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  #11  
Old 04-26-2009, 05:19 AM
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shawndell shawndell is offline
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Re: !!Frustrated Dad!!

Brother Eastman I know that Rickie throws tantrums very seldom comared to when he was two,and he seems to listen a little better,but patrick just turned two and its his turn!!!
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  #12  
Old 04-26-2009, 07:10 AM
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Re: !!Frustrated Dad!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrotherEastman View Post
Tactile stimuli? Care to elaborate?
You know, swats, woopins, spanking etc......
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  #13  
Old 04-26-2009, 12:30 PM
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Re: !!Frustrated Dad!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by shawndell View Post
Brother Eastman I know that Rickie throws tantrums very seldom comared to when he was two,and he seems to listen a little better,but patrick just turned two and its his turn!!!
Ben will be two on the first of May, but I think he's ahead of the game. LOL!
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  #14  
Old 04-26-2009, 12:33 PM
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Re: !!Frustrated Dad!!

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Originally Posted by Truthseeker View Post
You know, swats, woopins, spanking etc......
Do you endorse such practice? nahkoa shared an excellent site which makes me think twice before I would spank my son or offer what you would call "tactile stimuli".
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  #15  
Old 04-26-2009, 03:17 PM
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Praxeas Praxeas is offline
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Re: !!Frustrated Dad!!

I wonder if the dog whisperer can help?
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  #16  
Old 04-26-2009, 03:49 PM
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MissBrattified MissBrattified is offline
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Re: !!Frustrated Dad!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrotherEastman View Post
Do you endorse such practice? nahkoa shared an excellent site which makes me think twice before I would spank my son or offer what you would call "tactile stimuli".
I'm not going to get into the spanking debate--and we have occasionally spanked our children--BUT, I don't see the need for spanking if something else will work as effectively, and sometimes more effectively.

The goal shouldn't be to stop your son from getting your attention--you want him to get it in an appropriate way. Nor should the goal be to stop him from asking you for anything--we want our children to ask us for things. The goal should be to get him to take "No" for an answer.

One way around the store tantrums is to give your child their own little allowance to spend. We started giving our children $3 a week when they were 3 (and upped it a $1 a year), and they've always used that to buy treats or small toys--or they can save it and buy something larger. We always make our kids pay for their own "extras", and they have to leave enough room in their budget to cover tax.

This is a tangent with a capital T, BUT--we do not pay our children to do chores. They don't earn their allowance. We have always kept their allowance separate from their work. In our house the rule is--if you're a part of the family, you work with the rest of the family until the work is done. They don't have the option of avoiding chores by saying, "Oh well, I don't need/want my allowance anyway."

Anyway, back to the topic...

My main disciplinary technique is natural consequences. With children, you often have to arrange natural consequences, but in the long run, I think they learn more from it than corporal punishment. Case in point: The natural consequence of throwing a temper tantrum in public is that the child absolutely does not get what he asks for, even after he calms down. It waits until the next visit. And there's ice cream on the way home from the store, either. The practical application being that once he is an adult, screaming at someone to get what he wants will have the opposite effect, so learning to be sweet, and accept a negative response is a good lesson to learn.

The only instance in which we've used corporal punishment 99.99% of the time is when our children have been in danger. If you have a 2 year old that suddenly dashes into the road, I don't see how to get the idea of danger across through "natural consequences", (because that would mean simulating getting hit by a car). 2 year olds can't be reasoned with or lectured like a 13 year old, so sometimes "tactile stimuli" might be the answer.

However. I would recommend that anyone who uses "tactile stimuli" on a regular basis try their belt, paddle, switch or hand on themselves first. Adults (especially men) are much stronger than they realize, and if you strike a child as hard as you can, it is MUCH too hard.



Wait...I said I wasn't going to discuss spanking, didn't I? How did that happen....
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--David Livingstone


"To see no being, not God’s or any, but you also go thither,
To see no possession but you may possess it—enjoying all without labor or purchase—
abstracting the feast, yet not abstracting one particle of it;…."

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  #17  
Old 04-26-2009, 04:19 PM
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nahkoe nahkoe is offline
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Re: !!Frustrated Dad!!

Very good post.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MissBrattified View Post
My main disciplinary technique is natural consequences. With children, you often have to arrange natural consequences, but in the long run, I think they learn more from it than corporal punishment. Case in point: The natural consequence of throwing a temper tantrum in public is that the child absolutely does not get what he asks for, even after he calms down. It waits until the next visit. And there's ice cream on the way home from the store, either. The practical application being that once he is an adult, screaming at someone to get what he wants will have the opposite effect, so learning to be sweet, and accept a negative response is a good lesson to learn.
Natural and logical consequences are what I use most of the time too. Besides being effective, I think it teaches the kids to think and reason through things logically. Skills I want my kids to have as adults. I can't say "don't do.." and imagine every scenario they will encounter as teens and adults. But I can say "this didn't work out so well because of..." and hope the logic behind it sinks in. My older kids also seem to have learned how to graciously make mistakes, take responsibility for them, and make amends where appropriate. All skills I want them to have as adults.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MissBrattified View Post
The only instance in which we've used corporal punishment 99.99% of the time is when our children have been in danger. If you have a 2 year old that suddenly dashes into the road, I don't see how to get the idea of danger across through "natural consequences", (because that would mean simulating getting hit by a car). 2 year olds can't be reasoned with or lectured like a 13 year old, so sometimes "tactile stimuli" might be the answer.
Yep. I got three kids past the toddler stage. Then I had Justyn. All of my kids were runners, but he's a *runner* and even at 4 there is no reasoning with him. At least at 4 the threat of a spanking keeps him from running 99.9% of the time. He says he can run faster than the cars so they won't hit him. Oy...
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  #18  
Old 04-26-2009, 07:07 PM
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Margies3 Margies3 is offline
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Re: !!Frustrated Dad!!

You've heard some really good advice on here. Well, except for the suggestion of the spanking. I know all won't agree, but that's my opinion. I've done home daycare for an average of 6 little ones at a time for the past 24 years. I can count on ONE HAND the number of times I have punished with a swat on the behind. And when I did, I always made sure that the parents knew it had happened and why.

As far as tantrums go, the only other two pieces of advice I have for you are:

1) if the tantrum happens in my home, I have been known to simply pick the child up and take them to the bedroom and lay them on the bed. I then tell them that when they are finished, they are welcome to come out and join us again. But when they come out, I have to see a smile on their face. Usually they stay for a couple of minutes and then they're right back out with us and whatever they threw the fit over is forgotten.

2) The other thing that I ALWAYS do with the daycare little ones is that if we are going to the store, I give them clear instructions BEFORE we walk into the store. They know that they have to stay either on the cart or right beside it. They are not allowed to touch anything. And they are not allowed to ask for things, unless it is something like "Can we have green beans for lunch?". But no asking for candy or toys. At the end of the shopping trip, IF they have been good and I have not had to correct them, then SOMETIMES they will get a treat. Something small like a small candy or bubbles or something like that. If everyone else was good, but one child had to be spoken to repeatedly, then I will get for everyone else, but not for that one child. And they know that they do NOT get something every single time we go to the store. Most times we don't. But if they've not behaved, then they absolutely will not. If they have behaved, then they might That's usually plenty of incentive.
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  #19  
Old 04-26-2009, 07:21 PM
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MissBrattified MissBrattified is offline
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Re: !!Frustrated Dad!!

Good post, Margie. I think you made an important point--with young children, you should state your expectations before you go into the store! And offer reminders, if necessary.
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--David Livingstone


"To see no being, not God’s or any, but you also go thither,
To see no possession but you may possess it—enjoying all without labor or purchase—
abstracting the feast, yet not abstracting one particle of it;…."

--Walt Whitman, Leaves of Grass, Song of the Open Road
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  #20  
Old 04-27-2009, 07:54 AM
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Re: !!Frustrated Dad!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by BrotherEastman View Post
Do you endorse such practice? nahkoa shared an excellent site which makes me think twice before I would spank my son or offer what you would call "tactile stimuli".
One of them anti spanking sites? I'll take a look if you post it. Hard to overlook scripture on the subject though.
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Today pull up the little weeds,
The sinful thoughts subdue,
Or they will take the reins themselves
And someday master you. --Anon.


The most deadly sins do not leap upon us, they creep up on us.
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