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View Poll Results: Is Satan (or the Devil) a Real Being
Yes 10 100.00%
No 0 0%
Other (Explain in post) 0 0%
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  #51  
Old 08-14-2018, 08:37 PM
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Michael The Disciple Michael The Disciple is offline
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Re: Is Satan (or the Devil) a Real Being?

So who is Jesus talking about here?

Luke 10:17-18

17And the seventy returned again with joy, saying, Lord, even the devils are subject unto us through thy name. 18And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.
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  #52  
Old 08-14-2018, 08:46 PM
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Esaias Esaias is offline
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Re: Is Satan (or the Devil) a Real Being?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple View Post
So who is Jesus talking about here?

Luke 10:17-18

17And the seventy returned again with joy, saying, Lord, even the devils are subject unto us through thy name. 18And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.
Should "satan" be defined by the Bible? Or by extra biblical traditions of men? Because Jesus did not define the term in that verse. I would suggest we let the Bible define the term.

Or, folks can import into the text whatever fancies they want.
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  #53  
Old 08-14-2018, 08:58 PM
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Michael The Disciple Michael The Disciple is offline
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Re: Is Satan (or the Devil) a Real Being?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Esaias View Post
Should "satan" be defined by the Bible? Or by extra biblical traditions of men? Because Jesus did not define the term in that verse. I would suggest we let the Bible define the term.

Or, folks can import into the text whatever fancies they want.
Or we could simply believe what Jesus Christ said in the verse. He saw satan FALL FROM HEAVEN.

Many times in scripture there is no need to try to find another meaning besides the obvious.
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  #54  
Old 08-14-2018, 09:05 PM
consapente89 consapente89 is offline
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Re: Is Satan (or the Devil) a Real Being?

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Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa View Post
No, that would be ignorance, due to not having all the information.
Stupid is sadly ingrained within a person. It ends up becoming part of their character. Until the misfortunate day, when it comes to full bloom. You can't reason with it, you can't debate with it, and you cannot educate it. The only hope it will ever have is peradventure, God having mercy on it, and like anything miraculous, it becomes reborn as a new creation. Which is as rare as a deadman coming back to life at a church service. Hence many are called and few are chosen.
That’s bleak!

Not sure what it has to do with the existence of a real devil...but whatever.
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  #55  
Old 08-14-2018, 09:56 PM
berkeley berkeley is offline
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Re: Is Satan (or the Devil) a Real Being?

E or EB,

What does the bible say about demons?
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  #56  
Old 08-14-2018, 10:14 PM
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Evang.Benincasa Evang.Benincasa is offline
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Re: Is Satan (or the Devil) a Real Being?

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Originally Posted by consapente89 View Post
That’s bleak!

Not sure what it has to do with the existence of a real devil...but whatever.
That's because you are not stupid.

So, go back to where I originally made my statement. It was to back up what Esaias said about most devils are the human kind. Which is true. Unregenerate man gives demons a run for their money. Don't you agree?
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  #57  
Old 08-14-2018, 10:17 PM
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Evang.Benincasa Evang.Benincasa is offline
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Re: Is Satan (or the Devil) a Real Being?

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Originally Posted by berkeley View Post
E or EB,

What does the bible say about demons?
Well, when you cast out one, that one may come back with 7 more wicked then himself. Reprobation is a bad deal.
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  #58  
Old 08-14-2018, 10:20 PM
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Evang.Benincasa Evang.Benincasa is offline
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Re: Is Satan (or the Devil) a Real Being?

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Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple View Post
Or we could simply believe what Jesus Christ said in the verse. He saw satan FALL FROM HEAVEN.

Many times in scripture there is no need to try to find another meaning besides the obvious.
Daniel 4:11, speaks of a king reaching the heavens but then getting cut down to the ground. I wonder what those First Century Christians were doing waiting for their KJVs to be printed?
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  #59  
Old 08-15-2018, 01:21 AM
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Esaias Esaias is offline
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Re: Is Satan (or the Devil) a Real Being?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple View Post
Or we could simply believe what Jesus Christ said in the verse. He saw satan FALL FROM HEAVEN.

Many times in scripture there is no need to try to find another meaning besides the obvious.
Luke 10:18 And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.
I believe exactly what He said, He saw Satan like lightning fall from heaven. Notice, He did not see Lucifer like lightning fall from heaven and become satan. The Hebrew word satan means "enemy, adversary". He saw the enemy like lightning fall from heaven. You have seen lightning, correct? You have seen it drop out of heaven to the ground, correct?

So He saw the enemy, just like a bolt of lightning fall from the sky (heaven means the sky, unless you think there are standard issue birds flitting around the throne room of God).

Let's look at the context:
Luke 10:17-20 And the seventy returned again with joy, saying, Lord, even the devils are subject unto us through thy name. (18) And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven. (19) Behold, I give unto you power to tread on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy: and nothing shall by any means hurt you. (20) Notwithstanding in this rejoice not, that the spirits are subject unto you; but rather rejoice, because your names are written in heaven.
So the disciples are able to cast out demons, and they are happy about it. And Jesus says "I saw the enemy like lightning fall from heaven. I give you power to walk on serpents and scorpions (is this literal?), and on ALL the power of the enemy, nothing can hurt you. But don't be happy about this. Instead, be happy your names are in the book of life."

So what is He saying? That an archangel named Lucifer fell out of the sky? Or that the enemy has fallen, suddenly and unexpectedly, and has no power to harm the Lord's disciples? (Wait, what happened to the disciples being capable of being possessed or oppressed or whatever by the demons?) The satan being referenced here is no heavenly archangel who got carried away with himself, but is the demons that were afflicting people. See here:
Matthew 12:24-28 But when the Pharisees heard it, they said, This fellow doth not cast out devils, but by Beelzebub the prince of the devils. (25) And Jesus knew their thoughts, and said unto them, Every kingdom divided against itself is brought to desolation; and every city or house divided against itself shall not stand: (26) And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand? (27) And if I by Beelzebub cast out devils, by whom do your children cast them out? therefore they shall be your judges. (28) But if I cast out devils by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God is come unto you.
Jesus clearly equated the demons with satan. Cast out demons, cast out satan. Accused of casting out demons by the power of a demon, calls it satan casting out satan. Satan, then, in these contexts, is clearly the demons. NOT A FALLEN ANGEL, or a "prince of demons" (since that title was given by the superstitious Pharisees to Beelzebub, formerly the baal-god of Ekron:
2 Kings 1:2 And Ahaziah fell down through a lattice in his upper chamber that was in Samaria, and was sick: and he sent messengers, and said unto them, Go, enquire of Baalzebub the god of Ekron whether I shall recover of this disease.
A previous Canaanite god of Ekron had become by the first century a "prince of the demons" according to Jewish folklore and fable.

But notice that Jesus equates the demons with satan. Casting out demons is casting out satan. Is satan omnipresent? does satan actually possess individual people? Can he possess more than one person at the same time? Apparently, ALL cases of demon possession are cases of satan possession, and ALL cases of casting out demons are cases of casting out SATAN.

Which clearly demonstrates that "satan" is a GENERIC TERM FOR A WHOLE CATEGORY OF THINGS, in this case, demons. All demons are collectively known as SATAN.

Ah, but who or what ELSE is known as satan?

Well, I'm not doing anyone's homework for them, so get busy.
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  #60  
Old 08-15-2018, 03:36 AM
berkeley berkeley is offline
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Re: Is Satan (or the Devil) a Real Being?

Good stuff here
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