Financial declaration?

[Nicodemus1968]

Originally Posted by Tithesmeister

Focus on the doctrine. Is it true? Is it apostolic? We are called apostolic, why?

What’s ironic is that you don’t teach tithing, but you teach 10%?

Isn’t there plenty of scripture about giving without having to go extra-Biblical and just make things up?

I did not accuse you of preaching tithe or hell. I’m glad you don’t. And I believe you don’t.

Speaking of irony though, you talk about the apostles forsaking all to follow Jesus. You actually kind of make my point there. I’m not noticing a lot of preachers doing that. I DO notice that a lot of preachers telling the saints that THEY should do it. Do as I say, not as I do sort of thing. It isn’t new. The Pharisees honed that skill two thousand years ago. Jesus was not impressed. He probably still isn’t.

So is this idea that preachers are on the take new? You haven’t noticed? Maybe it’s because you are one of them (preachers)? You don’t seem to know anyone that preaches that it’s tithe or hell. Do you believe Sister Amanah? Diakanos?
What about me? Do you think we’re making it up?

EB said he had never heard it. I posted Greg Riggen preaching a message where he says it is IMPOSSIBLE to be saved unless you tithe. I posted it two weeks or so ago. You said you would listen. Did he say what I said he did? Or did I make it up.

The problem is that you feel good about yourself because you aren’t that aggressive. But are you teaching truth? Or just a watered down version of the same lie he’s telling? It’s not benign. It’s extremely harmful.

Some people are supposed to receive help from church. But the church is too busy sending them to hell for NOT tithing.

What’s ironic is that you don’t teach tithing, but you teach 10%?

Because I believe thats a good guideline. I used that in my life for 17 years, and it blessed me. So, form my experience I will use that. I believe God gives me enough liberty to do that.

Paul did that...

1 Corinthians 7:6 KJVS
[6] But I speak this by permission, and not of commandment.

1 Corinthians 7:12 KJVS
[12] But to the rest speak I, not the Lord: If any brother hath a wife that believeth not, and she be pleased to dwell with him, let him not put her away.

The Lord has given me liberty to use what I feel as a guideline, why? Because it doesn't bear the saints down, I’m not using 10% as a way of control, or a way of manipulation.

So is this idea that preachers are on the take new? You haven’t noticed? Maybe it’s because you are one of them (preachers)? You don’t seem to know anyone that preaches that it’s tithe or hell. Do you believe Sister Amanah? Diakanos? What about me? Do you think we’re making it up?

I believe you & them. I know what the audio you posted said, do I agree with him, No I don’t. Do I agree with a Pastor that tells his church if you dont pay tithe your going to split hell wide open, No I dont. It also needs to be said that Preachers also pay 10% on the tithe they accept.

[coksiw]

Every time I see people saying, "I paid tithe all my life and was always blessed", this question comes to mind: "I'm sure they are hiding the complete truth", or "how can they be so blind to the reality?".

* Did you ever neglect your family by putting them in much debt because your lack of saving, or getting the house in the wrong neighborhood, or not saving for retirement contributing to your 401k and becoming a burden later to your kids or the church?
- This is in fact a commandment: neglecting your family is worse than a unbeliever

* Did you neglect your needed parents by not helping them financially (because you know, you are giving hundreds in tithing and little is left) ...while your other non-christian siblings did?
- Honor your parent, that is a commandment.

* Did you ever turn your back to church member's in need because you didn't have anything left after giving much in tithing?
- Should I quote John or James epistles?

Let's say you could afford all of that during your life time: tithing, and a decent house for your family, stay out of consumer debt, save a decent amount for retirement, and bless your parents so much. Do you realize how wealthy you are comparing with most of the people in the planet? Are you that wealthy because you tithe or because the education your parent invested in, and the fact that you live in a first world country full of opportunities and good salaries and affordable stuff?

The less you attribute your blessing to tithing, and the more you attribute it to the grace of God, the more you feel like giving to those that don't have, because the more you understand the privilege you have that God gave you to be abundant on good works.

[diakonos]

Originally Posted by Nicodemus1968

I’m not a preterist, I believe in fulfilled eschatology.

Devil Chasing Moody-

You are a preterist.

[Michael The Disciple]

I heard an Apostolic Evangelist teach if you pay one penny short on your tithes you will not make Heaven. The reasoning was you would be robbing God and thieves dont enter Heaven.

[jediwill83]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

I heard an Apostolic Evangelist teach if you pay one penny short on your tithes you will not make Heaven. The reasoning was you would be robbing God and thieves dont enter Heaven.

I always heard, "Id rather have a blessed 90% than a cursed 100%"

[Tithesmeister]

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

I heard an Apostolic Evangelist teach if you pay one penny short on your tithes you will not make Heaven. The reasoning was you would be robbing God and thieves dont enter Heaven.

That is the same thing Greg Riggen said in the sermon I posted. He said, (and I’m going from memory) “God had the best accountants, and if you are one penny short on paying your tithes, you won’t be allowed into heaven”. I may not have it exactly right but it’s close to what he said. He was a pastor when he said it so the evangelist may be someone else.

[Tithesmeister]

Originally Posted by jediwill83

I always heard, "Id rather have a blessed 90% than a cursed 100%"

Yes. It’s almost like they don’t really believe that we’re redeemed from the curse of the law.

[Tithesmeister]

Originally Posted by coksiw

Every time I see people saying, "I paid tithe all my life and was always blessed", this question comes to mind: "I'm sure they are hiding the complete truth", or "how can they be so blind to the reality?".

* Did you ever neglect your family by putting them in much debt because your lack of saving, or getting the house in the wrong neighborhood, or not saving for retirement contributing to your 401k and becoming a burden later to your kids or the church?
- This is in fact a commandment: neglecting your family is worse than a unbeliever

* Did you neglect your needed parents by not helping them financially (because you know, you are giving hundreds in tithing and little is left) ...while your other non-christian siblings did?
- Honor your parent, that is a commandment.

* Did you ever turn your back to church member's in need because you didn't have anything left after giving much in tithing?
- Should I quote John or James epistles?

Let's say you could afford all of that during your life time: tithing, and a decent house for your family, stay out of consumer debt, save a decent amount for retirement, and bless your parents so much. Do you realize how wealthy you are comparing with most of the people in the planet? Are you that wealthy because you tithe or because the education your parent invested in, and the fact that you live in a first world country full of opportunities and good salaries and affordable stuff?

The less you attribute your blessing to tithing, and the more you attribute it to the grace of God, the more you feel like giving to those that don't have, because the more you understand the privilege you have that God gave you to be abundant on good works.

This is a GREAT perspective. Thanks for posting.

[Tithesmeister]

Originally Posted by Nicodemus1968

What’s ironic is that you don’t teach tithing, but you teach 10%?

Because I believe thats a good guideline. I used that in my life for 17 years, and it blessed me. So, form my experience I will use that. I believe God gives me enough liberty to do that.

Paul did that...

1 Corinthians 7:6 KJVS
[6] But I speak this by permission, and not of commandment.

1 Corinthians 7:12 KJVS
[12] But to the rest speak I, not the Lord: If any brother hath a wife that believeth not, and she be pleased to dwell with him, let him not put her away.

The Lord has given me liberty to use what I feel as a guideline, why? Because it doesn't bear the saints down, I’m not using 10% as a way of control, or a way of manipulation.

So is this idea that preachers are on the take new? You haven’t noticed? Maybe it’s because you are one of them (preachers)? You don’t seem to know anyone that preaches that it’s tithe or hell. Do you believe Sister Amanah? Diakanos? What about me? Do you think we’re making it up?

I believe you & them. I know what the audio you posted said, do I agree with him, No I don’t. Do I agree with a Pastor that tells his church if you dont pay tithe your going to split hell wide open, No I dont. It also needs to be said that Preachers also pay 10% on the tithe they accept.

You’ve mentioned having liberty to teach your own guideline a couple of times now. Allow me to rain all over that parade. The apostle Paul did express his own opinions at times. However he . . .

1. Made it plain that it was his opinion, and

2. Made sure his opinion didn’t contradict the Scripture.

When you have scripture to cover a subject in context, giving your own opinion is probably not the best idea you’ve ever had. It is my opinion that you may not should be putting yourself on the same level as the apostle Paul.

Also, when you have the example of the Apostle Paul working with his own hands to support the church, yet you ignore that in order to teach your own opinion, it seems like you have an agenda other than truth.

I’m not trying to argue with you or belittle your ministry. I’m just calling what I see.

Also: You just said (regarding your comment in red) that ten percent doesn’t bear the saints down. BUT if I recall correctly you have said earlier that you don’t currently teach tithing because your congregation is unable to bear the expense. Am I remembering correctly? Would you be so kind as to look up this quote and post it here so I don’t get it wrong?

[Esaias]

So tithing threads are the new "hair threads"?