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  #251  
Old 05-24-2019, 03:04 PM
derAlte derAlte is offline
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Re: UPC, ALJC, PAW, etc.

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Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa View Post
Real sin lurks in the inner shadows of the mind. Who we are in the dark is where we really are judged as Christians. Behind closed doors, within the time where no one can see us. Being a Christian really counts when we are on our rear end, and everything is burning down around us. When those we thought were our friends are now skinning us alive. When all have forsaken us, and are now sinking their knives, fangs, and claws in our back. That is the time to let the Holy Ghost move, and allow Jesus to put more weight on the bar for a deadlift. That's when cleaning up a mess, or putting out a fire is doable. The brothers and sisters who really know their pastor, and his desire for them, don't sweat the small stuff. They abide, and they grow taller with Jesus and the elders.
How true this is!
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  #252  
Old 05-24-2019, 03:07 PM
derAlte derAlte is offline
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Re: UPC, ALJC, PAW, etc.

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Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa View Post
Going to a diner and having a group tell you that they don't like Brother Tom Bombadil, because he is still dipping. Well, he doesn't dip when he is at church, no spitting around the property? Well, one brother pipes up and tells that Old Brother Tom does it at work.
I can't tell you how delighted I am to hear that Tom Bombadil is now going to church! But what about his wife, Goldberry? And where are they attending services? Is there an Apostolic Church now in Bucklebury or are they having to travel all the way to Bree?
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  #253  
Old 05-24-2019, 04:43 PM
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Evang.Benincasa Evang.Benincasa is offline
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Re: UPC, ALJC, PAW, etc.

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Originally Posted by derAlte View Post
I can't tell you how delighted I am to hear that Tom Bombadil is now going to church! But what about his wife, Goldberry? And where are they attending services? Is there an Apostolic Church now in Bucklebury or are they having to travel all the way to Bree?
I believe they go to the First UPC of Buckland.
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  #254  
Old 05-24-2019, 06:03 PM
derAlte derAlte is offline
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Re: UPC, ALJC, PAW, etc.

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Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa View Post
I believe they go to the First UPC of Buckland.
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  #255  
Old 05-24-2019, 07:00 PM
Antipas Antipas is offline
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Re: UPC, ALJC, PAW, etc.

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Originally Posted by Apostolic1ness View Post
You say outdated, but to whom is it outdated? Surely not to the pastors and saints that came out of the 60s that identified their own beards with rebellion. How is that outdated? So here comes beards, skinny jeans, cap sleeves, mini skirts, diamond rings etc.where do you draw the line? Some of those things are not found in scriptures.
That's a great question.

If it isn't in Scripture, I'd have to ask, what says we must draw a line?

Beards? Must we draw a line?

Well, if all we do is reference a group of folk who lived over 50 years ago... I don't see it. Sure, I understand that some older saints who came out of the hippie movement shaved their beards for the Kingdom to mark their new life in Christ. But give those older saints some credit. They know there's nothing sinful about beards. They know they shaved their beards upon leaving the hippie commune, but that was then. I think the idea that if a pastor allows beards that these saints will spin and fall away is silly. And my goodness, even if they did spin out and fall away... the pastor clearly already failed to root them so deeply in the Word that allowing beards cost them their souls... that's a BIG problem. Shallow roots. So shallow, challenge a human tradition they topple. Not good. Not good at all.

Skinny jeans? Must we draw a line?

Well, skinny jeans are so tight they are immodest. We can pull a number of Scriptures about modesty. So, yeah. I can agree with a pastor admonishing saints not to wear skinny jeans.

Cap sleeves, mini-skirts, diamonds? Again, modesty is biblical. And avoiding ostentatious gold and costly array is also mentioned in Scripture.

Remember, if we can trace a line straight to Scripture, we know we can draw lines. It's when we start drawing lines where Scripture is silent that we start creating problems. Honestly, there's a stronger case for a pastor drawing a line against the internet than beards, given the filth that is found throughout the net.

But if I had a beard, I wouldn't want to make a problem in a "non-beards" church. If the saints are so fragile they'll fall apart if the pastor allows something like facial hair, I should just go to another church. First, such a pastor would only make me as fragile. Second, I wouldn't want to cause those poor fragile brethren to stumble. Me going somewhere else is a win/win for everyone involved. lol
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  #256  
Old 05-24-2019, 07:09 PM
Antipas Antipas is offline
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Re: UPC, ALJC, PAW, etc.

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Originally Posted by Apostolic1ness View Post
I dont get it. Some would leave a church and go find the one that.fits their fantsy so they can have a beard. No matter the relationship between the church and the family or the pastor. No loyalty, no pastoral authority, no submission.
Eh, it can be said that some are equally as determined to stay in a church that fits their fantsy regarding the traditions of men.

All these accusations don't get anyone anywhere.

Why can't both sides simply respect one another? Clearly one church has a penchant for traditionalism and the other a greater penchant for a more strict biblicism. I don't want to see traditional saints of God crumble over Satan's facial hair... but I also don't want to see biblical saints of God crumble either.

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  #257  
Old 05-24-2019, 07:11 PM
Antipas Antipas is offline
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Re: UPC, ALJC, PAW, etc.

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Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa View Post
Nope, as for me, it just makes me lose my focus. Better not knowing a thing, when you tag it down to the last detail. That way everyone knows it was Jesus coming around taking names. Especially the pastor. Time spent in the pastor’s office is better spent on our knees in the prayer room.
Awesome post.

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  #258  
Old 05-24-2019, 07:18 PM
Antipas Antipas is offline
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Re: UPC, ALJC, PAW, etc.

I think all this division over standards is sad.

Some standards are reasonable.

But the pure hate I've seen between both sides can drag both sides to Hell.
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  #259  
Old 05-24-2019, 11:43 PM
Costeon Costeon is offline
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Re: UPC, ALJC, PAW, etc.

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Originally Posted by Ehud View Post
It could be that whomever presented it didn't open the bible, but rather told stories of yesteryear. It would be easy to interpret "no bible reference" as "no scriptural foundation." I have heard many a sermon during which the minister read a single verse, yet preached for an hour. He might have been right, but it wasn't because of his single, unrelated scripture reference.
Hometown guy, I think, misunderstood what I had written. You may have seen my response to him. I was not claiming that I had great knowledge. I did listen intently to my pastor and friends. There were standards that were only supported by basically one passage (pants on women and uncut hair for women, e.g.). That didn't seem like a strong scriptural foundation. It struck me that since these standards so separated the church members from the larger culture it would seem like there would be multiple passages to base the standard on. At any rate, I deeply respected those I had come to know in those early days and admired their willingness to be separate from the world.
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  #260  
Old 05-25-2019, 04:29 AM
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Evang.Benincasa Evang.Benincasa is offline
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Re: UPC, ALJC, PAW, etc.

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Originally Posted by Costeon View Post
Hometown guy, I think, misunderstood what I had written. You may have seen my response to him. I was not claiming that I had great knowledge. I did listen intently to my pastor and friends. There were standards that were only supported by basically one passage (pants on women and uncut hair for women, e.g.). That didn't seem like a strong scriptural foundation. It struck me that since these standards so separated the church members from the larger culture it would seem like there would be multiple passages to base the standard on. At any rate, I deeply respected those I had come to know in those early days and admired their willingness to be separate from the world.
Christianity itself, separates the church members from the larger culture.
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