I read this today. What are your thoughts?

[votivesoul]

Originally Posted by Lemon

“Idolatry functions widely inside religious communities when doctrinal truth is elevated to the position of a false god. This occurs when people rely on the rightness of their doctrine for their standing with God rather than on God himself and his grace.” We aren’t saved by being right about everything and perfectly understanding the Bible. We’re saved by God’s grace as long as our faith is continually placed in Jesus."


What are your thoughts on this concept?

I think a piece by piece analysis is in order.

Idolatry functions widely inside religious communities when doctrinal truth is elevated to the position of a false god.

It's hard to see how doctrinal truth can, by itself, become a false god. I think maybe the false god that gets created inside of various religious communities is the person, leader, elder, deacon, bishop, pastor, prophet, and etc., who everyone, or at least, a large number of people, believe to be so inspired in their understanding as to be infallible.

This occurs when people rely on the rightness of their doctrine for their standing with God rather than on God himself and his grace.

Again, it's hard to divorce the rightness of a doctrine from one's standing with God. Even correctly understanding that one's standing with God is dependent upon God Himself and His grace, requires a correct doctrinal understanding.

Imagine someone teaching "another Gospel" or embracing "another Jesus" or receiving "another Spirit", due to a fallacious doctrinal understanding. Or, consider what a damnable heresy really is. Think about what it means to deny the Lord that bought you.

There has to be a line somewhere, where one's doctrinal understanding determines whether one is or is not, right with God.

We aren’t saved by being right about everything and perfectly understanding the Bible. We’re saved by God’s grace as long as our faith is continually placed in Jesus.

We have to be right about some things in order to be saved, though. Must we be right about everything? No, but some things, for certain have to be lined up and square with the Scriptures.

Additionally, there is a difference between not being certain or admitting ignorance, versus claiming certainty and not admitting the possibility of being wrong. One leaves a person enough room to trust that the Spirit of Truth will lead into all truth. The other tends to breed arrogance and defiance.

[loran adkins]

This is the kind of thing that caused me to leave UPC. Call me what you like, but I see this so well now. My own mom bless her heart is a prime example of this. If you don't so things just my way you must not be saved. If this type of thinking is not idolatry I don't know what is.

If I ask what is truth and I will get several answers, all from people that are supposed to have the full truth. I have lived in one state most of my life, and I could go just 50 miles and get a different version of the whole truth from three of four different pastors. The only thing that each had in common was the fact that they used the name of Jesus in water baptism in stead of father son and holy ghost.

Back to my mom, If a person had not been baptized in Jesus name then they must not be saved. But she does not stop there, If a person (woman) cuts her hair, wears pants, or make up, etc. they are not saved according to the way she/they think. Even I am not saved, according to her.

According to the Pharisee, even Jesus was not saved, because he did not line up with their way of thinking.

[consapente89]

Originally Posted by loran adkins

This is the kind of thing that caused me to leave UPC. Call me what you like, but I see this so well now. My own mom bless her heart is a prime example of this. If you don't so things just my way you must not be saved. If this type of thinking is not idolatry I don't know what is.

If I ask what is truth and I will get several answers, all from people that are supposed to have the full truth. I have lived in one state most of my life, and I could go just 50 miles and get a different version of the whole truth from three of four different pastors. The only thing that each had in common was the fact that they used the name of Jesus in water baptism in stead of father son and holy ghost.

Back to my mom, If a person had not been baptized in Jesus name then they must not be saved. But she does not stop there, If a person (woman) cuts her hair, wears pants, or make up, etc. they are not saved according to the way she/they think. Even I am not saved, according to her.
According to the Pharisee, even Jesus was not saved, because he did not line up with their way of thinking.

She's probably right.

[aegsm76]

Originally Posted by Lemon

“Idolatry functions widely inside religious communities when doctrinal truth is elevated to the position of a false god. This occurs when people rely on the rightness of their doctrine for their standing with God rather than on God himself and his grace.” We aren’t saved by being right about everything and perfectly understanding the Bible. We’re saved by God’s grace as long as our faith is continually placed in Jesus."


What are your thoughts on this concept?

Sounds like to me a form of virtue signaling...

Also, sounds like Paul's writing were not needed.

After all, ALL we need is grace.

[james34]

Yep it wreaks of the false grace msg, which is most easily discerned by its resistance to biblical truth. Always sneakily pointing to how grace is all you need, truth will come in the future. Run from it. It is a horrible false doctrine that has infiltrated most church congregations.

[consapente89]

Originally Posted by aegsm76

Sounds like to me a form of virtue signaling...

Also, sounds like Paul's writing were not needed.

After all, ALL we need is grace.

[Nicodemus1968]

Originally Posted by Lemon

“Idolatry functions widely inside religious communities when doctrinal truth is elevated to the position of a false god. This occurs when people rely on the rightness of their doctrine for their standing with God rather than on God himself and his grace.” We aren’t saved by being right about everything and perfectly understanding the Bible. We’re saved by God’s grace as long as our faith is continually placed in Jesus."


What are your thoughts on this concept?

I think this is a good topic. We are NOT saved by our KNOWLEDGE, yet we ARE saved by our FAITH or believing.

[Nicodemus1968]

Originally Posted by james34

Yep it wreaks of the false grace msg, which is most easily discerned by its resistance to biblical truth. Always sneakily pointing to how grace is all you need, truth will come in the future. Run from it. It is a horrible false doctrine that has infiltrated most church congregations.

I understand what your saying, so then are we saved through Knowledge or Grace?

Always sneakily pointing to how grace is all you need, truth will come in the future.

I don’t believe this is “sneaky”, without grace you’re not saved. And truth did come in the future. Do you have more truth NOW then you did at the point of your conversion? There are many of us that did not UNDERSTAND one God at the point of our Acts 2:38 experience, yet we BELIEVED there was one God. That truth came later!

[diakonos]

Originally Posted by consapente89

She's probably right.

[consapente89]

Doesn't Titus 2:11-12 tell us that saving grace teaches? How then can you separate knowledge from grace?