Trinity: False Doctrine of Blind Leaders.

[sola gratia]

Originally Posted by Old Paths

Define manifestation, puleeeze.

doh! ...geez

[Carpenter]

Originally Posted by Old Paths

And here I was trying to be nice.

If a duck was called a chicken would it really be a chicken?

Folks that are "labeled trinitarians" and don't believe trinity doctrine IMHO are not trinitarians.

Take for example all these wonderful people from mainstream religion being baptized in Jesus name and speaking in tongues all over the place...

Certainly you aren't presumptous to think they all receive an instant revelation of your version of oneness, and therfore have yet another step until they are really saved, or until they come to an understanding enough to dispute the Trinity.

Seeing baptism in Jesus name does not automatically absolve a belief in the Trinity.

[Old Paths]

Originally Posted by Carpenter

Take for example all these wonderful people from mainstream religion being baptized in Jesus name and speaking in tongues all over the place...

Certainly you aren't presumptous to think they all receive an instant revelation of your version of oneness, and therfore have yet another step until they are really saved, or until they come to an understanding enough to dispute the Trinity.

Seeing baptism in Jesus name does not automatically absolve a belief in the Trinity.

Hey Carp, First tell me where "all these wonderful people from mainstream religion being baptized in Jesus name and speaking in tongues all over the place..." is happening???


Then why don't you try and explain "YOUR version of Oneness".

[Steve Epley]

Yes are Trinitarians are really Oneness and have no problem with baptizing in Jesus Name however no one told them that when they were writing their articles of faith they don't seem to know it???? When Charisma wrote their famous piece about the 'bridge building' the ONLY guy in the article that has any guts at all was an AG official that clearly stated their would be NO reconciliation until the Oneness folks renounced their heresy. They are nothing but 'three-God paptists'.

Ah Come on build the bridge. And when the tri-theists get halfway across, say I now baptize you in the name of Jesus Christ, and blow the bridge. They end up baptized we all go to heaven. MAYBE!!

[tbpew]

In an earlier inquiry to 'Old Paths' I asked if he teaches (or has an understanding) that God exists in multiple concurrent manifestations.

to which Old Paths replied

Define manifestation, puleeeze.

Sorry, I though manifestation had a common usage around these parts...

My understanding of a manifestation is a state of being "rendered apparent". A manifestation is a means for something that is generally concealed to be made known, expressed or revealed. Note: If your understanding is something quite different, please share it.

So Old Paths, do you teach that the Spirit of God is manifested as the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost, AND do you teach (or have understanding) that these manifestations exist concurrently --at the same time?

[Steve Epley]

A manifestation could be like the wind-fire-tongues at Pentecost NONE of which are persons!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[sola gratia]

What I have found about most of us OP’s is we know very little about our own doctrine and a whole lot less about the Trinitarian doctrine – This ignorance leads to such statements like 'three-God paptists' and “their mother the Roman Catholic Church” These statements are what make the Trinitarians look at OP’s and think they are a joke, and dismiss them as “heretics” and “cults” and “crazy people” and well who can blame them.

Just a note – here are a couple of creeds, and a doctrinal statement from the AOG’s someone mentioned – I see a vehement theme of “One GOD” – In this manner your assessment is seriously flawed, and without merit

- We believe in one God – Nicene Creed
- There are not three Gods, but one God. – Anthanasian Creed
- The one true God has revealed Himself as the eternally self-existent "I AM," the Creator of heaven and earth and the Redeemer of mankind. AG Fundamentals of Truth


As is your understanding of words like:
Manifestations
Aspects
Persons

What is this hatred you guys have for the trinitarians? Did they enslave your parents or run over your dog or something? I think if your are going to make such claims of atrocities you should learn more about them – if not I’d shut that spicket off for awhile

[Steve Epley]

Originally Posted by sola gratia

What I have found about most of us OP’s is we know very little about our own doctrine and a whole lot less about the Trinitarian doctrine – This ignorance leads to such statements like 'three-God paptists' and “their mother the Roman Catholic Church” These statements are what make the Trinitarians look at OP’s and think they are a joke, and dismiss them as “heretics” and “cults” and “crazy people” and well who can blame them.

Just a note – here are a couple of creeds, and a doctrinal statement from the AOG’s someone mentioned – I see a vehement theme of “One GOD” – In this manner your assessment is seriously flawed, and without merit

- We believe in one God – Nicene Creed
- There are not three Gods, but one God. – Anthanasian Creed
- The one true God has revealed Himself as the eternally self-existent "I AM," the Creator of heaven and earth and the Redeemer of mankind. AG Fundamentals of Truth


As is your understanding of words like:
Manifestations
Aspects
Persons

What is this hatred you guys have for the trinitarians? Did they enslave your parents or run over your dog or something? I think if your are going to make such claims of atrocities you should learn more about them – if not I’d shut that spicket off for awhile

Sir the term persons is found in the AG's articles of faith. Our hatred is for their doctrine not their persons. And for your info yes the paptist according to one source was guilty of killing millions. Luther & Calvin had Oneness men killed. Wind blowing is a manifestation is it a person???????? Tongues of fire are a manifestation is it a person??? If so the Holy Ghost itself has three persons without the Father & Son may Hinn is correct.

[Digging4Truth]

Originally Posted by sola gratia

What I have found about most of us OP’s is we know very little about our own doctrine and a whole lot less about the Trinitarian doctrine –

So true... I think most OP leaders are not used to much in depth conversation on these subjects. Most are used to one line answers being sufficient as an answer to most questions.

It comes from a "'cause I said so" mentality that doesn't require real answers to real questions.

I wish that we would see more substantive answers to the questions that are posed these days and less attitude mixed in with it.

An open & honest discussion without being dealt the feeling that you are stupid, rebellious or out of order for having the audacity to ask the question would be very nice.