenue of study, and many times I see and hear things online before coming against the issue in my personal life. I think that some things could confuse the simple or the new convert. I want people to view scripture as absent of error, but if people keep saying it must be corrected what is a new convert to think.

[Jito463]

Originally Posted by votivesoul

Why is the KJV your standard by which you measure other translations? If you don't know Greek or Hebrew well enough why take the KJV at face value? You could be basing your standard on a faulty translation, choosing to stick to something that shouldn't be held as the standard by which other translations are measured.

Give this a read:

https://bible.org/article/why-i-do-n...vailable-today

Why do you feel the need to denigrate the KJV at virtually every turn?

Originally Posted by good samaritan

Before the internet, and all the multitudes of information available this discussion wasn't very prominent. Now with the use of the internet everyone is a biblical scholar, and they call everything into question; thus muddying the water for people to know what to believe. In my education background there is no way for me to prove or disprove someone else's Hebrew/Greek so I will stick with what I first came to know as the Bible.

I have other translations in my home that I revere as the scriptures, but by far do I have more confidence in the KJV being the most reliable. I can't prove nor disprove it, but it is a walk of my faith. In my walk with God I will continue to search for ways to be closer to Him and with an open mindedness in that path. I am not saying anyone is wrong about using other translations, but I think it is possible that there may be divisions created doctrinally if they each have different messages.

If I was a new believer this information overload would be hard to my faith. I am glad to have gotten a root system in God before ever getting the internet. The internet is an avenue of study, and many times I see and hear things online before coming against the issue in my personal life. I think that some things could confuse the simple or the new convert. I want people to view scripture as absent of error, but if people keep saying it must be corrected what is a new convert to think.

Your last couple of posts could just as easily have been posted by me. We're of a like mind in this matter.

[FlamingZword]

Ancient citations of the great commission. (hundredths of years before any of us were even born)

Eusebius ""Go, and make disciples of all the nations in My Name"
18 exact citations, over 100 similar citations or allusions.

Annarikhus "Go ye forth into all the world, and teach ye all the nations in My Name in every place.”

Aphraates “Go forth, make disciples of all the peoples, and they shall believe in me”

Ephrem “Go out into the whole world and proclaim my Gospel to the whole of creation, and baptize all the Gentiles”

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by FlamingZword

Ancient citations of the great commission. (hundredths of years before any of us were even born)

Eusebius ""Go, and make disciples of all the nations in My Name"
18 exact citations, over 100 similar citations or allusions.

Annarikhus "Go ye forth into all the world, and teach ye all the nations in My Name in every place.”

Aphraates “Go forth, make disciples of all the peoples, and they shall believe in me”

Ephrem “Go out into the whole world and proclaim my Gospel to the whole of creation, and baptize all the Gentiles”

All four quotations read like paraphrases. What are the actual citations you allude to?

[Scott Pitta]

Bible translators translate manuscripts. I am aware of quotations from the fathers.

Should we favor all quotations from the early church fathers over the wording of the manuscripts themselves ?

Are the fathers quoting verbatim ? Or is it a loose reference, or allusion ??

[FlamingZword]

Originally Posted by mfblume

You're breaking too many traditions. Some will never hear.

Dr. Clinton Willis, Dr. Marvin M. Arnold and Elder William Connor, were early pioneers of this same message that we preach.

Dr. Clinton Willis is firmly convinced the original did read "in my name" and has encountered much opposition to this message, he wrote to encourage us to continue preaching this truth.

Someone said that this message brings division, but did not the message of baptism in the name of Jesus brought also division? Should I then stop teaching truth because it causes division or it bothers some people?

[Evang.Benincasa]

Originally Posted by FlamingZword

Dr. Clinton Willis, Dr. Marvin M. Arnold and Elder William Connor, were early pioneers of this same message that we preach.

Dr. Clinton Willis is firmly convinced the original did read "in my name" and has encountered much opposition to this message, he wrote to encourage us to continue preaching this truth.

Someone said that this message brings division, but did not the message of baptism in the name of Jesus brought also division? Should I then stop teaching truth because it causes division or it bothers some people?

Brother Marvin Arnold's book Matthew 28:19, did you read it?