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  #11  
Old 08-11-2018, 05:59 PM
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Re: The Book of Enoch

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  #12  
Old 08-11-2018, 06:01 PM
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Re: The Book of Enoch

From that thread:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Esaias View Post
... let me say that I believe Peter and Jude are in fact warning people to avoid the book of Enoch, specifically and directly.

As I pointed out, Peter not only quotes Enoch, but specifically contradicts Enoch a few verses later. Jude does the same thing, in fact.

Walk with me through the context for a moment:

2Pe 1:16 For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty.
2Pe 1:17 For he received from God the Father honour and glory, when there came such a voice to him from the excellent glory, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.
2Pe 1:18 And this voice which came from heaven we heard, when we were with him in the holy mount.

The apostolic doctrine and their faith is not based on myths, but on eyewitness testimony.

2Pe 1:19 We have also a more sure word of prophecy; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise in your hearts:

Superior even to eyewitness testimony of mystical visions of heavenly things, however, is the Word of God (the Scripture).

2Pe 1:20 Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation.
2Pe 1:21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.

So, there is a contrast being established between myths, on the one hand, and the doctrine of the gospel on the other hand. One is 'cunningly devised' and the other is based not only on recent eyewitness testimony of people still current and alive, but also (more importantly) on the Scripture itself. So, clearly, is Scripture is 'a more sure word' than apostolic testimony, it is certainly superior to 'cunningly devised fables/myths'. That is the immediate context of the discussion that follows.

2Pe 2:1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.
2Pe 2:2 And many shall follow their pernicious ways; by reason of whom the way of truth shall be evil spoken of.
2Pe 2:3 And through covetousness shall they with feigned words make merchandise of you: whose judgment now of a long time lingereth not, and their damnation slumbereth not.

Peter warns about false teachers coming into the church, who will bring in damnable heresies, that lead to their own destruction. Many will follow these false teachers and their teachings. And 'the way of truth' will be maligned because of them. In other words, the false teachers and their 'many' followers will bring reproach on the way of truth because the false teachers misrepresent the truth. Also, these false teachers will make money off their followers. Yet, the false teachers are doomed, and their doom is certain.

So Peter, after contrasting the cunningly devised fables/myths with the more sure Word of the Scripture, now speaks about false teachers and false teachings and heresies (sects), which will cause the truth to be maligned, these teachers of fables (lies) will make merchandise of the gullible, and are subject to damnation because of their lies.

2Pe 2:4 For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment;

Peter is referring to the events described in Enoch 10 in regards to the binding of Azazel, Semjasa, and their cohorts unto the judgment day. Notice, he says 'if', meaning he is introducing an 'if...then...' statement. The 'if' is simply that if God bound the angels that sinned... then 'the Lord knows how to deliver the godly out of temptation to reserve the unjust to punishment'.

What does that have to do with anything? Well, common Jewish 'fables/myths' in the first century included the idea that angels sinned, married women and fathered children in Noah's day (leading to the Flood), and that they and the spirits of the destroyed hybrid offspring are roaming the earth attacking people, tormenting them as 'demons', and so forth.

Remember, the immediate context is false teachers and 'cunningly devised fables' spread by those false teachers, often to 'make merchandise' of people. Exorcism was an actual paid profession in those times (and still is among various people groups today). Exorcists claimed to be able to deliver people from evil spirits by virtue of their superior knowledge of the evil spirits and how they operate, etc. And they did charge money.

Much of these Jewish myths were found expressed in the Testaments of the Twelve Patriarchs, the Book of Enoch, the Book of Jubilees, and other similar Jewish mystical and religious fiction writings. These beliefs were very common, very popular, and very influential in many quarters, even among early Christians.

Peter is warning about 'fables' and false teachers looking to lead people astray and make some money off them. His argument begins with 'IF' and then cites the book of Enoch (one of the more popular Jewish fables then extant) as evidence that people need not fear evil spirits roaming around doing bad things to them, nor do they need any special teachers or 'specially anointed ministers' to 'deliver' them from the evil spirits, because 'the angels that sinned HAVE BEEN BOUND'. And because of this, the Lord can deliver the godly and punish the unjust. One need not seek after or follow after any teachers bringing 'the deeper things of the spirit world' into your life (for a small nominal fee, or for a love offering, or whatever).

Why does Peter cite Enoch? Because Enoch was one of the favorite texts used by various sects of Judaism and early gnostic Christianity. He thus proves their inconsistency using their own literature, just like one can quote JW literature in order to refute their doctrines, because their own literature often contradicts what they teach. Using the literature of the false teachers to prove their inconsistencies is not an endorsement of the false teachers' literature!

2Pe 2:5 And spared not the old world, but saved Noah the eighth person, a preacher of righteousness, bringing in the flood upon the world of the ungodly;
2Pe 2:6 And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrha into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly;
2Pe 2:7 And delivered just Lot, vexed with the filthy conversation of the wicked:
2Pe 2:8 (For that righteous man dwelling among them, in seeing and hearing, vexed his righteous soul from day to day with their unlawful deeds; )
2Pe 2:9 The Lord knoweth how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and to reserve the unjust unto the day of judgment to be punished:

Following the citation from Enoch, he turns to the Scriptures and concludes with verse 9, as the conclusion to the 'if...then...' statement he introduced in verse 4.

He continues his argument:

2Pe 2:10 But chiefly them that walk after the flesh in the lust of uncleanness, and despise government. Presumptuous are they, selfwilled, they are not afraid to speak evil of dignities.

This is a description of the ungodly who are being reserved to punishment. Those who 'despise government'. These are not political anarchists, but they despise Divine government. They are presumptuous and self-willed, and are 'not afraid to speak evil of dignities'. Literally, they do not 'tremble to blaspheme glories'. The term 'glories' was a well-known term for the angelic hosts surrounding the court of God serving as a reflection of the divine majesty itself.

Exo 15:11 Who is like to thee among the gods, O Lord? who is like to thee? glorified in holiness, marvellous in glories, doing wonders. (Brenton's English translation of the Greek Old Testament)

Same word, 'glories'. The Testament of Judah (another of the popular 1st century era Jewish fables/myths) says 'the glories blessed Simeon', in a list of blessings on the twelve tribes (Test. Judah 4:29 - http://www.sacred-texts.com/bib/fbe/fbe280.htm ).

(continued in next post)
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  #13  
Old 08-11-2018, 06:01 PM
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Re: The Book of Enoch

and again:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Esaias View Post
(continued from previous post)

So these false teachers were speaking blasphemous things concerning the angelic and divine government of God. Obviously, Peter is saying these false teachers are teaching error (blasphemies) concerning angels (dominions and glories).

2Pe 2:11 Whereas angels, which are greater in power and might, bring not railing accusation against them before the Lord.

Peter here cites Enoch chapter 9, yet he contradicts the citation. In Enoch chapter 9 it was angels who accused the 'fallen angels' to God. Yet here, Peter specifically says the angels which were greater in power and might did not accuse them to God. This is a direct contradiction of the text of Enoch. The passage follows:

[Chapter 9]

1 And then Michael, Uriel, Raphael, and Gabriel looked down from heaven and saw much blood being 2 shed upon the earth, and all lawlessness being wrought upon the earth. And they said one to another: 'The earth made without inhabitant cries the voice of their cryingst up to the gates of heaven. 3 And now to you, the holy ones of heaven, the souls of men make their suit, saying, "Bring our cause 4 before the Most High."' And they said to the Lord of the ages: 'Lord of lords, God of gods, King of kings, and God of the ages, the throne of Thy glory (standeth) unto all the generations of the 5 ages, and Thy name holy and glorious and blessed unto all the ages! Thou hast made all things, and power over all things hast Thou: and all things are naked and open in Thy sight, and Thou seest all 6 things, and nothing can hide itself from Thee. Thou seest what Azazel hath done, who hath taught all unrighteousness on earth and revealed the eternal secrets which were (preserved) in heaven, which 7 men were striving to learn: And Semjaza, to whom Thou hast given authority to bear rule over his associates. And they have gone to the daughters of men upon the earth, and have slept with the 9 women, and have defiled themselves, and revealed to them all kinds of sins. And the women have 10 borne giants, and the whole earth has thereby been filled with blood and unrighteousness. And now, behold, the souls of those who have died are crying and making their suit to the gates of heaven, and their lamentations have ascended: and cannot cease because of the lawless deeds which are 11 wrought on the earth. And Thou knowest all things before they come to pass, and Thou seest these things and Thou dost suffer them, and Thou dost not say to us what we are to do to them in regard to these.' http://hiddenbible.com/enoch/online.html/

The four chief angels (archangels) of Jewish mythology accused the fallen angels to God. They accused the fallen angels of sinning, of miscegenation with humans, of fathering hybrid offspring, and of leading mankind into all sorts of evil. That is what the book of Enoch states. That is what the then[current Jewish fables stated. That is what was commonly taught among Jewish mystics and gnostics. But Peter specifically denies this.

2Pe 2:11 Whereas angels, which are greater in power and might, bring not railing accusation against them before the Lord.

Against whom? The 'glories' and dominion' spoken of previously. Peter is saying the false teachers are blaspheming angelic powers, whereas the angels themselves do no such thing - directly refuting the teaching of Jewish fable-masters who relied upon Enoch and other fables/myths for their authority. Enoch and the others have the archangels accusing the evil fallen angels of the various things the gnostics and fable-tellers likewise accused them of. Yet Peter specifically refutes this and denies it.

2Pe 2:12 But these, as natural brute beasts, made to be taken and destroyed, speak evil of the things that they understand not; and shall utterly perish in their own corruption;

The false teachers spreading fables and myths and making money off the gullible speak evil of things they do not understand (the dominion and glories, ie the heavenly government and the angelic orders). Furthermore, they will totally perish in their corruption. It is a serious matter the blaspheme the government of Almighty God. (What, do we think God alone is himself the whole entirety of his government? No, he has myriads of angelic beings that carry out the Divine will. To blaspheme the angelic beings is to blaspheme the government of God. Just as if railing blasphemies and calumnies against the police, sherriff's, judges, courts, etc is nothing less than a blasphemous assault on the entire national government. Rail against the king's men and spread lies and falsehoods about them, and you slander the king and his entire government!)

2Pe 2:13 And shall receive the reward of unrighteousness, as they that count it pleasure to riot in the day time. Spots they are and blemishes, sporting themselves with their own deceivings while they feast with you;
2Pe 2:14 Having eyes full of adultery, and that cannot cease from sin; beguiling unstable souls: an heart they have exercised with covetous practices; cursed children:
2Pe 2:15 Which have forsaken the right way, and are gone astray, following the way of Balaam the son of Bosor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness;
2Pe 2:16 But was rebuked for his iniquity: the dumb ass speaking with man's voice forbad the madness of the prophet.

These false teachers spreading their myths and fables which appear to center on blasphemy against angelic beings in the divine government of God are doomed, they are spots and blemishes in the church, they are immoral, they are greedy, they are cursed, and they divine for hire like Balaam.

2Pe 2:17 These are wells without water, clouds that are carried with a tempest; to whom the mist of darkness is reserved for ever.

This is a series of references by Peter from the book of Enoch, paralleled in Jude, by the way, on the same subject, and making the same point. Peter (and Jude) applies these Enochian epithets to the false teachers teaching lies and fables regarding the 'angels' (namely that 'they sinned', fornicated with humans, produced hybrid offspring, and corrupted all mankind through teaching them forbidden knowledge and seducing them into rebellion, and resulted in the myriads of demons and evil spirits roaming the earth today which afflict mankind, and who can be taken care of by those 'in the know' - for a fee...).

2Pe 2:18 For when they speak great swelling words of vanity, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through much wantonness, those that were clean escaped from them who live in error.
2Pe 2:19 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are the servants of corruption: for of whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage.
2Pe 2:20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.
2Pe 2:21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.
2Pe 2:22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

These fable-promoters and false teachers are leading people back into bondage, entangling people again in corruption and pollution. They are said to have turned from the 'holy commandment' and are like a dog going back to his vomit. In all these statements, Peter is saying these teachers and those they deceive with their fables and myths about 'angels sinning' etc are returning to something.

Israel came to the truth but often returned to idolatry and superstition. The Jews continued that tradition with their fables and myths, 'exorcism', mysticism etc, concerning Solomon and his command of demons through superior gnosis, the Star of Rempham (the so-called 'star of David' which is actually the hexagram of Solomon and is used for mystical and occultic purposes, usually exorcisms), their kaballah and all the other nonsense they came up with in the second temple period (and later). All that 'fable and myth' was really regurgitated pagan superstition brought from Babylon and Egypt, to which they were returning, with all it;s superstitions about divine beings leading man astray, fornicating with women, producing hybrids (demigods), being chained in Tartarus under the earth, below Hades, producing evil spirits that roam around tormenting people, requiring the services of 'experts in the spiritual deliverance ministry', etc etc etc.

So then Peter is actually refuting the Book of Enoch, and its fables and myths perpetrated by Jewish gnostic Essene and Pharisaic mystics and rabbis.

Which means the whole 'angels that sinned, mated with humans, producing hybrids, corrupting mankind, teaching and leading mankind into evil inventions and immorality, generating possessions etc etc' teaching is nothing more than Jewish fables and myths promoted by false teachers who are marked for destruction because of it.
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  #14  
Old 08-11-2018, 06:02 PM
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Re: The Book of Enoch

And yet again:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Esaias View Post
Okay, so let's look at Jude for a bit.

First of all, I believe Jude is quoting 2 Peter.

Jud 1:3 Beloved, when I gave all diligence to write unto you of the common salvation, it was needful for me to write unto you, and exhort you that ye should earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered unto the saints.
Jud 1:4 For there are certain men crept in unawares, who were before of old ordained to this condemnation, ungodly men, turning the grace of our God into lasciviousness, and denying the only Lord God, and our Lord Jesus Christ.

According to Jude, certain men had crept in unawares perverting the grace of God and even denying the Lord Jesus (obviously by contradicting His teachings). Jude says they had crept in.

2Pe 2:1 But there were false prophets also among the people, even as there shall be false teachers among you, who privily shall bring in damnable heresies, even denying the Lord that bought them, and bring upon themselves swift destruction.

Peter, however, says 'there shall be' these false teachers who would even deny the Lord Jesus. Jude says they were already crept in. Thus, what was future for Peter is past and present for Jude. I believe this establishes which came first (2 Peter) and shows that Jude is expounding upon what Peter warned about.

Jud 1:5 I will therefore put you in remembrance, though ye once knew this, how that the Lord, having saved the people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed them that believed not.

Jude begins a similar process as Peter, using what amounts to the same outline. Firstly, he uses examples to show illustrate that the false teachers would face destruction, just as Peter showed. Secondly, the examples he chooses include examples of apostasy, just as Peter spoke about. The first example is of people being delivered from Egypt but later being destroyed because of their apostasy and backsliding. Thus, the false teachers are REintroducing something from the past, they are going BACK to something, as Peter talked about (dog returning to its vomit, etc).

Jud 1:6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.

Here Jude references the book of Enoch, as Peter did. According to Enoch, the angels that 'left their own habitation' (the 'angels that sinned' in Peter) have been reserved in everlasting chains to judgment day. I provided the quotation from Enoch for this in an earlier post so I'll not repeat it here.

Jud 1:7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

He then references the example of Sodom and Gomorrha. At this point a careless reading of Jude would seem to imply that the angels not keeping their first estate is paralleled by Sodom and Gomorrha going after strange flesh. But, a closer examination of the context indicates the parallel is of a different sort.

Remember, the context is false doctrines. Jude is referring to the same problem Peter was referring to (as evidenced by his use of 2 Peter's material and argumentation and examples and conclusions). That problem was a problem of false teachers bringing blasphemous accusations against heavenly beings (angels). We saw already that the book of Enoch and other popular Jewish myths did just that, accusing the angels of God of rebelling against God, fornicating with humans, producing hybrid offspring, teaching and leading mankind into sin, etc. In short, all the evil in the world was a result of 'fallen angels', instead of the wickedness of men's own hearts (as the canonical scriptures seem to indicate).

Here in Jude, we see the same false teachers. They are seducing people astray back into superstitious idolatry and demonism (remember Paul said the things the gentiles sacrifice to they sacrifice to demons). The sin of Sodom is set forth as an example of these false teachers. What did the men of Sodom actually do? They attempted to rape two angelic beings. While the men of Sodom may have not known the two men were angels, the fact remains they attempted to rape two angelic beings sent by God. So the men of Sodom were guilty of attempted horrific crimes against God's ministering agents, and were punished with a nuke from heaven for it. This ties into the next verse:

Jud 1:8 Likewise also these filthy dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities.

The false teachers are called 'filthy dreamers', meaning their doctrines are really filthy imaginations. They despise dominion and speak evil of dignities'. This is what Peter said about these false teachers. They speak evil of heavenly beings who are in the employ of God and who represent the divine majesterial government of heaven. Their false teachers amount to blasphemous slanderings, in other words. Just as the men of Sodom attempted to do violence to angels, these false teachers 'likewise' attempt to do violence to angels (through false teachings and lies about them).

Jud 1:9 Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.

Now, this is fascinating. This event is nowhere described whatsoever in the Bible. But Jude did not pull this out of his yarmulka. This appears, however, to have been a popular Jewish myth. Clarke in his commentary states the following:

There is something very like it in Debarim Rabba, sec. ii., fol. 263, 1: “Samael, that wicked one, the prince of the satans, carefully kept the soul of Moses, saying: When the time comes in which Michael shall lament, I shall have my mouth filled with laughter. Michael said to him: Wretch, I weep, and thou laughest. Rejoice not against me, O mine enemy, because I have fallen; for I shall rise again: when I sit in darkness, the Lord is my light; Mic_7:8. By the words, because I have fallen, we must understand the death of Moses; by the words, I shall rise again, the government of Joshua, etc.”


According to Barnes, Origen in his commentary on this passage says it was taken from a writing called 'The Assumption of Moses' which at least in Origen's day was extant among the Jews, and which includes an account of Satan disputing with Michael the archangel about the body of Moses. Barnes says the original work is no longer extant. There is a 6th century Latin version of the Assumption of Moses, but it does not contain the account of Satan and Michael disputing about Moses' body. The point, however, is that such a belief was apparently in vogue in the days of Jude.

Jude identifies this myth and uses it to point out that 'even Michael did not bring a railing accusation against the devil'. This of course is parallel to Peter saying the angels which are greater in might do not bring accusations against their fellow angels. And apparently Jude is using this apocryphal Jewish fable to refute the practices of those teachers of apocryphal Jewish fables, showing their inconsistency and how their own fables contradict themselves and the ones who teach them. The false teachers bring slander and libel against the angels, making railing accusations against them, whereas even in their blasphemous fables such things do not usually occur. Thus showing the false teachers are caught up in contradictions and inconsistencies.

(to be continued)
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  #15  
Old 08-11-2018, 06:02 PM
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Esaias Esaias is offline
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Re: The Book of Enoch

and one more:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Esaias View Post
(continued from previous post)

Jud 1:10 But these speak evil of those things which they know not: but what they know naturally, as brute beasts, in those things they corrupt themselves.

The false teachers speak evil of the angels of God (making claims about them that are not only false but libelous, railing accusations and blasphemies). And so the false teachers, relying on carnal mythologies corrupt themselves with superstitions.

Jud 1:11 Woe unto them! for they have gone in the way of Cain, and ran greedily after the error of Balaam for reward, and perished in the gainsaying of Core.

The false teachers have followed Cain's example (who slew someone much more holy than he himself was), Balaam's example (who tried to make merchandise of holy things, being a prophet for hire), and Core/Korah who despised the appointed messengers of God (the Aaronic priesthood and Moses especially) and rebelled against God ordained authority, and brought railing against Moses and the ordained priesthood. Again, the theme is that of false teachers railing against, blaspheming against, and thus doing 'violence to' the angelic government of God by making false accusations about angels. There is some connection also to monetary reward (travelling exorcists?) as well.

Jud 1:12 These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots;
Jud 1:13 Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own shame; wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever.

Jude uses language from the book of Enoch here. Language that in Enoch was used to refer to the punishments brought on by the sinning angels is used by Jude to refer to the false teachers. In other words, the 'angels that sinned' in Enoch are transposed by Jude into the false teachers teaching lies about the angels of God. Or in yet other words, the false teachers taught blasphemous lies against the angels of God and what they said about the angels actually applies to themselves.

Jud 1:14 And Enoch also, the seventh from Adam, prophesied of these, saying, Behold, the Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints,
Jud 1:15 To execute judgment upon all, and to convince all that are ungodly among them of all their ungodly deeds which they have ungodly committed, and of all their hard speeches which ungodly sinners have spoken against him.

Now, Jude quotes Enoch directly, where Enoch speaks about the impending judgment of the wicked who had blasphemed God. But remember Jude's context! Jude is using these accounts as illustrations of the character and fate of false teachers who lie about the angels. Notice what Jude says, 'And Enoch ... prophesied'. In the Greek, Jude says 'Enoch prophesied to these'. Jude is not saying Enoch successfully prophesied about the coming destruction of the wicked, but specifically prophesied about the false teachers Jude was referring to.

Green's Literal:

Jud 1:14 And "the seventh from Adam," Enoch, also prophesied to these men, saying, Behold, "the Lord came with" myriads "of His saints,"

Young's Literal:

Jud 1:14 And prophesy also to these did the seventh from Adam--Enoch--saying, `Lo, the Lord did come in His saintly myriads,

Geneva:

Jud 1:14 And Enoch also the seuenth from Adam, prophecied of such, saying, Beholde, the Lorde commeth with thousands of his Saints,

In other words, Jude uses a quote from the Book of Enoch, a favorite among the Jewish fable pushers, and applies it to the fable pushers themselves. Thus, Jude is saying that God is coming with all the heavenly host ('saints' being 'holy ones') to execute judgment against the false teachers pushing their blasphemous Jewish myths and fables about angels and who seek to make some money off their scams.

Jud 1:16 These are murmurers, complainers, walking after their own lusts; and their mouth speaketh great swelling words, having men's persons in admiration because of advantage.

They do not walk after Christ, they do not follow the truth, they follow their own desires. They speak great swelling words and show favoritism (Barnes supposes they admire the rich and flatter them) obviously for personal gain.

So what are they complaining and murmuring about? Those who believed that angels sinned and fell from heaven, and have been running amok causing trouble for everyone, obviously complain about their lot in life. 'The devil is attacking me, woe is me' they say, about practically everything. There is a demon behind every bush, it seems. They refuse to submit to the doctrine of Jesus Christ who 'holds ALL authority in heaven and in earth', and who taught that not one bird drops dead apart from God and that the very hairs of our head are numbered. Instead, they ascribe to satan that which is withint the Divine Providence of God. They essentially promote Dualism, Manichaeanism, Zoroastrianism, the 'good God vs the evil god'. The devil on your shoulder whispering in your ear to sin, 'the devil made me do it', blame the devil for this, that, and the other thing.

Demons everywhere, all your problems are caused by fallen angels. BUT, hey, we can take care of that problem... for a small nominal fee, of course...

In fact, the same thing exists today in much of the so called 'deliverance ministries' so popular among charismatics. They amount to travelling exorcist side shows, not much different than what is popular among Roman Catholics and Eastern Orthodox over in the Balkans.

The doctrines in fact are the same: Angels of God sinned, fell, became demons, trouble mankind constantly, all your woes are the fallen angels/demons, experts in these matters can take care of the problem, follow and support my ministry, etc.

In doing such, they blaspheme the angels of God. They rely on extrabibical sources for their doctrines, but those extrabiblical sources contradict the Bible, and contradict themselves, and contradict the ones who use them (as all cultic false doctrines do).

The remainder of Jude is a reminder that such things were foretold by the apostles, that false teachers and 'mockers' would come in following their own desires not heeding sound doctrine.

I notice that Jude seems to reference Zechariah chapter 3 when he says 'hating even the garment spotted by the flesh'. Zechariah 3 also contains an account of the Angel of YHVH rebuking satan by saying 'YHVH rebuke thee', in regards to the changing of Joshua's 'filthy garments' to new robes and his installation as priest.
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  #16  
Old 08-11-2018, 08:47 PM
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Evang.Benincasa Evang.Benincasa is offline
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Re: The Book of Enoch

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Old 08-11-2018, 10:17 PM
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FlamingZword FlamingZword is offline
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Re: The Book of Enoch

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We would however admit there was a book of Enoch that WAS accepted in the early Apostolic Faith? Not saying the one we NOW have is inspired BUT we know one did exist. Right?
The book of Enoch was mentioned but that does not mean it was accepted.
Even if the one we have now is the same one, it does not mean it is inspired.
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Old 08-12-2018, 03:14 AM
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Re: The Book of Enoch

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Thank you Brothers, you are a priceless resource.

Last edited by Amanah; 08-12-2018 at 03:24 AM.
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