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Originally Posted by Tithesmeister
Yes you have been consistent. I agree with you on that. Consistently wrong according to all available scripture but consistent nonetheless.
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Brother, how am I wrong that a soul isn't going to hell based upon their refusal to give 10% tithe? How am I wrong in my understanding that if a bro or sis in the church want to give out of a willing heart to help support their pastor or elder or bishop that they're able to do so? How am I wrong that the church should give from the heart and not from force?
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Originally Posted by Tithesmeister
congratulations. It is important to have a heart that can be softened by the word of God.
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This is very true.
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Originally Posted by Tithesmeister
agree with you about this. If they want to give ten percent of their money to the pastor or their child or their local politician or whomever, that is their business. However the problem that I have is when the pastor twists the word of God and says he is entitled to ten percent of their money (which is NEVER tithed in the Bible anywhere). My problem you see is with false teaching. And it is SOMETIMES taught that it is IMPOSSIBLE to be saved unless they tithe.
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If the pastor does this then he is in the hands of God. You have to realize if the pastor is saying "tithe or hell" then that means he has other issues going on other than what you're hearing.
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Originally Posted by Tithesmeister
would obviously disagree with Paul on this subject if you are implying that a pastor or other minister should not hold a secular job.
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Ok, you had to be laughing when you wrote this! I believe there is 2-3 verses that state Paul was tent making. The Apostle was used to write over half the new testament, I've read he started 14-20 churchs, went on 3 missionary journeys, was stoned, in fasting often, in dangers often, spent the night in the deep and many other things and your going to tell me he was a part time minister? I think not friend.
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Originally Posted by Tithesmeister
sounds like you were a victim of false teaching. Don’t victimize others just because you were victimized.
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I wasn't a victim.
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Originally Posted by Tithesmeister
believe we would agree that ALL drunkards are lost . It’s pretty easy to support that doctrine with scripture.
But what about preachers who steal money from their people that they are supposed to be serving?
What about pastors who covet the saints money soooo much that they have fabricated a whole doctrine to justify taking money from Jesus’ very own church? It seems to be almost the same thing that provoked Jesus to take a whip and clean out the temple.
What about increasingly brazen pastors who contradict Jesus when He said salvation was a free gift, and they contend that it is impossible to be saved unless you pay them ten percent of your gross wage?
Well, that’s just gross! Aaaand it’s also extortion!
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Absolutely!
Yet, why stop at a preacher? That same standard goes for bro. and sis. that don't preach. Ive seen some greedy saints in my life, they have a nice house, nice car, everything in financial order and they won't give a dime to help the church door stay open. They won't help their neighbor in any way, they're consumed with themselves.
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Originally Posted by Tithesmeister
need to be very careful. Because, he that would be rich falls into many temptations. Including twisting scripture and teaching false doctrine.
I teach that thieves (even preachers who are stealing tithes) nor the covetous (even pastors who are coveting money to which they are not entitled) nor extortionists (even pastors who are extorting tithes from their members by telling them they will be lost unless they “voluntarily” give them ten percent) are lost! Aaaand they need to be preached to on the subject.
But I’m not gonna preach or anything.  |
Once again, Absolutely. Yet, it goes for the church as a whole. We are to give, yet we're to give cheerfully and not by manipulation.
I am blessed to have an elder in my life that started 4-5 church's across the USA and each of those church's to this day are running multiple hundreds of saints. If my number is correct he sold his house for $10-$12 million and gave it away to many church's through the world. He bought a used Chevy van and went everywhere preaching the gospel, when he was given an offering we used it to get to the next place to preach, he ministered everywhere from Eskimos of northern Canada to across the globe to the Buddhist's of India. Everything he has he gives back to the gospel. A well known preacher called him a couple years ago and said they're a couple millionaires in the church that want to buy him a car (his broke down), after he prayed about it he accepted the offer, and ask for them to purchase a couple year old Dodge Caravan. The preacher was stunned, he told him they're willingly to purchase him a Cadillac Escalade, he refused, he didn't want to drive up to a church in such a luxury vehicle.
This same man accepted tithes in the church's while he was the pastor. Yet, he gave it back.
Another story;
The Late Elder James Kilgore, had a very large church and a very prosperous church. Just for your understanding, an evangelist came to the church and before he preached he told Bro. Kilgore that he needed $1,200 per service, Bro. Kilgore told him, Im glad to give you the entire offering. He (evangelist) wasn't having that, because he had been to places that barely paid his gas, so now he has an amount that he wanted per service. After the service Bro. Kilgore wanted to give him the entire offering, he still refused, so Bro. Kilgore gave him a check for $1,200, and then told him the offering was $20,000 that night. You would think Bro. Kilgore is living off the backs of the saints, making millions and enjoying all the financial blessings of such a large giving church? Not at all, he lived in a room attached to the church, the church got together and bought him a new car, he returned it and gave the money back, by the time he died he had nothing, in finical terms he died a poor man.
Now, you harp very hard on preachers without being a preacher yourself, so are you willing to give everything you have to spread this gospel? How many saints in the church are willing to sell what they have and depend on the Jesus to give them what they need?
Should saints in the church have financial retirements? 401Ks? Pensions? Why? the Bible says not to think about tomorrow, we to seek FIRST the kingdom of God. Many in the church's today have their spirit affected by the amount of money in their checking account. And you're going to spend your time harping on a minister accepting tithe? All of us need to check our spirit, that if Jesus said to sell everything, and follow his will for our life, would we do it? The time may come when we have to, better start getting used to depend on him for your needs.....
Love you brother
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