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  #141  
Old 06-13-2007, 07:22 AM
Maple Leaf Maple Leaf is offline
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Holiness Preaching in New Brunswick

I have had opportunity to spend time with saints from the early days of the Full Gospel work in the city of Saint John. It was not unheard of for the "Sisters" to tell a lady, who showed up with pants on, to go home and get dressed properly to attend church. I have heard Bro. AWP, a son of that assembly, preach against Pentecostals going bowling. The last conversation I had with another senior son of that assembly, who is a former superintendent of the PAOC, he was decrying the lack of standards among that group.

I talked with a lady who was the youth leader in the Fredericton church, in the thirties, who was criticized for taking the youth skating on the river.

In the UPC assembly where I spent my teenage years, which was pastored by a graduate of the Emmauel Bible School in Newcastle Bridge, everything was a Heaven or hell issue.

In conversation with another graduate of that school, a respected Bible Teacher, the following was used as an example of extreme eternal security. He had heard a western preacher say that he believed that, if the rapture took place while he was in a movie theatre, there would be holes in the ceiling where the believers went through. The gist of the New Brunswick preacher's comments was that only someone who was eternal security could believe that you could go in the rapture from a movie theatre.

My children have a heritage of Pentecost in New Brunswick that goes back to the mid twenties. They have ancestors who wore hats and close toed shoes under the Ralston's ministry; were preached out of the roller skating rinks by Fredericton preachers; were the focus of Bro. Paul M's confrontational style of holiness preaching; assisted Bro. Clemmie Hyde in taking the Gospel tent to new communities along the Miramichi; lived in the home of CB Dudley; got a good dose of "black and white" religion from Bro. S. Steeves; and, at one point or the other, lived every standard imaginable.

I have talked to many elders who were among the first wave of Pentecostals in New Brunswick, and have had first hand witness that the Pentecostals didn't bring standards to New Brunswick. There were already Baptists that didn't cut their hair or wear pants when the holy rollers arrived. The UPC has held on to the traditions longer than the other groups, but they didn't start them.

Hey Birdie! It's time to come out and sing your song; who were the elders who got yoked into standards by the UPC? I've heard many of the New Brunswick pioneers preach, and they sure convinced me that they believed holiness standards.
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  #142  
Old 06-13-2007, 08:56 AM
Thumper Thumper is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TrueNorth View Post
The UPC of Canada celebrates its 20th anniversary this year. It was set up due to a problem that arose with sending funds to the US that came to light with an audit that took place in Nova Scotia. In order to send funds into the US it was necessary to set up a joint venture agreement between the newly formed UPCC and the UPCI. This satisfied Revenue Canada's concerns about charities sending money out of the country.
It was never intended by its framers to be a separate ministerial or church organization, the intention was a financial framework to facilitate missions etc.
The movement to transform UPCC into a sister organization seems to me to have its epicentre in New West, enough said?
Now for the offerings question. With all of the major offerings 40 or 50%depending on which offering it is stays in the local district to fund the work of the district departments. The rest is sent to the UPCC - which forwards the funds to St. Louis - except for Christmas for Christ which is kept in Canada and along with extra funds from the USA is used to finance Home Missionaries in Canada.
Usually money is not given to local assemblies other than to Home Missions type situations.
Most district type events are subsidized by the Districts portion of the major offerings.

So, now you know.
Thanks for the update TN. If New Westminster is the Epicentre then I will definately be able to get some up to date information to post. That is not really surprising to hear as PVR has always had a really heavy hand when it came to this kind of thing. He used to push a "DS is the pastor of the pastors" doctrine. I can't really say it was accepted by others in the district but it certainly didn't stop him from trying.
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  #143  
Old 06-13-2007, 08:59 AM
Thumper Thumper is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maple Leaf View Post
I have had opportunity to spend time with saints from the early days of the Full Gospel work in the city of Saint John. It was not unheard of for the "Sisters" to tell a lady, who showed up with pants on, to go home and get dressed properly to attend church. I have heard Bro. AWP, a son of that assembly, preach against Pentecostals going bowling. The last conversation I had with another senior son of that assembly, who is a former superintendent of the PAOC, he was decrying the lack of standards among that group.

I talked with a lady who was the youth leader in the Fredericton church, in the thirties, who was criticized for taking the youth skating on the river.

In the UPC assembly where I spent my teenage years, which was pastored by a graduate of the Emmauel Bible School in Newcastle Bridge, everything was a Heaven or hell issue.

In conversation with another graduate of that school, a respected Bible Teacher, the following was used as an example of extreme eternal security. He had heard a western preacher say that he believed that, if the rapture took place while he was in a movie theatre, there would be holes in the ceiling where the believers went through. The gist of the New Brunswick preacher's comments was that only someone who was eternal security could believe that you could go in the rapture from a movie theatre.

My children have a heritage of Pentecost in New Brunswick that goes back to the mid twenties. They have ancestors who wore hats and close toed shoes under the Ralston's ministry; were preached out of the roller skating rinks by Fredericton preachers; were the focus of Bro. Paul M's confrontational style of holiness preaching; assisted Bro. Clemmie Hyde in taking the Gospel tent to new communities along the Miramichi; lived in the home of CB Dudley; got a good dose of "black and white" religion from Bro. S. Steeves; and, at one point or the other, lived every standard imaginable.

I have talked to many elders who were among the first wave of Pentecostals in New Brunswick, and have had first hand witness that the Pentecostals didn't bring standards to New Brunswick. There were already Baptists that didn't cut their hair or wear pants when the holy rollers arrived. The UPC has held on to the traditions longer than the other groups, but they didn't start them.

Hey Birdie! It's time to come out and sing your song; who were the elders who got yoked into standards by the UPC? I've heard many of the New Brunswick pioneers preach, and they sure convinced me that they believed holiness standards.
Yeah but what do you know 80 years of history is nothing to some people
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  #144  
Old 06-13-2007, 09:03 AM
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Steve Epley Steve Epley is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maple Leaf View Post
I have had opportunity to spend time with saints from the early days of the Full Gospel work in the city of Saint John. It was not unheard of for the "Sisters" to tell a lady, who showed up with pants on, to go home and get dressed properly to attend church. I have heard Bro. AWP, a son of that assembly, preach against Pentecostals going bowling. The last conversation I had with another senior son of that assembly, who is a former superintendent of the PAOC, he was decrying the lack of standards among that group.

I talked with a lady who was the youth leader in the Fredericton church, in the thirties, who was criticized for taking the youth skating on the river.

In the UPC assembly where I spent my teenage years, which was pastored by a graduate of the Emmauel Bible School in Newcastle Bridge, everything was a Heaven or hell issue.

In conversation with another graduate of that school, a respected Bible Teacher, the following was used as an example of extreme eternal security. He had heard a western preacher say that he believed that, if the rapture took place while he was in a movie theatre, there would be holes in the ceiling where the believers went through. The gist of the New Brunswick preacher's comments was that only someone who was eternal security could believe that you could go in the rapture from a movie theatre.

My children have a heritage of Pentecost in New Brunswick that goes back to the mid twenties. They have ancestors who wore hats and close toed shoes under the Ralston's ministry; were preached out of the roller skating rinks by Fredericton preachers; were the focus of Bro. Paul M's confrontational style of holiness preaching; assisted Bro. Clemmie Hyde in taking the Gospel tent to new communities along the Miramichi; lived in the home of CB Dudley; got a good dose of "black and white" religion from Bro. S. Steeves; and, at one point or the other, lived every standard imaginable.

I have talked to many elders who were among the first wave of Pentecostals in New Brunswick, and have had first hand witness that the Pentecostals didn't bring standards to New Brunswick. There were already Baptists that didn't cut their hair or wear pants when the holy rollers arrived. The UPC has held on to the traditions longer than the other groups, but they didn't start them.

Hey Birdie! It's time to come out and sing your song; who were the elders who got yoked into standards by the UPC? I've heard many of the New Brunswick pioneers preach, and they sure convinced me that they believed holiness standards.
I heard a quite a bit about Ralston and Steeves. Thanks.
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  #145  
Old 06-13-2007, 10:32 AM
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Felicity Felicity is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Epley View Post
I heard a quite a bit about Ralston and Steeves. Thanks.
I never knew either of those men.
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  #146  
Old 06-13-2007, 10:33 AM
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Felicity Felicity is offline
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Originally Posted by Thumper View Post
Thanks for the update TN. If New Westminster is the Epicentre then I will definately be able to get some up to date information to post. That is not really surprising to hear as PVR has always had a really heavy hand when it came to this kind of thing. He used to push a "DS is the pastor of the pastors" doctrine. I can't really say it was accepted by others in the district but it certainly didn't stop him from trying.
I've heard personal testimonies about this. Seems like if you start attending that church, if you leave without the pastor's blessing you're excommunicated. Good heavens!!
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  #147  
Old 06-13-2007, 10:38 AM
TopDog TopDog is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Felicity View Post
I've heard personal testimonies about this. Seems like if you start attending that church, if you leave without the pastor's blessing you're excommunicated. Good heavens!!
I have both heard and observed the same thing......

I have close relatives in that church. My family was connected with it to some extent since Bro. West was pastor waaaaaaay back in the day......
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  #148  
Old 06-13-2007, 11:34 AM
Destiny2 Destiny2 is offline
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I grew up going to Emmanuel camp meetings in Minto each summer,Rev.S.Steeves was the leader.We female teenagers always had a hat to wear when we went to Bro.Ralstons church,we would never think about going to P.R .without a hat..........
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  #149  
Old 06-13-2007, 12:19 PM
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TRIPLE E TRIPLE E is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Destiny2 View Post
I grew up going to Emmanuel camp meetings in Minto each summer,Rev.S.Steeves was the leader.We female teenagers always had a hat to wear when we went to Bro.Ralstons church,we would never think about going to P.R .without a hat..........
My wife always wears a hat when visiting PR,out of respect not out of conviction.
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  #150  
Old 06-13-2007, 12:53 PM
Truly Blessed Truly Blessed is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maple Leaf View Post
I have had opportunity to spend time with saints from the early days of the Full Gospel work in the city of Saint John. It was not unheard of for the "Sisters" to tell a lady, who showed up with pants on, to go home and get dressed properly to attend church. I have heard Bro. AWP, a son of that assembly, preach against Pentecostals going bowling. The last conversation I had with another senior son of that assembly, who is a former superintendent of the PAOC, he was decrying the lack of standards among that group.

I talked with a lady who was the youth leader in the Fredericton church, in the thirties, who was criticized for taking the youth skating on the river.

In the UPC assembly where I spent my teenage years, which was pastored by a graduate of the Emmauel Bible School in Newcastle Bridge, everything was a Heaven or hell issue.

In conversation with another graduate of that school, a respected Bible Teacher, the following was used as an example of extreme eternal security. He had heard a western preacher say that he believed that, if the rapture took place while he was in a movie theatre, there would be holes in the ceiling where the believers went through. The gist of the New Brunswick preacher's comments was that only someone who was eternal security could believe that you could go in the rapture from a movie theatre.

My children have a heritage of Pentecost in New Brunswick that goes back to the mid twenties. They have ancestors who wore hats and close toed shoes under the Ralston's ministry; were preached out of the roller skating rinks by Fredericton preachers; were the focus of Bro. Paul M's confrontational style of holiness preaching; assisted Bro. Clemmie Hyde in taking the Gospel tent to new communities along the Miramichi; lived in the home of CB Dudley; got a good dose of "black and white" religion from Bro. S. Steeves; and, at one point or the other, lived every standard imaginable.

I have talked to many elders who were among the first wave of Pentecostals in New Brunswick, and have had first hand witness that the Pentecostals didn't bring standards to New Brunswick. There were already Baptists that didn't cut their hair or wear pants when the holy rollers arrived. The UPC has held on to the traditions longer than the other groups, but they didn't start them.

Hey Birdie! It's time to come out and sing your song; who were the elders who got yoked into standards by the UPC? I've heard many of the New Brunswick pioneers preach, and they sure convinced me that they believed holiness standards.
I agree with you ML that the standards for Christians in general in NB were most likely present prior to the formation of the UPC of NB. I know that there were many standard teachings that were nothing more than the personal convictions of some men who were able to popularize these into holiness issues, but at the same time, today it seems the pendulum has swung too far in the opposite direction to the point that many Christians have no convictions at all.
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