Would Jesus And The Apostles Recognize The Church

Scott Hutchinson · #1 07-06-2009, 06:40 PM

If Jesus walked the earth today would He recognize the church ?
If the apostles were alive today would the church today resemble the church in their day both in practice and in structure ?

Would Jesus and The Apostles recognize the church as the church ?

Michael The Disciple · #2 07-06-2009, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott Hutchinson

If Jesus walked the earth today would He recognize the church ?
If the apostles were alive today would the church today resemble the church in their day both in practice and in structure ?

Would Jesus and The Apostles recognize the church as the church ?

No I think they would check them out and say:

We warned this would happen. False teachers would invade the Church. The foundation doctrines we gave are nearly impossible to find. We dont see any of your so called Pastors preaching perfection. No wonder sin is so rampant.

Scott Hutchinson · #3 07-06-2009, 07:33 PM

Perfection is in the bible,yet seldom ever taught.

Sam · #4 07-06-2009, 07:49 PM

my opinion,
Jesus knows all who are His. He recognizes all who are in His church. The changes in culture and technology would not be a surprise to Him.

If the apostles were transported into our day, they wouldn't recognize much of anything. Everything would be so different.

The apostles would probably be more comfortable in a small group than in our "sanctuary."

giftofgrace · #5 07-06-2009, 07:52 PM

Sadly, I don't believe very much... Even in "our" churches. God have mercy on us for how we have behaved as a faith so many times, just something to think about I guess. Would be a good sermon title?

tbpew · #6 07-06-2009, 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

No I think they would check them out and say:

We warned this would happen. False teachers would invade the Church. The foundation doctrines we gave are nearly impossible to find. We dont see any of your so called Pastors preaching perfection. No wonder sin is so rampant.

I certainly do not want to hijack a thread on post no.6 but....
What are we teaching that the word "perfection" means?
I will check back on this, but I thought it was a word that witnessed "complete or completed/finished".

MtD...is that what you are bringing forth when you use the word?
If not, what is your meaning behind the word "perfect"?

Michael The Disciple · #7 07-06-2009, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tbpew

I certainly do not want to hijack a thread on post no.6 but....
What are we teaching that the word "perfection" means?
I will check back on this, but I thought it was a word that witnessed "complete or completed/finished".

MtD...is that what you are bringing forth when you use the word?
If not, what is your meaning behind the word "perfect"?

So when Yeshua commanded us to be perfect even as the Father in Heaven is perfect did he really mean this?

Be ye therefore completed/finished
even as your Father in Heaven is completed/finished

More likely it has the meaning Peter gives to the same concept.

14: As obedient children, not fashioning yourselves according to the former lusts in your ignorance:
15: But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation;
16: Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy. 1 Peter 1:14-16

It has to do with being like the Father.

Aquila · #8 07-06-2009, 09:31 PM

I believe Jesus and the Apostles would think that it was a theatrical mockery of what they understood as church.

tbpew · #9 07-06-2009, 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michael The Disciple

So when Yeshua commanded us to be perfect even as the Father in Heaven is perfect did he really mean this?

Be ye therefore completed/finished
even as your Father in Heaven is completed/finished

More likely it has the meaning Peter gives to the same concept.

14: As obedient children, not fashioning yourselves according to the former lusts in your ignorance:
15: But as he which hath called you is holy, so be ye holy in all manner of conversation;
16: Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy. 1 Peter 1:14-16

It has to do with being like the Father.

But our being like the FATHER is accomplished by being made COMPLETE by him. It is the state of FULLNESS. It is the ALL in ALL.

To view it otherwise, would invite a person to be snared into thinking that seeks perfection as a reinvention of being righteous by the works of the law --the foolishness of the bewitched Galatians.

Aquila · #10 07-06-2009, 09:36 PM

Perfection is relative.

My son was crawling when a baby, he couldn't stand. But he was perfect.
My son can walk now at two years old, but can't entirely talk like an adult. But he is perfect.
When he is a grown man he will have human imperfections that we all have. But if found in Christ, he will be perfect.