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  #101  
Old 10-18-2020, 11:35 PM
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Evang.Benincasa Evang.Benincasa is offline
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Re: Have you ever lost confidence in leadership?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tithesmeister View Post
The first mention of tithing in this thread was made by none other than EB. Followed closely by Nicodemus, who disagrees that I have a tithing problem. He instead diagnosed me with an authority problem. Now while EB and Nicodemus may disagree with my “problem” they can certainly get around their differences.
Because they believe in the “enemies enemy is my friend” thing.
The enemy of my enemy is my friend? Nostradamus1919 has no problems with me, nor do I have any with him. We met years ago in person. Timewaster, as per usual you are again clueless. Are you now taking over for the reprobate Sean who use to post here, or teary eyed pot smoker Aquila?
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Originally Posted by Tithesmeister View Post
I said that you were the first to bring up tithing IN THIS THREAD. I told the truth. Your first mention of the tithe was post 27. Twenty three posts later in #50 I responded with this.
You mean when I asked you the yes or no question? The question you never answered? Then you started to do all this baloney for how many posts?

Teninchnecksize, let me tell you again. Your name on this forum is Tithemister, you predominantly harp on tithing. Now, in this thread, we find that you don't like preachers. But you want to preach to us? Good times!


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Originally Posted by Tithesmeister View Post
“Thank God I don’t have tithe problems. And thank God I don’t have pastor problems either. I am blessed beyond measure in those departments. And just for the record, you are the one bringing up tithes. Why do you always do that? Do you have issues?”
Do I have a nick on the forum that has the word TITHES in it? Do I want to debate people on TITHES the minute anyone mentions 10 percent! You ecclesiastical gnome.


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Originally Posted by Tithesmeister View Post
It really seems that you are obsessed with the tithing issue brother. Maybe you should see a shrink.
Here we go. What forum posters are famous for...pyschological projection. Ok, I post under my name. You post a name which is meant to be sarcasm, TITHE MISTER. Physician, heal thyself!


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Originally Posted by Tithesmeister View Post
I recommend that you repent. It beats the shrink thing every time.
You must know, because you speak as one with authority on the subject of repenting and psychiatric treatment. Again, physician heal thyself.



Hey, I heard some of you are posting under other aliases? Maybe you should create Pastorhater. Preacherkiller, or Elderassassin?

Good grief
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  #102  
Old 10-19-2020, 06:24 AM
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Re: Have you ever lost confidence in leadership?

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Originally Posted by Jito463 View Post
Funny, we still have those things.
Ours did too until about 2 weeks ago.
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  #103  
Old 10-19-2020, 08:06 AM
Originalist Originalist is offline
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Re: Have you ever lost confidence in leadership?

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Originally Posted by Truthseeker View Post
Can you explain what you mean?
During my "Apostolic in Exile" sojourn among the Southern Baptists, I have become an admirer of their form of government. The UPCI boasts of being a union of sovereign churches, but in reality, it is often is a union of pastoral kingdoms where the members have little to no say.

In the SBC, each church indeed is sovereign with a form of government that mirrors that of the USA in many respects. Everyone, including the Pastor, must adhere to the Constitution of the local assembly. There is a clear separation of powers. The Pastor acts as the President and can only perform those duties delegated to him by the Constitution. The Deacons serve as the Senate while the whole Congregation serves as the "second chamber," voting on key issues like the church budget and the hiring of new staff members. Deacon boards or specially appointed committees give recommendations, but the people have the final say. Yet, the people of the church cannot cast a vote that violates the church Constitution. That would require a Constitutional amendment which also comes about through a specific constitutional process.

All in all, the system works well. Oh, you have extreme cases where a pastor with a charismatic personality can convince the other branches to not perform their designated duties, allowing him to be a quasi-dictaror. Or a deacon board controlled by prominent families might try to treat a pastor like just an employee of the church, hindering him from performing his constitutional duties. But overall the system works well. Giving the people a format to ask questions and give opinions has a good effect.
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  #104  
Old 10-19-2020, 10:10 AM
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Re: Have you ever lost confidence in leadership?

Hmm. In the 1st church I attended everyone 18+ who took a certain class was made a voting member. I didn’t even take the class and they were like, “You’re 18, you can vote.”

What I noticed is that people didn’t want to vote for anything other than what the pastor suggested. So, given the power to change things- no one wanted to go against the man-of-Gawwd.
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  #105  
Old 10-19-2020, 11:32 AM
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Evang.Benincasa Evang.Benincasa is offline
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Re: Have you ever lost confidence in leadership?

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Originally Posted by Originalist View Post
During my "Apostolic in Exile" sojourn among the Southern Baptists, I have become an admirer of their form of government. The UPCI boasts of being a union of sovereign churches, but in reality, it is often is a union of pastoral kingdoms where the members have little to no say.

In the SBC, each church indeed is sovereign with a form of government that mirrors that of the USA in many respects. Everyone, including the Pastor, must adhere to the Constitution of the local assembly. There is a clear separation of powers. The Pastor acts as the President and can only perform those duties delegated to him by the Constitution. The Deacons serve as the Senate while the whole Congregation serves as the "second chamber," voting on key issues like the church budget and the hiring of new staff members. Deacon boards or specially appointed committees give recommendations, but the people have the final say. Yet, the people of the church cannot cast a vote that violates the church Constitution. That would require a Constitutional amendment which also comes about through a specific constitutional process.

All in all, the system works well. Oh, you have extreme cases where a pastor with a charismatic personality can convince the other branches to not perform their designated duties, allowing him to be a quasi-dictator. Or a deacon board controlled by prominent families might try to treat a pastor like just an employee of the church, hindering him from performing his constitutional duties. But overall the system works well. Giving the people a format to ask questions and give opinions has a good effect.
UPCI is all a group of ministers some who follow the plan book, some who don't. Some who are in lock step, and others who are not. The UPCI cannot be painted with a broad brush by any means.

No church is controlled by one man, it takes an effort of the most important factor. That is the FOLLOWERS. Without that important component you have no ecclesiastical oligarchy.
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  #106  
Old 10-19-2020, 12:33 PM
Originalist Originalist is offline
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Re: Have you ever lost confidence in leadership?

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Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa View Post
UPCI is all a group of ministers some who follow the plan book, some who don't. Some who are in lock step, and others who are not. The UPCI cannot be painted with a broad brush by any means.

No church is controlled by one man, it takes an effort of the most important factor. That is the FOLLOWERS. Without that important component you have no ecclesiastical oligarchy.
Well said. Some Saints love it so.
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  #107  
Old 10-19-2020, 12:42 PM
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Re: Have you ever lost confidence in leadership?

And what does the Scripture say about church government? (Or is that even an option these days?)
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  #108  
Old 10-19-2020, 02:49 PM
Originalist Originalist is offline
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Re: Have you ever lost confidence in leadership?

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Originally Posted by Esaias View Post
And what does the Scripture say about church government? (Or is that even an option these days?)
Not much.
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  #109  
Old 10-19-2020, 03:00 PM
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Re: Have you ever lost confidence in leadership?

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Not much.
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  #110  
Old 10-19-2020, 04:17 PM
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Re: Have you ever lost confidence in leadership?

Church government doesn't work with the Ecclesiastical Robinson Crusoes. An individual cannot walk away from the apostles, evenaglists, prophets, and pastor teachers, then claim they are still in the Body of Christ. Lone Ranger Apostolic aren't found in the New Testament.
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