Politics for Dummies

[MissBrattified]

Question of the day: What/Who are delegates, what is their purpose, and do they matter? Are they congressmen? *confused*

Sorry if this is a silly question, but after looking it up online I can't really come up with a definitive answer. I noticed that on the election results yesterday, there was a column for "Delegates", and then score-keeping next to each candidate. (Some had 3 or 4, some had 0)

So....can someone educate me? :coffee2

[MissBrattified]

*BUMP*

[BoredOutOfMyMind]

We don't actually elect a President in the US. We elect delegates to an Electorial College and those electorates are then those who physically elect the President. This is why large states are called "crucial" - states like Pennsylvania and California.

[BoredOutOfMyMind]

Further information (http://tinyurl.com/6tfr5)

[MissBrattified]

We don't actually elect a President in the US. We elect delegates to an Electoral College and those electorates are then those who physically elect the President. This is why large states are called "crucial" - states like Pennsylvania and California.

I do understand the electoral vote...but is that the same as the "delegates" in the primaries?

[MissBrattified]

Okay, so here is what I'm asking about specifically:

http://election.cbsnews.com/campaign2008/state.shtml?state=IA

In the democratic column, it looks like this:

Obama - 38% - 940 votes - 16 del.
Edwards - 30% - 744 votes - 14 del.
Clinton - 29% - 737 votes - 15 del.


The Republican side looks like this:

Huckabee - 34% - 39,814 votes - 30 del.
Romney - 25% - 29,405 votes - 7 del.
Thompson - 13% - 15,521 votes - 0 del.


So....who are the "del.", what do they mean, what is their significance, are they the same as or similar to the electoral vote, and in the actual vote numbers...are those the actual vote numbers? As in the number of people who showed up to vote? And why such a huge number of votes for the GOP, and such small numbers for the democrats?

[BoredOutOfMyMind]

I do understand the electoral vote...but is that the same as the "delegates" in the primaries?

I think those are delegates in the Iowa Caucuses.

(Is that spelled right?)

I think it is the same thing, they all went to Des Moines and placed votes for their champions. Many people including Guiliani did not even go to Iowa.

[MissBrattified]

I think those are delegates in the Iowa Caucuses.

(Is that spelled right?)

I think it is the same thing, they all went to Des Moines and placed votes for their champions. Many people including Guiliani did not even go to Iowa.

Thanks Boomm, for at least TRYING to answer my questions, which obviously NO ONE ELSE in the forum even CARES to attempt. :sad:depressed:nobodycares:tissue:girlfriend

So maybe the delegate votes are the votes cast by congressmen?

[BoredOutOfMyMind]

Thanks Boomm, for at least TRYING to answer my questions, which obviously NO ONE ELSE in the forum even CARES to attempt. :sad:depressed:nobodycares:tissue:girlfriend

So maybe the delegate votes are the votes cast by congressmen?

No these are the delegate votes by those at the caucus or at the convention.

Legally, we SHOULD allow congress and the House to elect the President. The easiest way to make change was to remove the House every two years- since the HOUSE sets the rules of paying the bills. At some point the Imperial Presidency and the Supreme Courts instead upset this balance.

"Somebody's Gotta Say It" by Neal Boortz has interesting insight into how few even attempt to THINK about what matters today.

Also we have seen many not using more than The Fellowship Hall for subjects.

[James Griffin]

Thanks Boomm, for at least TRYING to answer my questions, which obviously NO ONE ELSE in the forum even CARES to attempt. :sad:depressed:nobodycares:tissue:girlfriend

So maybe the delegate votes are the votes cast by congressmen?

Very rarely in here....

No delegates are private citizens elected to their post within their party.

Think of primary- as mini-election at the party state level. Delegates of the party.

Think of election- as members of electoral college. More like delegates at large. As individuals they should cast there vote according to the neighborhood/area of the state where they live (according to national election results) regardless of their personal political association

Electoral- interesting thing. They are not really "bound" by the vote in their state but remarkably they do invariably complete their duty as they should

Hope this helps.

Or at least did not make it worse.

[drummerboy_dave]

Thanks Boomm, for at least TRYING to answer my questions, which obviously NO ONE ELSE in the forum even CARES to attempt. :sad:depressed:nobodycares:tissue:girlfriend

I know the feeling...

[MissBrattified]

Thanks, guys. I think I understand. :)

[embonpoint]

Question of the day: What/Who are delegates, what is their purpose, and do they matter? Are they congressmen? *confused*

Sorry if this is a silly question, but after looking it up online I can't really come up with a definitive answer. I noticed that on the election results yesterday, there was a column for "Delegates", and then score-keeping next to each candidate. (Some had 3 or 4, some had 0)

So....can someone educate me? :coffee2

Hopefully I can make this somewhat sensible.

Part of the problem may be that there is not a definitive answer.

What is currently happening is that the political parties in each state are selecting their delegates to the National Political Conventions. What makes it difficult to understand is that the process is influenced by the respective parties as well as the particular state.

States use caucuses or primaries to select their delegates to the national conventions. Iowa uses caucuses and NH uses primaries. In the caucuses, members of the political parties actually meet together at the precinct level to vote for whom they support. The delegates from each of these caucuses is forwarded on level by level until some of them are selected to attend the National convention. The dems in Iowa divide the delegates to the nat'l conv proportionate to the support each candidate received. So if they are sending a total of 10 delegates and Obama had 30% of the support at the caucuses, he would get 3 of the Iowa delegates at the Dem Nat'l Conv this summer. The reps in Iowa on the other hand have a winner take all policy, so if Huckabee got the most support he would get all 10 delegates to the Rep Nat'l Conv.

Other states like NH use primaries where voters actually go to polling places and cast votes for candidates of the respective parties which again determines delegates to the national conventions. Some winner take all and others divided proportionately. Some states allow independent voters to participate in one or the other major parties' votes while others restrict it to registered party members.

Confusing Huh? but the states are all using these various processes ultimately to select their delegates to the national political conventions. These delegates then will select the nominee for their respective party.

[MissBrattified]

It is confusing...but that was a very helpful answer, embonpoint. :)

[embonpoint]

Indicative of how confusing this process can be, is the current state of the Republican candidates. To date there have been caucuses in Iowa and Wyoming and a Primary in New Hampshire. Mitt Romney was declared a winner in the Wyoming caucuses which is the least populous of these three states, however he has more delegates committed to him for the national convention than either McCain or Huckabee who won in New Hampshire and Iowa.

[James Griffin]

A Primary Caucus Primer
By Nancy Salvato

While a great number of people do not see the value in the Electoral College
(And “W” Takes the Series), it is possible an even greater number of people
don’t fully comprehend how each political party selects their candidate for
president. During the Iowa Caucus, after I heard several people draw a blank
when asked to explain how a Caucus works, I decided it might be time to put
together a primer on the nominating process. The Republican and Democratic
political parties “officially nominate
their candidate for President at their respective national conventions, usually
held the summer before the election.” In order to win the nomination, a Democrat
must win 2,025 delegates out of 4,049 possible and a Republican must win 1,191
delegates out of 2,381 possible. Leading up to the national conventions, there
are a series of presidential caucuses and primary elections which take place
across the nation. Traditionally, this begins with the Iowa caucus, held in
early January of the
presidential election year, and is quickly followed by the New Hampshire
primary.“Most [Emphasis mine] of the delegates in each party are awarded based
upon election results in any given state.”

“Depending on state law and state party rules, when voters cast ballots for a
candidate in a presidential caucus or primary, they may be actually voting to
award delegates bound to vote for a candidate at the state or national
convention or may simply be expressing an opinion that the state party is not
bound to follow in selecting delegates to the national convention.” [Emphasis
mine]

Furthermore, “Not all of the delegates in either party are selected by voters in
primaries or caucuses. There are quite a few delegates that automatically go to
each convention. They might be a member of Congress, a governor, or even a party
official. They get automatic berths to the convention, and can vote for whomever
they choose. Already, some of those automatic delegates have pledged to the
candidate they support. But, they can also change their minds at any point for
any reason.”

The format of the presidential caucuses and primary elections varies between the
states.

Binding Primary
Nearly all states have a binding primary, in which the results of the election
legally bind some or all of the delegates to vote for a particular candidate at
the national convention, for a certain number of ballots or until the candidate
releases the delegates.

Non-Binding Primary
A handful of states practice a non-binding primary, which may select candidates
to a state convention which then selects delegates.

Closed Primary
In most states, only voters registered with a party may vote in that party’s
primary.

Semi-Closed Primary
Voters unaffiliated with a party (independents) may choose a party primary in
which to vote.

Blanket Primary
All registered voters can participate in all primaries.Presidential Preference
Primary (Direct)
The voter chooses the candidate by name from a list of candidates on the ballot.

Presidential Preference Primary (Indirect)
The voter chooses among delegate names rather than candidate names. Delegates
voice support for a particular candidate or remain uncommitted.

“In some states a combination of the primary and caucus systems are used. The
primary serves as a measure of public opinion but is not necessarily binding in
choosing delegates. Sometimes the Party does not recognize open primaries
because members of other parties are permitted to vote.”

Caucus
“Generally any voter registered with the party may attend. At the caucus,
delegates are chosen to represent the state’s interests at the national party
convention. Prospective delegates are identified as favorable to a specific
candidate or uncommitted. After discussion and debate an informal vote is taken
to determine which delegates should be chosen.”

Proportional Representation
Under Democratic Party selection rules, a candidate requires a minimum threshold
of 15% in a state in order to receive delegates.

Superdelegates
Superdelegates account for approximately one fifth (19.6%) of all votes at the
Democratic National Convention. These delegates (elected officeholders and party
officials) are not bound by the decisions of party primaries or caucuses. The
792 superdelegates include all Democratic members of the United States Congress,
various additional elected officials, as well as members of the Democratic
National Committee. The Republican Party does not have superdelegates, it has
463 unpledged delegates,
123 of whom are Republican National Committee members.

According to Brown University researchers Brian Knight and Nathan Schiff,
“voters in early primary states have up to 20 times the influence of voters in
later states in the selection of candidates.” Some states scheduled their
primaries early, in violation of the agreed upon date of February 5th for the
first primary, and for this they have been penalized. “The Democratic Party is
punishing Michigan and Florida by refusing to accept their delegates at the
national convention. The Republican
Party is penalizing Florida, Michigan, New Hampshire, South Carolina, and
Wyoming, by reducing their quota of delegates by half. BBC News Because of these
sanctions, these early primaries are sometimes referred to as “beauty contests”
because of their diminished impact on “the makeup of the state’s National
Convention delegation” however, they still exert great influence on the
candidates and voters. Regardless of who eventually wins the party nomination,
the primaries help to influence and
refine the candidates’ platforms as the process evolves. “In recent elections,
the Iowa caucuses and New Hampshire primary have garnered over half the national
and international media attention paid to the entire selection process.”

Professor Matthew Søberg Shugart explains in his Blog, Fruits and Votes, “there
are usually three or more “viable” candidates and several stragglers at the
start of the process, but by the end the race has narrowed to two major
contenders.” He is watching to see “whether the collapsed calendar means less
time for the shakeout towards 2+ candidates to occur, and thus potentially the
nomination of a non-consensus candidate.” This year’s Democratic National
Convention will be held in Denver,
Colorado, from August 25-28 at the downtown Pepsi Center. The Republican
National Convention will be held in Minneapolis-St. Paul, Minnesota, from
September 1-4 at the RiverCentre / Xcel Energy Center.

For More Information about the status of the candidates in the state primaries:

http://www.floridacounts.com/index.php?news=1588
http://innovation.cq.com/primaries
http://www.iowacaucus.org/iacaucus.html
http://politics.nytimes.com/election-guide/2008/primaries/democraticprimaries/index.html
http://www.cnn.com/ELECTION/2008/primaries/results/scorecard/#val=D

[MissBrattified]

Excellent article! Thanks for posting that.