The Recent Accusation of Racism Against the UPCI

[navygoat1998]

Originally Posted by Originalist

Having been affiliated with several Pentecostal fellowships (trinity and oneness) I concur with your perception of the UPCI. It is by far the most racially diverse fellowship I've ever seen. I believe rallying around the doctrine creates a racially transcendent unity not seen in churches that tend to downplay doctrine.

My wife attended Southbay UPCI and I (we) attended Truevine and both those churches were very racially diverse. Each had pastors on staff who were of many different colors.

Whatever issues I had with somethings, I would say that racism would not be one.

[navygoat1998]

Originally Posted by Originalist

Having been affiliated with several Pentecostal fellowships (trinity and oneness) I concur with your perception of the UPCI. It is by far the most racially diverse fellowship I've ever seen. I believe rallying around the doctrine creates a racially transcendent unity not seen in churches that tend to downplay doctrine.

The Assembly of God churches we have been a part of for the last 13 years have been diverse.

[Originalist]

Originally Posted by navygoat1998

The Assembly of God churches we have been a part of for the last 13 years have been diverse.

I watched some of the last General Council by live stream an was amazed at the diversity exhibited.

[1ofthechosen]

Originally Posted by n david

In the first video, this couple refers to "systemic" racism in the UPCI. No examples are given, everything is kept vague. They mention there are no or very few minorities in the hierarchy of the UPCI, at both General and District levels. They mention the PAW had two leaders who were white (though failed to mention that this was in the 70s and 80s and since then the leadership of the PAW has been black from top down.) They demand some sort of resolution calling racism a sin and affirming the UPCI will vote anyone into office regardless of race. They say the video was a "last resort" due to being ignored by their District and by UPCI HQ.

The second video brings another demand -- gender equality! They wished to address accusations from the first video. They said they were accused of causing division, which they deny. They claim to have released the videos to bring healing. Please. You don't release a video making vague accusations against an organization to "bring healing." They said they were accused of being vague. They gave a story of meeting with the District board and someone on the District board asked about their interracial marriage and how their kids adapted. Also said the board told them there were some churches in the southern part of the district which may not be welcoming to interracial marriage. I can tell you there are likely black churches which also would not welcome interracial marriage. There are likely black churches which wouldn't welcome a white minister to preach. They again refer to the UPCI having "systemic" racism, but then say they know not everyone is racist. If they believe it's not widespread, not the whole of the UPCI, they shouldn't be calling it "systemic."

The wife is the leader, IMO. I've known and been around couples in ministry in which the wife took the dominant role.

She read a part in which a new demand is that the UPCI pass a resolution which states all positions be open to any race and gender. Never. Gonna. Happen.

First, no woman should be the GS or AGS. Not their role. Nor should the ladies ministry position be open for a man to be in charge or vice versa. Second, anyone can put their name in for office and receive votes.

This demand that there be resolutions passed against racism and opening positions to both genders is nothing more than liberal, social justice and feminist junk.

I totally agree with that especially the part you can tell the woman is really the head in that relationship.. But sad to say lady you won't be the head of the UPCI! Good day! Lol

[TakingDominion]

I haven't watched the video nor do I care to. From reading the various comments here, it sounds like this couple has other reasons for leaving.

With that said, I will say it has bothered me from time to time that we don't have many POC in leadership positions. We need more culturally diverse pastors and not just a black bass player or usher. My humble opinion.

Not that it matters, but I am white.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by TakingDominion

I haven't watched the video nor do I care to. From reading the various comments here, it sounds like this couple has other reasons for leaving.

With that said, I will say it has bothered me from time to time that we don't have many POC in leadership positions. We need more culturally diverse pastors and not just a black bass player or usher. My humble opinion.

Not that it matters, but I am white.

Does the PAW or COOLJC need more white people?

Also, when did white cease to be a color?

[returnman]

Originally Posted by Evang.Benincasa

I think it's more of female leading the man down the road called confusion. No offense to the well meaning couple. But, in their video we have the issue of "race" then something about female "pastor?" How that all got thrown together was not exactly made clear. But, the pastor and his wife, might just be the pastor and his pastor. Just my opinion, since I haven't the foggiest idea what their complaints actually are, or know their situation well enough. Yet, this is what Charnock may of been getting at in his thread. People come use the video feature on their phone and then cry wee...wee...wee....all the way home. The people in the cheap seats then try to figure out the one dimensional story. Elder Bernard and the United Pentecostal Church International then starts to come up with statements that they are not racists. I thought we are of the race of Christ? Once we come into the Church? We are of His lineage. We aren't Italians looking to be culturally Italian. Or Greeks to be culturally Greek. A Spanish church is Spanish because of a language barrier. Same with a Korean church and Haitian church. I had a 22 year old on the job who was born and raised in Hialeah Florida. He can't speak a word of English. Am I racist if I don't see that as a good thing? Our language in this country is English. I guess if you never set a foot out of Hialeah you are OK. But if you intend on working in the rest of the sunny state of Floreeda then you need to learn ENGLISH.

The church has nothing to apologize for, it doesn't have to apologize for Sunday School directors who are homosexuals, or song teachers who are homosexuals. Because the church doesn't teach that is acceptable. Same for racism. The UPCI DOESN'T TEACH OR PREACH RACISM. If a black or Spanish GS is not to be found. Then oh well, we just never had one run, or want to run. We can make all the accusations we want, and bring up all the spooky Halloween stories which have no credible witnesses. The next thing we will have will be women coming forward accusing leadership of moral failure. Because that is what is going on with the secular world. Racism, people coming forward after untold amount of years past, accusing individuals of moral failure. If the church doesn't cut itself loose on trying to please everyone by making apologies, then it will crumble under its apologies.

Why was the video made?

Oh, to help people with the same problem?

Well, actually, that doesn't really happen. It just causes people who may have similar situations to just pour gasoline on the problem. Instead of Holy Ghost on the problem.

In between some of your sarcasm, lol, you are very wise and insightful. Cultural differences will always exist. As well as fellowship may be between the different races, and it should be, if we are completely honest we are most comfortable with folks of our own race. I'll dare say blacks even more so. That is not racism.

[TakingDominion]

Originally Posted by Esaias

Does the PAW or COOLJC need more white people?

Also, when did white cease to be a color?

Are you advocating for religious segregation? My pointing out a lack of diversity among leadership of the UPCI has nothing to do with any other organization.

Please understand, I'm 100% for the UPCI. I just believe this is an area we can do better. I have many black and hispanic brothers that will make dynamic pastors one day, if given the opportunity.

[Apostolic1ness]

Originally Posted by TakingDominion

Are you advocating for religious segregation? My pointing out a lack of diversity among leadership of the UPCI has nothing to do with any other organization.

Please understand, I'm 100% for the UPCI. I just believe this is an area we can do better. I have many black and hispanic brothers that will make dynamic pastors one day, if given the opportunity.

What about given the CALLING.

[Esaias]

Originally Posted by TakingDominion

Are you advocating for religious segregation? My pointing out a lack of diversity among leadership of the UPCI has nothing to do with any other organization.

Please understand, I'm 100% for the UPCI. I just believe this is an area we can do better. I have many black and hispanic brothers that will make dynamic pastors one day, if given the opportunity.

I'm saying since you said it "bothers" you that there aren't more blacks and browns in leadership positions in the UPC, are you also likewise "bothered" that there aren't more (any?) whites in leadership positions in the PAW or COOLJC?

I have noticed that basically all the "bothersomeness" about "diversity" seems only be directed at white-majority institutions, but everyone seems fine with black or brown or yellow or red majority institutions. Almost like "diversity" is a proposed virtue for only one group of people...