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  #71  
Old 08-26-2009, 06:49 PM
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Re: GNCM Conference @ Christ Church Nashville

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Originally Posted by Light View Post
So you don't believe God is able to cause a person with no tongue to audiably speak in the Spirit.
Do you even believe he made a donkey speak?

It never ceases to amaze me the limits people who claim to be apostolic put on God.

I'm sorry but if a person does not speak in tongues they have not received the Holy Ghost.
It doesn't matter what I believe. I sat there and watched her and prayed with her and her family. "God" did NOT cause anything "audible" to come from beneath the tubes and the bandages at all. Not that night nor in the weeks and months that followed until her death.

That's what God did when He graciously saved her that night.

And YOU! For being so dense that your brain has collapsed into a blackhole - YOU win the coveted LUNKHEAD Award!!!




Last edited by pelathais; 08-26-2009 at 06:56 PM.
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  #72  
Old 08-26-2009, 07:01 PM
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Re: GNCM Conference @ Christ Church Nashville

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Originally Posted by Steve Epley View Post
I have seen and heard the deaf recieve the HGB. This is an old Baptist & COC reasoning some on here have more in common with them then the Apostolic Church.
coadie asked earlier - did their "speaking in tongues" after receiving the baptism of the Holy Ghost sound any different than their vocalizations BEFORE receiving the baptism of the Holy Ghost?

I thought that was a pretty good question. I have to admit, from the groups of people that I've prayed with - I couldn't really tell the difference in "speech" or vocalization between BEFORE and AFTER.

But AFTER, you really could tell that something had happened with these people. It's just that "speaking in tongues" was not the "evidence."

I'm curious, from your ministry have you actually been able to discernably tell when "speaking in tongues" started while praying with the deaf and "dumb?"
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  #73  
Old 09-02-2009, 09:47 AM
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Re: GNCM Conference @ Christ Church Nashville

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Originally Posted by pelathais View Post
coadie asked earlier - did their "speaking in tongues" after receiving the baptism of the Holy Ghost sound any different than their vocalizations BEFORE receiving the baptism of the Holy Ghost?

I thought that was a pretty good question. I have to admit, from the groups of people that I've prayed with - I couldn't really tell the difference in "speech" or vocalization between BEFORE and AFTER.

But AFTER, you really could tell that something had happened with these people. It's just that "speaking in tongues" was not the "evidence."

I'm curious, from your ministry have you actually been able to discernably tell when "speaking in tongues" started while praying with the deaf and "dumb?"
I think this would be very difficult to discern. I mean wouldn't their lifestyle be a better indicator of whether or not they have received the HG or not?

And if there was no lifestyle change, then what good did the tongues do? That has always been my contention. I think many "apostolics" are too quick to proclaim "salvation" upon an utterance than a changed life.
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  #74  
Old 09-02-2009, 09:51 AM
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Re: GNCM Conference @ Christ Church Nashville

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Originally Posted by ManOfWord View Post
I think this would be very difficult to discern. I mean wouldn't their lifestyle be a better indicator of whether or not they have received the HG or not?

And if there was no lifestyle change, then what good did the tongues do? That has always been my contention. I think many "apostolics" are too quick to proclaim "salvation" upon an utterance than a changed life.
So Peter was mistaken (Acts 10:45-46) and should have waited maybe a year to testify they had recieved the Holy Ghost?
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  #75  
Old 09-02-2009, 02:36 PM
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Re: GNCM Conference @ Christ Church Nashville

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Originally Posted by Steve Epley View Post
So Peter was mistaken (Acts 10:45-46) and should have waited maybe a year to testify they had recieved the Holy Ghost?
Put Acts 10 in context: The church had just been born. It began at Jerusalem, spread to Judea, on to Samaria and now to the uttermost (the Gentiles). Peter was as hard headed as many today and had to see a supernatural sign to believe that the Gentiles had been accepted by God.

Some believe that the sign of tongues (as Paul spoke 1 Cor 14) is a sign to those who do not believe, and apparently Peter needed that sign to believe because he said, "Can anyone prevent these people from being baptized with water? They have received the Holy Spirit just as we have." This was a sign the Peter and the other circumsized believers needed.

HEre is a question for you: Is there a record anywhere the Holy Spirit is the subject of teaching and speaking in tongues is mentioned as the evidence of being filled with the Holy Spirit? I have searched and the only place where I find a teaching on the HOly Spirit that involves speaking in tongues is where Paul is asking if all speak in tongues inthe Corinthians passage.

The fact is if God had intended the initial evidence doctrine to be taught he would have plainly said, "Speaking in tongues is the evidence of being baptized in the Holy Spirit." The fact that there is no verbage like that in all of the Bible we have to include that God himself did not think it was important as some of us do.

Just my opinion...
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  #76  
Old 09-02-2009, 02:40 PM
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Re: GNCM Conference @ Christ Church Nashville

They don't like that way of thinking on here Hope preacher...lol
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  #77  
Old 09-02-2009, 02:41 PM
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Re: GNCM Conference @ Christ Church Nashville

I think someone has said the same exact thing before..LOL
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  #78  
Old 09-02-2009, 02:41 PM
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Re: GNCM Conference @ Christ Church Nashville

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Originally Posted by pelathais View Post
coadie asked earlier - did their "speaking in tongues" after receiving the baptism of the Holy Ghost sound any different than their vocalizations BEFORE receiving the baptism of the Holy Ghost?

I thought that was a pretty good question. I have to admit, from the groups of people that I've prayed with - I couldn't really tell the difference in "speech" or vocalization between BEFORE and AFTER.

But AFTER, you really could tell that something had happened with these people. It's just that "speaking in tongues" was not the "evidence."

I'm curious, from your ministry have you actually been able to discernably tell when "speaking in tongues" started while praying with the deaf and "dumb?"
My wife is deaf and she says she has spoken in tongues before. I don't know how she knows what it is because she can't hear anyone speak in tongues. Still, she doesn't believe that speaking in tongues is receiving the Holy Ghost. Deaf folks are way more skeptical than most people and if something doesn't make sense to them then you can't convince them even if it is right.
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  #79  
Old 09-02-2009, 05:04 PM
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Re: GNCM Conference @ Christ Church Nashville

If we believe that speaking in tongues is a gift from God and it is a spiritual experience, then is it too much of a stretch to believe that a person can worship in the spirit without vocalizing and still be speaking in tongues? Sounds right to me....
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  #80  
Old 09-02-2009, 05:51 PM
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Re: GNCM Conference @ Christ Church Nashville

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hope Preacher View Post
Put Acts 10 in context: The church had just been born. It began at Jerusalem, spread to Judea, on to Samaria and now to the uttermost (the Gentiles). Peter was as hard headed as many today and had to see a supernatural sign to believe that the Gentiles had been accepted by God.

Some believe that the sign of tongues (as Paul spoke 1 Cor 14) is a sign to those who do not believe, and apparently Peter needed that sign to believe because he said, "Can anyone prevent these people from being baptized with water? They have received the Holy Spirit just as we have." This was a sign the Peter and the other circumsized believers needed.

HEre is a question for you: Is there a record anywhere the Holy Spirit is the subject of teaching and speaking in tongues is mentioned as the evidence of being filled with the Holy Spirit? I have searched and the only place where I find a teaching on the HOly Spirit that involves speaking in tongues is where Paul is asking if all speak in tongues inthe Corinthians passage.

The fact is if God had intended the initial evidence doctrine to be taught he would have plainly said, "Speaking in tongues is the evidence of being baptized in the Holy Spirit." The fact that there is no verbage like that in all of the Bible we have to include that God himself did not think it was important as some of us do.

Just my opinion...
Acts 10:45-46(read it and weep)....because that on the Gentiles ALSO was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost. FOR THEY HEARD THEM SPEAK WITH TONGUES.
Acts 11:15.....and as I began to speak , the Holy Ghost fell on them. AS ON US AT THE BEGINNING.......17......Forasmuch then as God gave them THE LIKE GIFT.
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