Girl stoned to death

Originally Posted by Ferd

Chan, Jesus died that we might have life and have it more abundantly.

Yes, and your point?????

I would like to point out to the peanut gallery that Chan is defending a group of people who stoned a girl to death.

I'm not defending anything. I am, however, saying that we have no right to judge another culture's actions by the values of the earthly culture in which we happen to reside.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Ferd

I appreciate seeking to understand culture. (I read the Ugly American in high school).

what bothers me here just a little bit is that it seems to me that the "Understanding Culture" bit is being used to accept devient behavior.

I do seek to understand islamic culture in context. Not for the purpose of excusing a heinious act like stoning some poor girl for dating someone of the wrong branch of islam, but for the purpose of being well guarded against such extremeism.

These people need to be stopped. period. the behavior may be acceptable in their culture on some sick level, but those outside the culture need to be willing to put pressure on this culture to make them change. To force them to see the sickness of the culture.

EXACTLY. We don't need 10 lessons on something we already know about. We KNOW that is acceptable in their culture. But that is beside the point. What is going on here is moral relativism...what's right or wrong for you may not be right or wrong for me

[Ferd]

Originally Posted by Chan

It was the Tutsis and Hutus. What right does any nation or culture have to impose its values and will on another?


I really don't think that the situation between the Tutsis and Hutus is part of why so much of the world hates the Western world. I do think that the hypocrisy in condemning the genocide in Bosnia while denying there even was a genocide in Rwanda certainly contributes to that hatred.

You certainly have the right to be wrong in your thinking.

Good for you. you can spell. yee ha. well at least you do have one thing right.


and lets not forget that you are defending the right of a family to STONE THEIR CHILD TO DEATH.

just wanted to point that out..... if I am wrong, as the saying goes, I have no desire to be right.

[Ferd]

Originally Posted by Chan

Yes, and your point?????


I'm not defending anything. I am, however, saying that we have no right to judge another culture's actions by the values of the earthly culture in which we happen to reside.

by sayin we have no right to judge a murderous cultures mayhem and murder, is in fact, defending it.

your rant about "earthly culture" is both wrong and tired.

[Praxeas]

Originally Posted by Ferd

by sayin we have no right to judge a murderous cultures mayhem and murder, is in fact, defending it.

your rant about "earthly culture" is both wrong and tired.

Why even preach them the gospel if we can't take a moral look and say "that's wrong, they need jesus"...just how far do we go with this "not judging" baloney....

They are judged already! They don't know Christ

[HeavenlyOne]

Originally Posted by Ferd

PM me and I will give you my full name.

Chan, do you think it because it was culturally acceptable for the Tootsie rebles to kill a half million Hootoo's that we should just ignore it/


That also is the reason we are hated by a good part of the world.

I think you are wrong in your assessment of why we are hated.

Ferd, did you just say it was culturally acceptable for the rebels to kill those people? Sorry, but that's incorrect. If it was culturally acceptable, there wouldn't have been rebels to begin with.

Actions by a group of people don't make those actions a cultural practice, necessarily.

However, I wonder what would be said if the Hootoo's killed the rebels and how that action would have been seen. Not as heinous, I'm sure.

Originally Posted by Praxeas

EXACTLY. We don't need 10 lessons on something we already know about. We KNOW that is acceptable in their culture. But that is beside the point. What is going on here is moral relativism...what's right or wrong for you may not be right or wrong for me

No, it isn't moral relativism. No matter how vile and offensive we may think the particular practice is, we have no right to judge another culture's practices by the standards of the earthly culture in which we happen to reside. And, in case you've forgotten, the Law of Moses commanded stoning for very similar reasons as the incident in question. So, before you go objecting to some other culture's practices, look at some of the practices God commanded in scripture.

I think all of us here find the practice of stoning an unmarried woman to death just because she got herself knocked up vile and offensive. But why do we think this way? Is it because of the earthly culture in which we were raised? Of course it is! And that is exactly the problem. We live in a culture where sex outside of marriage is acceptable and where murdering unborn children is legal. Do you really think such a wicked culture is in any position to judge another culture?

One of the main reasons why so much of the world hates America is because America (like Europe before us) butts its nose into the affairs of other nations and tries to impose its culture on the rest of the world.

Of course, as Christians we are not of any earthly culture. Our culture is that of the kingdom of Heaven (and to believe otherwise is treason against God's kingdom). The values we espouse, then, must be the values of Heaven. Considering the Law of Moses (in this case, what is often called the "moral law" that was supposedly not replaced by the new covenant), is the practice of stoning to death an unmarried woman who committed fornication wrong?

[HeavenlyOne]

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Why even preach them the gospel if we can't take a moral look and say "that's wrong, they need jesus"...just how far do we go with this "not judging" baloney....

They are judged already! They don't know Christ

I might be wrong here (Felicity can jump in if she wishes), but missionaries don't mess with the law practices of the countries they are winning to Jesus. That's up to the people who belong to that culture to change it.

For instance, there are missionaries in countries where beating wives is acceptable. The missionaries can teach the men to love their wives as Christ loved the church, but they don't approach the authorities and tell them that what is acceptable there isn't acceptable to the missionaries and/or to God. That isn't their job.

Jesus didn't change the laws of his country when He was preaching. He didn't even attempt to do so. Paul didn't change the laws in the various countries and cultures he came into contact with. Peter tried it, but was rebuked by Paul for doing so.

She didn't just date a boy of another religion either. She converted, which is highly insulting....something we cannot understand and think of as no big deal.

I remember watching the Iraqis hitting Saddam's statue with their shoes as it was drug around town and thinking how silly that looked to me, but in that culture, it's the highest insult one can give to another person.

In another culture, calling someone a dog is a high insult, yet Randy on AI says it to almost every contestant and it's like a term of endearment.

In another culture, giving the 'A-ok' sign is like the 'finger' here. Bush Sr. had to issue that country a public apology because he wasn't aware of their cultural moray. He could have instead told them that the sign wasn't a big deal and what it really meant, but I don't think they would have been too pleased with that, do you? No, because it wasn't how Bush saw it that mattered, but how THEY saw it.

The point is, what we deem in our culture to be no big deal doesn't mean everyone else should look at it that way. Neither should we jump to 'educate' these other cultures about the truth according to American culture. This is what will lead to a one world government and it's not something I want other cultures doing to me.

Originally Posted by Ferd

by sayin we have no right to judge a murderous cultures mayhem and murder, is in fact, defending it.

your rant about "earthly culture" is both wrong and tired.

No, we have no right to judge according to the standards of the earthly culture in which we happen to live. The only valid standard for judging is the word of God!

Originally Posted by Praxeas

Why even preach them the gospel if we can't take a moral look and say "that's wrong, they need jesus"...just how far do we go with this "not judging" baloney....

They are judged already! They don't know Christ

You and Ferd are missing the point entirely! What I'm saying is that we have no right to judge another culture's actions BASED ON THE VALUES OF THE EARTHLY CULTURE IN WHICH WE HAPPEN TO RESIDE!!!!!!!!!!!!! What part of that do you and Ferd NOT understand??????