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  #1  
Old 03-02-2019, 09:13 PM
callednchosen1 callednchosen1 is offline
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Divorce and remarriage

Marriage in the church

One spouse was unfaithful through (online) pornography (wonder what else although claims made there was nothing else with anyone - the spouse spent time traveling/visiting several times annually with old friends from the world)

Other spouse stayed faithful for 19 yrs though the disintegration came within the first year, and later years the offending spouse stated that God would have to send them to hell about the pornography because they would never give it up!

Marriage continued to disintegrate to separation (lots of emotional/verbal abuse, aggression toward children, disregard in the marriage bed for consideration of dislikes), and backsliding to alcohol and over-buying things in spite of marriage friction on it

Separation for four years, continued abuse, and was never reconstructed to a marriage

Divorce filed by spouse who had been using pornography

That spouse remarried (since the other party was not willing to reconcile)

Is the spouse left unmarried able to marry <<< this spouse was not unfaithful?
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  #2  
Old 03-02-2019, 09:14 PM
callednchosen1 callednchosen1 is offline
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Re: Divorce and remarriage

Bit more info:

Spouse that went and remarried has rededicated (maybe) and continues to preach the apostolic message elsewhere

(FYI: Kids are devastated and have problems believing to salvation and none walk with God now. Please pray - thank you!)
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  #3  
Old 03-02-2019, 09:22 PM
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Esaias Esaias is offline
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Re: Divorce and remarriage

Quote:
Originally Posted by callednchosen1 View Post
Bit more info:

Spouse that went and remarried has rededicated (maybe) and continues to preach the apostolic message elsewhere

(FYI: Kids are devastated and have problems believing to salvation and none walk with God now. Please pray - thank you!)
What do you mean continues to preach? Is this a preacher, elder, overseer, minister, evangelist, "prophet", etc? Or do you mean that this person just witnesses everywhere they go?
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  #4  
Old 03-03-2019, 05:56 AM
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jediwill83 jediwill83 is offline
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Re: Divorce and remarriage

Quote:
Originally Posted by callednchosen1 View Post
Marriage in the church

One spouse was unfaithful through (online) pornography (wonder what else although claims made there was nothing else with anyone - the spouse spent time traveling/visiting several times annually with old friends from the world)

Other spouse stayed faithful for 19 yrs though the disintegration came within the first year, and later years the offending spouse stated that God would have to send them to hell about the pornography because they would never give it up!

Marriage continued to disintegrate to separation (lots of emotional/verbal abuse, aggression toward children, disregard in the marriage bed for consideration of dislikes), and backsliding to alcohol and over-buying things in spite of marriage friction on it

Separation for four years, continued abuse, and was never reconstructed to a marriage

Divorce filed by spouse who had been using pornography

That spouse remarried (since the other party was not willing to reconcile)

Is the spouse left unmarried able to marry <<< this spouse was not unfaithful?

Love keeps no record of wrongs.


Lets start with that.


You're trying to go on a forum and condense nigh near 20 years of a dysfunctional sounding relationship with many complications and hanging it all on the question of whether the "innocent" spouse can marry.


This kind of thing...its never just about one persons porn addiction.


There are always deeper issues at work.



God is not taking sides in this other than a desire that those that are in sin and bondage be reconciled back to Him.
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  #5  
Old 03-03-2019, 03:59 PM
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Michael The Disciple Michael The Disciple is offline
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Re: Divorce and remarriage

Quote:
Originally Posted by callednchosen1 View Post
Marriage in the church

One spouse was unfaithful through (online) pornography (wonder what else although claims made there was nothing else with anyone - the spouse spent time traveling/visiting several times annually with old friends from the world)

Other spouse stayed faithful for 19 yrs though the disintegration came within the first year, and later years the offending spouse stated that God would have to send them to hell about the pornography because they would never give it up!

Marriage continued to disintegrate to separation (lots of emotional/verbal abuse, aggression toward children, disregard in the marriage bed for consideration of dislikes), and backsliding to alcohol and over-buying things in spite of marriage friction on it

Separation for four years, continued abuse, and was never reconstructed to a marriage

Divorce filed by spouse who had been using pornography

That spouse remarried (since the other party was not willing to reconcile)

Is the spouse left unmarried able to marry <<< this spouse was not unfaithful?
Clear cut case according to Jesus:

Matt 19:9

9And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.

The innocent party can marry again. The guilty party may not.
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  #6  
Old 03-04-2019, 12:47 AM
Steven Avery Steven Avery is offline
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covenent spouses, "divorce" leading to "remarriage

We have discussed this before, and it is hard to have edifying discussion.

The fornication "exception clause" is specifically not adultery, thus the strong case is made that it has a more specific reference involving unmarried / betrothals, similar to the questions around Joseph and Mary.

Overall, I suggest seeking out "marriage permanence" teaching. The real stuff. Old time Mennonite, and Holiness. Then compare with the more common, liberal, "your ok if you are not the guilty party, it is dissolved, move on, find a newbie" teaching of convenience, which can depart from the teaching of Jesus.

(Rule of thumb: the other side is the guilty party, or you can find ways to allow both sides to start with their new spouses.)

My belief is that the adulteration of the marriage covenant has led to a weakening of faith and the move of the Holy Spirit, and churches going downhill. Even the community I was involved in decided to "ok" a remarriage or two of an elder who had, before God, a living spouse, "divorced" only in the eyes of men. Awkward.

If you do not have a conviction, try to make sure you have gotten the best presentations from opposite sides. Be cautious about facile answers.

Then prayerfully reflect and consider.

Steven

Last edited by Steven Avery; 03-04-2019 at 01:30 AM.
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  #7  
Old 03-28-2019, 08:06 AM
peter83 peter83 is offline
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Re: Divorce and remarriage

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple View Post
Clear cut case according to Jesus:

Matt 19:9

9And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.

The innocent party can marry again. The guilty party may not.
Fornication = sexual sin out of marriage, single persons can do fornication
Adultery =Sexual sin whithine marriage, whaen one of the couple leaves the other member to marry an other, or if they broke up and then marry an other, or when one of the two having sex with an other ,then is called adultery.

So only if there is FORNICATION (premarital, or unlawful relationship they can and must brake it up and then if they repent they can avtually mary ,because they were never again married) Otherwise if they are not in fornication and are properly married: they can divorce but remain unmarried!
10 And unto the married I command, yet not I, but the Lord, Let not the wife depart from her husband: 11 But and if she depart, let her remain unmarried, or be reconciled to her husband: and let not the husband put away his wife.

The wife is bound by the law as long as her husband liveth; but if her husband be dead, she is at liberty to be married to whom she will; only in the Lord.
For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband. 3 So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.

Now look what is adultery and what Matthew spoke to the Jews!
-First keep in mind that Jwes asked if there was divorce primitive for any reason. Adultery was not considered a reason to divorce and remarry because adultery was punished by DEATH!
-Second see that the fornication is a separate and different act (sin) than adultry:Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind
19 For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies:


and so third and last look why marriage is the solution for fornication and not that fornication the exception for adultery:. 2 Nevertheless, to avoid fornication, let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband.
So my Apostolic Pentecostal Oneness friend and brother Michael , to avoid fornication ,which is every unlawful relationship ,out of marriage Paul suggest Marriage. But except be for the reason of fornication no man had the right to divorce his wife and if that happen, let them be UNMARRIED or? Or reconciled to her ex-wife.

Also keep in mind that the marriage is so holy because reflects the relationship between Jesus and his Wife (Church). Jesus has one and only Church! So the man "love your wife as th Lord loves the Church"
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  #8  
Old 03-18-2019, 07:52 PM
coksiw coksiw is offline
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Re: Divorce and remarriage

OP,
There are different views about this topic. It is very difficult. I feel so sorry for those people and the consequences on those kids. Pretty devastating.
I don’t think a forum is an appropriate place to talk about this issue. There are a lot of variables involved. In this case, it may be best to look for counseling from the Pastor or an apostolic marriage counselor. Looking for God’s direction is the best.
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Old 03-18-2019, 10:13 PM
Steven Avery Steven Avery is offline
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pastors and marriage counselors?

Quote:
Originally Posted by coksiw View Post
OP,
There are different views about this topic. It is very difficult. I feel so sorry for those people and the consequences on those kids. Pretty devastating.
I don’t think a forum is an appropriate place to talk about this issue. There are a lot of variables involved. In this case, it may be best to look for counseling from the Pastor or an apostolic marriage counselor. Looking for God’s direction is the best.
Pastors and marriage counselors in these years are generally excuse-minded, in terms of the issue of the marriage permanence doctrinal consistency idea. They often have an underlying current of not wanting to offend members and potential members with a hard word.

And I do agree that we should be ultra-cautious about saying:
"Brother A, Sister B, you should do do this."

It is unlikely that we even have all the information accurately. We may not even have the right information as to who is the person's covenant spouse (ie. those in the marriage permanence movement who believe there is one covenant spouse.)

Last edited by Steven Avery; 03-18-2019 at 10:16 PM.
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Old 03-19-2019, 12:10 PM
coksiw coksiw is offline
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Re: pastors and marriage counselors?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steven Avery View Post
Pastors and marriage counselors in these years are generally excuse-minded, in terms of the issue of the marriage permanence doctrinal consistency idea. They often have an underlying current of not wanting to offend members and potential members with a hard word.

And I do agree that we should be ultra-cautious about saying:
"Brother A, Sister B, you should do do this."

It is unlikely that we even have all the information accurately. We may not even have the right information as to who is the person's covenant spouse (ie. those in the marriage permanence movement who believe there is one covenant spouse.)
There are two camps regarding the "put away" and "divorce"and "divorce writ" what it actually meant in the context of the original listener. They both have plenty of arguments to defend their position. I think in situations like this which are already hard emotionally the best is to look for local counseling, and prayer. I'm 100% sure if you look for God's guidance in prayer he won't let you down.
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