|
Tab Menu 1
Fellowship Hall The place to go for Fellowship & Fun! |
|
|
09-06-2020, 09:50 AM
|
Banned
|
|
Join Date: May 2020
Posts: 793
|
|
Re: Forgiveness of Sins and Spirit Baptism
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoffman
Oh my, really?!? I’m misrepresenting people?
How else am I suppose to take this conversation, others and yourself are writing you don’t need FORGIVENESS to receive the Holy Spirit. The question wasn’t about a releasing or remission of sins. It was about forgiveness, there is a big difference. Our Lord Jesus can forgive you, when you ask, yet that doesn’t mean your sins have been remitted. So, a soul can come to our Lord Jesus and ask for forgiveness for the wickedness that he has done in his life. Our Great and Mighty Lord Jesus will forgive him, and thats why he can receive the baptism of the Holy Spirit. Now, after he receives the Holy Spirit, and he doesn’t receive baptism in the name of the Lord Jesus, his sins have not been remitted even though he was forgiven.
John 8:10-11 KJVS
[10] When Jesus had lifted up himself, and saw none but the woman, he said unto her, Woman, where are those thine accusers? hath no man condemned thee? [11] She said, No man, Lord. And Jesus said unto her, Neither do I condemn thee: go, and sin no more.
I’m interested into seeing how you three take these verses?
Did our Lord Jesus forgive her?
Now, one may say, this was prior to Acts 2:38, and your correct, yet this is showing the nature of our Lord.
Ill repeat myself so I don’t misrepresent myself like I have been accused of doing to others. Forgiveness is different than remission, our Lord can Forgive, and its possible your sins haven’t been released due to your unwillingness to be baptized. Yet, one cannot receive the Holy Spirit prior to forgiveness.
|
This is great! I believe there is a vast difference between the forgiveness of a sin and remission of all sin. Great thoughts.
|
09-06-2020, 11:19 AM
|
|
Unvaxxed Pureblood
|
|
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Zion aka TEXAS
Posts: 26,018
|
|
Re: Forgiveness of Sins and Spirit Baptism
The very concept of there being a difference between forgiveness and remission would have been unknown and unintelligible to Jesus, the apostles, and the original apostolic church. They spoke Greek. The Greek word translated forgiveness is aphesis. It is the same word translated remission. You couldn't have explained it to them if you wanted to. It would be like trying to convince them there is a difference between "god" and "deity".
The idea that forgiveness and remission are two different things is false and non apostolic.
If you can be forgiven but not remitted then you can be remitted and not forgiven. So infant baptism is the logical conclusion to such a doctrine.
|
09-06-2020, 11:23 AM
|
|
Covenant Apostolic
|
|
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Sebastian, FL
Posts: 8,765
|
|
Re: Forgiveness of Sins and Spirit Baptism
Quote:
Originally Posted by Esaias
The very concept of there being a difference between forgiveness and remission would have been unknown and unintelligible to Jesus, the apostles, and the original apostolic church. They spoke Greek. The Greek word translated forgiveness is aphesis. It is the same word translated remission. You couldn't have explained it to them if you wanted to. It would be like trying to convince them there is a difference between "god" and "deity".
The idea that forgiveness and remission are two different things is false and non apostolic.
If you can be forgiven but not remitted then you can be remitted and not forgiven. So infant baptism is the logical conclusion to such a doctrine.
|
Exactly
Strong’s Definitions
ἄφεσις áphesis, af'-es-is; from G863; freedom; (figuratively) pardon:—deliverance, forgiveness, liberty, remission
Forgiveness and remission is the same greek word, so, you can't say as some do that repentance is for forgiveness and baptism is for remission.
|
09-06-2020, 11:23 AM
|
|
Unvaxxed Pureblood
|
|
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Zion aka TEXAS
Posts: 26,018
|
|
Re: Forgiveness of Sins and Spirit Baptism
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoffman
You and some of the others believe repentance is just thinking differently, and is not as needed as Baptism and the infilling of the Holy Ghost.
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Esaias
There you go misrepresenting people. Shame shame.
|
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoffman
Oh my, really?!? I’m misrepresenting people?
How else am I suppose to take this conversation, others and yourself are writing you don’t need FORGIVENESS to receive the Holy Spirit.
|
Nobody said "repentance... is not as needed as baptism and the infilling of the Holy Ghost."
You misrepresented what we have been saying.
|
09-06-2020, 12:11 PM
|
Registered Member
|
|
Join Date: Jan 2019
Posts: 538
|
|
Re: Forgiveness of Sins and Spirit Baptism
Quote:
Originally Posted by Esaias
The very concept of there being a difference between forgiveness and remission would have been unknown and unintelligible to Jesus, the apostles, and the original apostolic church. They spoke Greek. The Greek word translated forgiveness is aphesis. It is the same word translated remission.
...
|
|
09-06-2020, 12:43 PM
|
|
Covenant Apostolic
|
|
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Sebastian, FL
Posts: 8,765
|
|
Re: Forgiveness of Sins and Spirit Baptism
Repentance and remission is associated with water baptism
Mar 1:4 - John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.
Repentance:
Strong’s Definitions
μετάνοια metánoia, met-an'-oy-ah; from G3340; (subjectively) compunction (for guilt, including reformation); by implication, reversal (of (another's) decision):—repentance
Remission:
Strong’s Definitions
ἄφεσις áphesis, af'-es-is; from G863; freedom; (figuratively) pardon:—deliverance, forgiveness, liberty, remission.
Last edited by Amanah; 09-06-2020 at 12:45 PM.
|
09-06-2020, 12:54 PM
|
Registered Member
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2020
Posts: 76
|
|
Re: Forgiveness of Sins and Spirit Baptism
Quote:
Originally Posted by Esaias
The very concept of there being a difference between forgiveness and remission would have been unknown and unintelligible to Jesus, the apostles, and the original apostolic church. They spoke Greek. The Greek word translated forgiveness is aphesis. It is the same word translated remission. You couldn't have explained it to them if you wanted to. It would be like trying to convince them there is a difference between "god" and "deity".
The idea that forgiveness and remission are two different things is false and non apostolic.
If you can be forgiven but not remitted then you can be remitted and not forgiven. So infant baptism is the logical conclusion to such a doctrine.
|
You guys believe Acts 2:38 is a 2 step process, and no longer a 3 step. Because Baptism and Repentance are one in the same. Repentance is there for a reason, and everyone that I have seen get the Holy Spirit repented or asked our Lord Jesus for forgiveness. John the forerunner of Christ preached repentance, the brethren in Acts 19, was baptized unto the baptism of Repentance, and then they were baptized in the name of our Lord Jesus. Oh well, cant teach an old dog new tricks.
I believe Easias your also the gentleman that believes there is no 5 fold ministry but 4 fold ministry, because Pastor and Teacher are the same.
|
09-06-2020, 12:57 PM
|
Registered Member
|
|
Join Date: Mar 2020
Posts: 76
|
|
Re: Forgiveness of Sins and Spirit Baptism
Quote:
Originally Posted by Amanah
Repentance and remission is associated with water baptism
Mar 1:4 - John did baptize in the wilderness, and preach the baptism of repentance for the remission of sins.
Repentance:
Strong’s Definitions
μετάνοια metánoia, met-an'-oy-ah; from G3340; (subjectively) compunction (for guilt, including reformation); by implication, reversal (of (another's) decision):—repentance
Remission:
Strong’s Definitions
ἄφεσις áphesis, af'-es-is; from G863; freedom; (figuratively) pardon:—deliverance, forgiveness, liberty, remission.
|
Do we even need repentance, if there one in the same and we cannot separate like Easias has stated with words like “God and Deity”?
|
09-06-2020, 01:00 PM
|
|
Unvaxxed Pureblood
|
|
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Zion aka TEXAS
Posts: 26,018
|
|
Re: Forgiveness of Sins and Spirit Baptism
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoffman
You guys believe Acts 2:38 is a 2 step process, and no longer a 3 step. Because Baptism and Repentance are one in the same.
|
Okay, clearly it is impossible to have a reasoned discussion with you. Nobody said "repentance and baptism are one in the same."
Have a good day.
|
09-06-2020, 01:20 PM
|
|
Covenant Apostolic
|
|
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Sebastian, FL
Posts: 8,765
|
|
Re: Forgiveness of Sins and Spirit Baptism
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hoffman
Do we even need repentance, if there one in the same and we cannot separate like Easias has stated with words like “God and Deity”?
|
Repentance means to turn around and change your life, so of course you need repentance, baptism is for forgiveness/remission.
So, you need to turn your life around, be baptized for remission, and receive the Spirit.
The thing that is the same is forgiveness and remission.
|
Thread Tools |
|
Display Modes |
Linear Mode
|
Posting Rules
|
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is Off
|
|
|
|
|
|
All times are GMT -6. The time now is 01:23 PM.
| |