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  #61  
Old 12-03-2019, 12:37 PM
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Re: Thoughts on what brings God's blessings



You will eat, bye and bye,
In that glorious land above the sky;
Work and pray, live on hay,
You’ll get pie in the sky when you die.

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  #62  
Old 12-03-2019, 01:30 PM
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Re: Thoughts on what brings God's blessings

Quote:
Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa View Post
Sure sounds like it.

Jesus tells the woman caught in adultery go sin no more. The healed blind man to go sin no more unless something worse happens. John tells his students that if they sin they are of Satan. But Jesus or any of the apostles then say that free will ends with a glorified body? People look at heaven being sinless and God being sinless, and then say that our own death, burial, and resurrection transform us into a new creature unable to ever sin. Yet the New Testament stresses that we are to be free from sin, living overcoming lives, being perfect as God is perfect, being as righteous and pure as Jesus. All these things possible now. Jesus died, Jesus was buried, Jesus resurrected, and we are to abide in Him. You can’t be abiding in Him, and then at some later date get some jump start to make you sinless in order to live in heaven. We just don’t have a logical outline where that is taught. You can’t be part of the body, and be part of the harlot. Sweet water doesn’t come out of a cess pool. That is the New Testament teaching. Not waiting for pie in the sky by and by.
The Roman church teaches you can't get free from sin now in this lufe, you have to die first and then you get purged in Purgatory, then you get into heaven. This "you get sanctified after death" thing sounds like a short version of purgatory.

But then, I'm not catholic so naturally I don't buy it.
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  #63  
Old 12-03-2019, 02:18 PM
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Re: Thoughts on what brings God's blessings

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The big difference is we wont even have the ability to sin, we will be in a glorified state.
What happened to the angels how lost their first estate?
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  #64  
Old 12-03-2019, 02:21 PM
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Re: Thoughts on what brings God's blessings

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I was referring to when one does they are in a glorified state as he is making the ability to sin impossible when in heaven. If you dont believe that, which in my opinion os biblically clear, I dont know what else to say.
I do not believe that. No sin is in heaven, but before God takes us there, he ensured that this would remain the case.

He left us in this sin-ridden world after he saved us. We are bombarded with temptations all the time, and we learn to overcome in time. And after having done all to resist sin and learn to overcome it, and having been blasted with it on a daily basis from the world and the devil, it's a pretty good scenario that those who make it will not sin later. But the idea that we cannot sin in heaven is not biblical. Angels fell due to sin.
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  #65  
Old 12-03-2019, 03:53 PM
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Re: Thoughts on what brings God's blessings

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What happened to the angels how lost their first estate?
Ouch!!!!
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  #66  
Old 12-03-2019, 03:55 PM
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Re: Thoughts on what brings God's blessings

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Originally Posted by mfblume View Post
I do not believe that. No sin is in heaven, but before God takes us there, he ensured that this would remain the case.

He left us in this sin-ridden world after he saved us. We are bombarded with temptations all the time, and we learn to overcome in time. And after having done all to resist sin and learn to overcome it, and having been blasted with it on a daily basis from the world and the devil, it's a pretty good scenario that those who make it will not sin later. But the idea that we cannot sin in heaven is not biblical. Angels fell due to sin.
Very good point, which many refuse to deal with.
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  #67  
Old 12-03-2019, 04:00 PM
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Re: Thoughts on what brings God's blessings

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Originally Posted by Esaias View Post
The Roman church teaches you can't get free from sin now in this lufe, you have to die first and then you get purged in Purgatory, then you get into heaven. This "you get sanctified after death" thing sounds like a short version of purgatory.

But then, I'm not catholic so naturally I don't buy it.
Good post

Baptists, Catholics, and Presbyterians believe you are saved by your own death, burial, and resurrection.
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  #68  
Old 12-03-2019, 06:02 PM
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Re: Thoughts on what brings God's blessings

I think people are under the impression that when they are resurrected into heaven, they are resurrected without the law of sin in their members (part of what it means to be glorified), and so, as formerly wretched men that they were, they are now saved from such death.

And then, without such a law in their members, and without a tempter or corrupted flesh to draw them away by their own lusts, they are naturally, finally free from the law of sin and death. So, if the last enemy to be defeated is death, and death is the wages of sin, and those who have overcome and been faithful to the end, are ushered into everlasting joy in the heavens, they naturally assume that their eternal life then means they cannot die, and if they cannot die, then there is no more wages of sin, which indicates no more sin.

In this scenario, it's not a matter of free will or not, but rather a will that has been freely submitted to the Lord for all time. Hence why the second death has no power over them.
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  #69  
Old 12-03-2019, 06:27 PM
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Re: Thoughts on what brings God's blessings

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Originally Posted by votivesoul View Post
I think people are under the impression that when they are resurrected into heaven, they are resurrected without the law of sin in their members (part of what it means to be glorified), and so, as formerly wretched men that they were, they are now saved from such death.

And then, without such a law in their members, and without a tempter or corrupted flesh to draw them away by their own lusts, they are naturally, finally free from the law of sin and death. So, if the last enemy to be defeated is death, and death is the wages of sin, and those who have overcome and been faithful to the end, are ushered into everlasting joy in the heavens, they naturally assume that their eternal life then means they cannot die, and if they cannot die, then there is no more wages of sin, which indicates no more sin.

In this scenario, it's not a matter of free will or not, but rather a will that has been freely submitted to the Lord for all time. Hence why the second death has no power over them.
Physically dying does not free anyone from the law of sin and death:

For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.
Romans:8:2
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  #70  
Old 12-03-2019, 06:27 PM
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Re: Thoughts on what brings God's blessings

Quote:
Originally Posted by votivesoul View Post
I think people are under the impression that when they are resurrected into heaven, they are resurrected without the law of sin in their members (part of what it means to be glorified), and so, as formerly wretched men that they were, they are now saved from such death.

And then, without such a law in their members, and without a tempter or corrupted flesh to draw them away by their own lusts, they are naturally, finally free from the law of sin and death. So, if the last enemy to be defeated is death, and death is the wages of sin, and those who have overcome and been faithful to the end, are ushered into everlasting joy in the heavens, they naturally assume that their eternal life then means they cannot die, and if they cannot die, then there is no more wages of sin, which indicates no more sin.

In this scenario, it's not a matter of free will or not, but rather a will that has been freely submitted to the Lord for all time. Hence why the second death has no power over them.
Good points!
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